Chances of both Daniels and Boatright returning next year??

[Alexander]

Like many have said already, I just don't want to see DD declare if he's not virtually guaranteed a first round selection. With that said, I find it hard to believe that he'd be promised a first round selection by a team given the range of consistent role players already ahead of him in the draft. Shabazz's draft placement will be a mystery to me until workouts and the draft itself. I can see him going as high as the early twenties. Hope he goes late twenties to the likes of the Spurs/Heat.

 

[tzznandrew]

Both Jones and Lamb are on a team that gives big minutes to a washed up Perk and Fisher. Great team but very little depth. Hard to believe they can't find more than 12mpg for a guy who was in the discussion of being a top pick that year.

My point on Flynn was that he showed absolutely no development. Even if he was never destined to be a star, he didn't show improvement in any area of his game.

And Alexander was a prime example of never being given the opportunity, do you not remember how he destroyed us in 09, and particularly, the scoring versatility he seemed to have?

About Alexander, I remember that. But just because you can do something in college but can't do it in the pros, doesn't mean you haven't actually improved. The talent jump is enormous, and most college players can't make the leap. Playing basketball all the time, and against the best, makes you better. Flynn just didn't have a skill-set that translates well to the pro level. Doesn't mean he didn't get better. The opposite happens all the time: think Michael Carter-Williams, or even someone like Rudy Gay. Sure, they got much better, but their skill set hampered them in college, and allowed them to blossom in the NBA.

Scott Brooks is a strange coach. I don't like his substitution patterns. But the fact that Lamb doesn't get minutes doesn't mean he didn't get better. He added a passing ability he never showed in college. He's going to be a good pro...the Thunder are just not giving him minutes because they seem to (in my eyes) over-value the "veteran leadership" of Fisher and Perkins.

 

[Husky25]

I'm not focused on anything in particular. I checked the mocks just to get a feel for where the "experts'" heads are. Bottom line for me is if Daniels or Boatright are not sure fire first rounders, I'd say return to school and entertain me in the process.

 

[tzznandrew]

I'm not focused on anything in particular. I checked the mocks just to get a feel for where the "experts'" heads are. Bottom line for me is if Daniels or Boatright are not sure fire first rounders, I'd say return to school and entertain me in the process.

Yeah. I largely agree. If you're likely to be in the Top 20, you should definitely go. If not, your best bet is to come back. I hate that Coach K got the deadlines pushed forward. It hampers students way too much, and forces them into more difficult draft decisions than there really needed to be.

 

[huskyharry]

There is a lot of truth on both sides of the argument listed above. It is harder to get drafted at a high position when you are older. DD's draft projection is likely bolstered by the team's success and his individual success in some of the games.
However, many here are blinded by prior UCONN players' success in the draft. There are only 30 slots in the first round and only 1st round selections get guaranteed contracts...pick #31 can be cut during training camp and get a minimal payment. Somewhere between 3 and 10 of those first round picks will go to players from overseas.
There are roughly 350 teams in Division 1. Beings selected as a first round pick is very rare.

It is certainly true that the NBA Draft sites can be inaccurate. However, currently, NONE of these sites show DD in the first round. It is widely reported that this year's draft has a higher quality of draftees than the typical draft and also has greater depth. Because of this, DD could play exactly the same next year and end up being drafted higher. In this context, if he improves his handle and plays more consistently, it appears very likely that he should move up.
If he were to receive a guarantee from an NBA team that he will be drafted in the 1st round (as Andrew Bynum did from the Lakers), then he should certainly go. But these types of guarantees are extremely rare for players who are borderline 1st to 2nd rounders (typically given to projected Lottery picks.

If he declares, I will root like heck for him to be selected in the first round and root like heck for him to make a roster if he doesn't. But, just making a roster is a far cry from being a 1st round pick and getting guaranteed $ for three years.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Not even sure how you can attempt to refute that. Whatever it takes to argue though, right?

It's cute that you think DD will be a 2nd round pick and get all this massive development time. How'd that ever work put for Price or Adrien?

Sad that people can't discuss things like this without getting chippy about it.

You're not responding to anything that I said. I didn't say a thing about DeAndre or the second round or anything like that. You said that NBA teams are too busy during the season - "3in4s" and whatever else - to spend time on player development. I know that to be 100% untrue so I said as much.

Your response was that the Spurs stash kids in Europe therefore I'm wrong. But you leave out the fact that they stash them in Europe to play professional basketball, not go to college.

 

[champs99and04]

IMO, neither the NBA nor college basketball is an ideal environment for the development of younger players (like Daniels). In college basketball, the drawbacks are obvious - practice time is restricted, facilities generally aren't as good, and on top of that, you have to devote a large portion of your time to maintaining a certain GPA that could otherwise be used to expand your game. Additionally, many of the less endearing qualities of the college game - the packed in zones, the over-coaching, the general lack of fluidity - aren't conducive to player development.

But let's also not act like the NBA is some sort of sanctuary of teaching. If you're Andrew Wiggins or Jabari Parker, you can rest assured that whoever franchise your drafted by is going to squeeze everything out of you. It is just too big an investment not to direct every conceivable resource into the development of that player. But what if you're Jeremy Lamb? Posters above have mentioned that he's developed, and that's true. But did he develop at the rate he would have had he stayed here? I don't think so. And that's precisely the problem a lot of young NBA players have - sometimes, the talent of their teammates is so extraordinary (Durant & Westbrook) that they're rendered specialists by the time they step on an NBA floor. I've watched the Thunder a lot the past couple years, and aside from a brief period in which Westbrook was injured, Lamb's basically been designated to the role of spot-up shooter. More problematic, he doesn't play enough to maximize his potential. If he were here, he'd be the focal point of the offense - and would thus enter the NBA with a more diverse skill set - that would have undoubtedly expanded his game under Ollie the same way he would have under Brooks. Andre Drummond is in a similar boat - with another year or two of college, he likely enters the league with a better post game.

Ideally, a legitimate minor league system would be developed (the D-League isn't it, at least right now) where the development of skills would be prioritized above everything else (including winning, which clearly isn't the case in the NBA or college basketball).

Don't get me wrong, the NBA is as entertaining a product as it has ever been. But when guys like Anthony Bennett #1 in the draft, and like clockwork, every year, somebody with strikingly raw skills enters the draft, it conveys one thing: a broken system. Either start paying college kids (which is probably a long way from happening) or adopt a system like that of the MLB or NHL.

How does this relate to Daniels? Well, if the kid is a first rounder, he should go - all else aside, it's guaranteed money that would set him for life if managed properly. But for the sake of his development, I think he'd be better served here next season than bouncing around the D-League.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

If you have watched Lamb play for the Thunder and think he hasn't developed you should pick a new sport.

You can pick a guy who hasn't developed and I can pick two who have. How bout Lamb's teammate Reggie Jackson.

Look, if you want to disagree with me on Daniels, that's fine. Don't sit here and try to pigeonhole me like I've ever said that nobody ever develops or improves in the NBA ever.

Also, the people arguing that Daniels stock is at it's peak due to winning the title are wrong. Winning the title garners more attention for the team, but it still comes down to the players performance and projectable skills.

Age is not a factor either, there have been plenty of 4 year players or otherwise old for their class players who have been picked highly through the years.

The case for Daniels going this year really boils down to whether you think he's actually a top 20 prospect RIGHT NOW. There isn't a shred of existing evidence that would suggest so. Now, if Ollie or Daniels or anyone else involved get a solid commitment that he will be, then he should go no question. However, if that turns out not to be the case, he needs to come back and put up a more consistent year on a team that will be tailored for him to do so. He also needs to at least TRY to add some muscle, as he doesn't really have an nba body right now.


If anyone wants go continue to argue whether the NBA develops as well as college, go ahead. There are dozens of cases to be made for either side and no definitive point to be made. Futhermore, it's irrelevant to the situation Daniels is in until he makes a decision whether to stay or declare. We can't even project where he'll be picked, how can any of us project how he will or won't develop?

Like I've said, I personally hope he comes back because I think it's the best chance for him to secure himself a long NBA career. If he decides to go I'll wish him the best and hope for the best.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

You're not responding to anything that I said. I didn't say a thing about DeAndre or the second round or anything like that. You said that NBA teams are too busy during the season - "3in4s" and whatever else - to spend time on player development. I know that to be 100% untrue so I said as much.

Your response was that the Spurs stash kids in Europe therefore I'm wrong. But you leave out the fact that they stash them in Europe to play professional basketball, not go to college.

And I brought up the fact that the Spurs keep prospects in Europe specifically because the spurs themselves feel like playera will develop more there than on their roster. Kind of point proven.

Not like you really said anything that needed to be responded to beyond just disagreeing anyways...

 

[Gurleyman]

And I brought up the fact that the Spurs keep prospects in Europe specifically because the spurs themselves feel like playera will develop more there than on their roster. Kind of point proven.

Not like you really said anything that needed to be responded to beyond just disagreeing anyways...

They stash players in Europe so they maintain their rights but don't have to pay them. They don't count against the cap, but if they develop and want to come to the NBA, they aren't free agents.

 

[Walker11]

I think often the guys who can develop the most in college are guys who perhaps lack confidence and need to grow mentally and emotionally. I completey agree that DD could raise his stock next year. I just think its stupid to think college develops players better than the NBA.

As for champs post, I think Lamb developed a ton in the D league. I watched him play there and he was running the point some and always the go to guy. I bet he developed there more than he would have at Uconn.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

If you have watched Lamb play for the Thunder and think he hasn't developed you should pick a new sport.

You can pick a guy who hasn't developed and I can pick two who have. How bout Lamb's teammate Reggie Jackson.

Both first round picks. Teams put a lot of money into first round picks, so they will be more patient and throw some coaching resources against those players. Second round players are on their own to a large extent. There is not a lot of money invested in their development, and if one doesn't make it, there are 20 more that will kill each other for the chance to step in.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

I think often the guys who can develop the most in college are guys who perhaps lack confidence and need to grow mentally and emotionally. I completey agree that DD could raise his stock next year. I just think its stupid to think college develops players better than the NBA.

As for champs post, I think Lamb developed a ton in the D league. I watched him play there and he was running the point some and always the go to guy. I bet he developed there more than he would have at Uconn.

Didn't watch his D league play but did he develop as much there as he did from his Fr-So year at UConn?

 

[johnhuskies95]

Not even sure how you can attempt to refute that. Whatever it takes to argue though, right?

It's cute that you think DD will be a 2nd round pick and get all this massive development time. How'd that ever work put for Price or Adrien?

Sad that people can't discuss things like this without getting chippy about it.

Adrien has been given playing time right now on the Bucks, and he's been playing very well.

Do you honestly think a guy like DeAndre Jordan would've been better off developing at Texas A&M as opposed to the Clippers?

 

[Walker11]

Didn't watch his D league play but did he develop as much there as he did from his Fr-So year at UConn?

From the beginning of Fr year to the end of sophomore year, definitely not. His jump was enormous. That said, I think a lot of that leap was dependent on him gaining the confidence and realizing how good he could be. This was a kid who didn't even start in high school til his sr year. I think him paired w Kemba was his perfect scenario.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

Adrien has been given playing time right now on the Bucks, and he's been playing very well.

Do you honestly think a guy like DeAndre Jordan would've been better off developing at Texas A&M as opposed to the Clippers?

Adrien doesn't really fit into this convo because he was who he was and even staying 4 years his height held him down when it came to draft stock.

Given how sparingly Deandre Jordan played his first couple of years I think ue may have been better staying. Even now he gets by on his physical skills rather than any discernable skill, especially offensively.

 

[Gurleyman]

There's a difference between being a sure fire first round pick and a guy with an unclear draft status. If you know you're a first rounder, you get a three-year deal and the team invests in your development, much greater than what you could get in college. If not, you could end up with any number of scenarios. Not making it at all, D League, maybe getting a one-year deal but the team doesn't really worry about developing you since you aren't in their long term plans.

If you know you're a first rounder and can't raise your stock much, it makes sense to go. It also makes sense if you just need to provide money for your family and would be happy making six figures in Europe if you don't stick in the NBA. A guy like Boone made the right choice going, even though his career was short. He went first round, got a guaranteed deal, made good money and has continued to make good money overseas. If he stayed, he might not have made it at all. Guys like Rip, Kemba and Caron went from late first round to lottery with an extra year.

 

[johnhuskies95]

Adrien doesn't really fit into this convo because he was who he was and even staying 4 years his height held him down when it came to draft stock.

Given how sparingly Deandre Jordan played his first couple of years I think ue may have been better staying. Even now he gets by on his physical skills rather than any discernable skill, especially offensively.

You were the one who brought up Adrien in the first place.

And exactly how would Jordan have gained more skill by staying in college? Would it have been due to the greater number of coaches? The superior facilities? The greater amount of practice time? The world class teammates and opponents? The greater amount of games?

 

[PcketknfNiels]

You were the one who brought up Adrien in the first place.

And exactly how would Jordan have gained more skill by staying in college? Would it have been due to the greater number of coaches? The superior facilities? The greater amount of practice time? The world class teammates and opponents? The greater amount of games?

Or maybe by playing 30+ minutes as opposed to 12 and being given more opportunity to work with the ball in college. What facilities are NBA teams using on road games that are better than what any college with a good athletic department has?

I brought up Adrien as someone who got drafted late and someone who took yeara to be given a chance.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The arguments on both sides are valid. I usually have a pretty strong opinion about early entrants from UConn, and I generally agree with Calhoun. I have a strong opinion on Boat, and I hope and think he will come back.

I am completely stumped by Daniels. I think his length, speed and skill make him a borderline first round pick, but I can't find a mock draft that agrees with me. I get all the arguments to go pro at his age, but you can't leave early unless you are guaranteed a shot at the 1st round. Hopefully Ollie has some good feedback for him by now.

 

[BlueMAB]

The difference in minutes on the court is scant compared to the amount of practice time you get in the pros, the lack of school responsibilities, the absence of limitations on practice and contact with coaches, and the fact you're playing against better competition in practice.

Each situation is different. Lamb had to go because of his stock, but may have developed quicker with another year in college. But if you're a lottery pick, you have to go. Butler had to go. Drummond had to go. Thabeet had to go. I don't know that there's been a coach who has gotten better information and given better advice to his NBA prospects than Jim Calhoun. I have full confidence in Ollie to do the same. He's too well liked, played for too many teams, and has too many contacts to not be able to get quality feedback from scouts/front offices.

Daniels isn't a lottery pick, obviously. He has first round talent, but that doesn't mean he'll be a first round pick. It's a risk/reward. The way I see it, another year of college can only help him. His stock isn't going to get lower, only higher. God forbid he gets injured, he should be on the path to graduating and will have a degree to fall back on. He'll be an all-star in any league not named the NBA whether he comes out now or next year, but another year could get him that guaranteed contract and a couple million dollars.

Whatever he decides, I'll be a fan for live after he helped bring home #4.

 

[auror]

For everyone saying Daniels isn't on any mocks, that's not totally accurate. I'd quote, but seems like every other poster is saying it.

DraftExpress doesn't list him for 2014 because he thinks it's more likely Daniels will stay and get drafted in 2015. He's in the (late) first round of the 2015 mock. That site is setup to be mutually exclusive for the mocks, so he doesn't list people in both... but it doesn't mean he wouldn't make the 1st or 2nd round of the 2014 mock. He's listed #32 in DraftExpress' top 100 prospects, so he could be a late first-rounder in the 2014 mock if a couple people withdraw.

As for ESPN, Chad Ford has him at #39 on his big board, which would translate to the 9th pick in the 2nd round if his mock did both rounds.

Seems likely he'd be a bubble first-rounder considering his placement in these mocks plus an upward momentum from the tournament. The tough decision is plain for anyone to see. Anyone who says he'd be an idiot either to go or to stay is precisely that.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

The difference in minutes on the court is scant compared to the amount of practice time you get in the pros, the lack of school responsibilities, the absence of limitations on practice and contact with coaches, and the fact you're playing against better competition in practice.

Teams don't practice much in season due to the logjam of games and all the travel. That's before factoring in the amount these guys go clubbing or any promotional/charitable work these guys do.

 

[J187Money]

I just check 6 separate Mock drafts. Granted that 3 of them were CBS's and haven't been updated in 3 weeks, but Daniels was not to found in any of them, even the ones that predicted both rounds. Daniels has to declare by the 27th, so we will know within 2 weeks. Tomorrow is the deadline to return to school if the player has already declared.

Exactly. What we think doesn't matter. I'm all for him going but the guys that project this stuff for a living don't have him going in a place that makes sense for him to leave.

 

[nyc2014]

I have a question I posted before but no one answered, with Daniels I am torn whether he goes or stays and can see it going either way, with Boatright is him going even a realistic option. Other than these message boards has anyone seen rumors / talks / mock drafts with Boatright on it? As a 5'11 guard who was second in command this year, I'm not sure him going this year is even worth discussing. Have people heard / read otherwise other than these message boards?