WNBA -- 2023 Season

[cancontent]

Awesome.

Two Questions

Is this sustainable

Can the challenges and complexities of competing regularly in Canada to be addressed

Good questions.

1). I believe it is, primarily because of the organization who would likely own the team, Maple Leafs Sports & Entertainment. They own several teams including the Leafs and Raptors, along with lesser known teams like Toronto FC and the CFL's Argonauts. They've shown that they're willing to invest in their teams and continue to be profitable.

The other part to sustainability is the fan base. Technically, theirs would be larger than most teams because they'd be considered "Canada's team", like the Blue Jays and Raptors. Leveraging a country for fans increases their odds. Not to mention MLSE does really well with box sets and season ticket sales.

2). The challenges of playing in Canada would primarily be travel because of flights. How to get around that, will continue to be a question unless they're willing to invest in direct flights and avoid stopovers. Places like Chicago, DC, Indiana, Atlanta, Connecticut and New York may not be a problem. Locations like LA, Seattle, Pheonix and Dallas, not so sure.

 

[GamecockFam]

I have to say that trying to get into the WNBA is entirely frustrating. I've primarily been a WCBB fan but with the South Carolina freshies moving on, I wanted to follow their progress in the WNBA. I've been entirely confused on how to watch the preseason games -- or even find highlights.

I assume this is a preseason issue that will resolve when the season starts? No highlights to be found on YouTube, the scores are buried on the ESPN app, and it is hard to figure out where to watch the games, if they're even on TV at all...

I am a WCBB fan, so I will endure these issues while trying to get into the WNBA, but I feel these issues of access and visibility probably thwart any casual attempts to get into the WNBA. They really need to make sure that WNBA content is just as accessible as their competition because they won't gain fans if they don't have the lowest hanging fruit... I already feel myself getting frustrated to the point of giving up, but I told myself I'll wait for the regular season.

 

[cancontent]

 

[hoopsnloops32]

I have to say that trying to get into the WNBA is entirely frustrating. I've primarily been a WCBB fan but with the South Carolina freshies moving on, I wanted to follow their progress in the WNBA. I've been entirely confused on how to watch the preseason games -- or even find highlights.

I assume this is a preseason issue that will resolve when the season starts? No highlights to be found on YouTube, the scores are buried on the ESPN app, and it is hard to figure out where to watch the games, if they're even on TV at all...

I am a WCBB fan, so I will endure these issues while trying to get into the WNBA, but I feel these issues of access and visibility probably thwart any casual attempts to get into the WNBA. They really need to make sure that WNBA content is just as accessible as their competition because they won't gain fans if they don't have the lowest hanging fruit... I already feel myself getting frustrated to the point of giving up, but I told myself I'll wait for the regular season.

Spoiler alert: is still difficult during the regular season. Not quiet as bad still hard to find when or if a game is being broadcast and you have to have so many different streaming services since they are on across Meta, Amazon, ESPN, local affiliates etc etc.

 

[BullDawg]

Very sorry that Tsineke was waived, but knew it was unlikely for a rookie guard to make the roster.

 

[Reypl21]

I have to say that trying to get into the WNBA is entirely frustrating. I've primarily been a WCBB fan but with the South Carolina freshies moving on, I wanted to follow their progress in the WNBA. I've been entirely confused on how to watch the preseason games -- or even find highlights.

I assume this is a preseason issue that will resolve when the season starts? No highlights to be found on YouTube, the scores are buried on the ESPN app, and it is hard to figure out where to watch the games, if they're even on TV at all...

I am a WCBB fan, so I will endure these issues while trying to get into the WNBA, but I feel these issues of access and visibility probably thwart any casual attempts to get into the WNBA. They really need to make sure that WNBA content is just as accessible as their competition because they won't gain fans if they don't have the lowest hanging fruit... I already feel myself getting frustrated to the point of giving up, but I told myself I'll wait for the regular season.

It's hard. I paid for the League Pass last year and barely watched any games. I changed banks last year so changed cards, and I got an email saying my subscription failed. I didn't realize it was automatic, thank God because I am not buying it again.

If it isn't on TV, I just wait for the highlights to come out on the W's YouTube page. They have gotten a lot better over the years on there.

 

[azfan]

However, with the input that franchises that New York or Las Vegas are putting into personnel (both players, coaches and facilities), I've got to think we'll start seeing this.

As a fan, I hope so. My heart is firmly with all who hope for expansion in WNBA and greater recognition for this sport overall at all levels.

My head, for what it's worth, is not optimistic and skeptical.

The Harris group just paid $6 billion dollars for the Commanders. This a franchise that Dan Snyder did everything to destroy. If you look at the textbook on what to do to alienate fans, incentivize incompetence, hire sycophants, and lose lose Dan Schneider has his picture there alongside the malpractice he performed on the Commanders.

And yet 6 billion dollars. Back in 1990s Snyder paid under a billion for a very successful franchise one that won three super bowls had a huge waiting list for season tickets and was beloved and almost a nationwide franchise.

Everything Snyder did to this team and still get 6 billion.

This is capital appreciation and the Harris group knows what they're doing. The value of NFL franchises will continue to appreciate making this an outstanding investment. And deep pocketed investors will wait for this kind of opportunity.

So for 10% of the sale price of the Commanders the WNBA could expand by 2 to 6 teams and ensure stability over the near term for the league.

There are a plethora of very smart businesswomen and businessmen who recognize capital appreciation when they see it when they do they invest.

When they don't they don't.

Therein lies the reason for limited expansion in the WNBA. Sad, but true.

In a bizarro world in which I was rich I would hope my heart would guide my investment decision but I suspect ultimately it would be my head.

If pickleball franchises continue to appreciate and WNBA franchises don't it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know which League will expand.

 

[baggerbob]

As a fan, I hope so. My heart is firmly with all who hope for expansion in WNBA and greater recognition for this sport overall at all levels.

My head, for what it's worth, is not optimistic and skeptical.

The Harris group just paid $6 billion dollars for the Commanders. This a franchise that Dan Snyder did everything to destroy. If you look at the textbook on what to do to alienate fans, incentivize incompetence, hire sycophants, and lose lose Dan Schneider has his picture there alongside the malpractice he performed on the Commanders.

And yet 6 billion dollars. Back in 1990s Snyder paid under a billion for a very successful franchise one that won three super bowls had a huge waiting list for season tickets and was beloved and almost a nationwide franchise.

Everything Snyder did to this team and still get 6 billion.

This is capital appreciation and the Harris group knows what they're doing. The value of NFL franchises will continue to appreciate making this an outstanding investment. And deep pocketed investors will wait for this kind of opportunity.

So for 10% of the sale price of the Commanders the WNBA could expand by 2 to 6 teams and ensure stability over the near term for the league.

There are a plethora of very smart businesswomen and businessmen who recognize capital appreciation when they see it when they do they invest.

When they don't they don't.

Therein lies the reason for limited expansion in the WNBA. Sad, but true.

In a bizarro world in which I was rich I would hope my heart would guide my investment decision but I suspect ultimately it would be my head.

If pickleball franchises continue to appreciate and WNBA franchises don't it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know which League will expand.

Look two millioneers put money into Las Vegas, and New York.
So someone feels there is a value in the WNBA.

 

[azfan]

Look two millioneers put money into Las Vegas, and New York.
So someone feels there is a value in the WNBA.

Just not enough "someone's".

Sooooooo

We all remember when the Atlanta Dream were sold as a consequence of the Kelly Loeffler fiasco. I ask you to think about the Daniel Snyder fiasco as you read on.

The league refused to disclose the sales price but estimates were between 10 and 11 million dollars. Wow! Renee Montgomery and her posse must have got a great deal. Especially since the Seattle Storm "estimate" the value of their franchise at $141 million.

Obviously these two things cannot exist at the same time. If you do think they can DM me privately as I have a bridge here in Arizona you might be interested in buying.

There is a reason the WNBA refuses to disclose the sales price of the Dream. And it's definitely not because the franchise is worth in 141 million dollar range.

Investors in sports franchises appreciate appreciation.

 

[Rooster C.]

I would like to see the WNBA expand but money is most definitely an issue. I was a multi-year season ticket holder at a former WNBA franchise and many of those former locations had a decent sized very loyal fan base of 3k to 5k season ticket holders and about 2k - 3k additional fans at many games. The WNBA failed to transition to smaller venues and build on the groundwork that was laid. They also (to this day) do a terrible job of marketing overall.

Several of the former franchises routinely ranked in the top 4 in attendance at the time they disappeared. Charlotte, Cleveland, Houston, Sacramento, Portland, Orlando and Miami all had time to plan for their future without the NBA's support but failed to do so. Others - like Tulsa and San Antonio - ended up moving elsewhere. They need to take better care of the few big market teams they have like L.A. for starters.

The break for the Olympics every four years is another thing that works against them. They could and should approach that as a marketing opportunity for current and future stars as well as shining a light on many of the lesser known but very talented international stars.

Finally, the media coverage is probably the thing that hurts them the most. At times it's nearly impossible to find a live game to watch especially without having to spend money to do so. The promotion is terrible. I heard more here about the game in Canada than I did anywhere else. Unless and until the league addresses all of the above issues I just don't see it working out. The excitement of adding a couple of new franchises will be offset more than likely with the failure of a couple of existing ones. I hope I'm wrong but I think I'm not.

 

[GCKSFN4L]

Aliyah Boston played 18 mins, 8 pts, 6 fouls as IND 90 - DAL 83. WNBA will not let Boston to go away with fouls like she was in the college basketball....

I don't know if that the case or moreso of her playing against a bigger more physical player than her. She got a dose of what she normally does to smaller players. Battling with a bigger and more physical player often leads to the smaller player fighting to compete for position and eventually foul.

She'll do fine, she didn't back down to the challenge and as the game progressed she found better ways to be effective against her size and even got some foul calls in her favor. Teaira is a tough guard for an established veteran let alone a rookie.

 

[cancontent]

It's hard. I paid for the League Pass last year and barely watched any games. I changed banks last year so changed cards, and I got an email saying my subscription failed. I didn't realize it was automatic, thank God because I am not buying it again.

If it isn't on TV, I just wait for the highlights to come out on the W's YouTube page. They have gotten a lot better over the years on there.

The WNBA has made a deal with several networks to get games on TV that expands coverage. Can't recall all of the networks, but I saw the CBS is involved this year which I don't think was the case last season. Let's hope the trend continues.

 

[Dillon77]

May 14, 2023​

Seattle: Williams, Madi – Waivers Cleared
Chicago: Evans, Dana – Team Option Exercised
Minnesota: Dodson, Maya – Waived
Minnesota: Selland, Myah – Waived
Chicago: Baker, Angel – Waived
Washington: Jones, Stephanie – Waived
Washington: Tsineke, Elena – Waived

 

[Bigboote]

League Pass is $26, and you can watch games any time (except I can’t watch the Mystics live even if their game isn’t being broadcast locally). I didn’t watch that many games last year, but I still think it’s worth it.

 

[maccca3232]

For those that have WNBA League Pass they have replays of the Sky vs Lynx and Wings vs Fever 2023 pre-season games.

You need to click on the individual team and it will be first game shown under '2022 season'.

 

[jdote33]

Very tough. Sometimes I even feel conflicted about the rookies being promoted when a lot won't make the team. I mean I feel bad for them as it almost seems like they are exploited. Like Indiana and Grace Berger. What if she doesn't make the team. But the day after she got drafted they were selling jerseys.

Like is Brea Beal going to be in Minnesota next week. And I'm a fan of Beal, I'm just saying.

https://twitter.com/minnesotalynx/status/1656360328349769729?s=20

 

[ochoopsfan]

Closed scrimmage between the Sparks and Storm(at LMU)
Sparks up 31-30 at the half.
Nurse has 7 points
Rebounding Samuelson has 3 pts, 1 rebound, 1 assist and 1 steal, and a +8

 

[ochoopsfan]

Final scrimmage score Storm 76 Sparks 69

Karlie led the Sparks with 11 points
Guirantes led the Storm with 13 points

I hope Karlie makes the Sparks, I believe final cuts are Monday

 

[azfan]

Final scrimmage score Storm 76 Sparks 69

Karlie led the Sparks with 11 points
Guirantes led the Storm with 13 points

I hope Karlie makes the Sparks, I believe final cuts are Monday

Weird looking at Storm scorecard w/o Steward and Bird!

 

[cancontent]

 

[cancontent]

There are a number of challenges for American citizens playing or investing in Canada. While travel is a significant challenge I think most participants would focus on pay differentials due to the high taxation policy of our neighbors to the north. Given the relatively high tax rates in Canada this disincentives both potential owners and certainly players.

1. Tax burden. Comparing Canada's relatively high income tax rates which are imposed on visiting athletes to lower tax rates and zero tax rates in many states in the United States create a disincentive for athletes to either play in Canada or be based in Canada.

"The difference in tax rates between Canada + province versus US + state income taxes make big difference. For example, an NBA player playing for the Toronto Raptors would pay Canadian and Ontario income taxes, which are much higher than, say someone playing for the Dallas Mavericks. Not only the income taxes higher, but the Canadian tax law also prohibits deducting employment expenses, such as agent fees.

Raptors players pay about 2/3 of their income in Canadian rates (home games and stays in Toronto during the season)."

Do American Pro athletes have a financial disadvantage playing sports in Canada?

Answer (1 of 3): Yes. The difference in tax rates between Canada + province versus US + state income taxes make big difference. For example, an NBA player playing for the Toronto Raptors would pay Canadian and Ontario income taxes, which are much higher than, say someone playing for the Dallas Ma...

www.quora.com

"Toronto is now the worst place to play in the NBA, with a gap of approximately 4% between teams with home games in cities with no state or city tax. "

No Longer a Myth – American Athletes Pay More in Toronto - Income Tax - Canada

It's the time of year when we exchange dreams of wearing the uniform of our cherished Maple Leafs or Raptors, to dreams of wearing a suit and making big financial and personnel decisions for the teams. If you're like me, you have read all the rumours and speculate who we will trade for and who...

www.mondaq.com

2. The continuing problem of flying commercial versus charter will be exacerbated with Canadian teams. Ownership of that Canadian team given current WNBA policy will have as you point out significantly more complexity in travel and certainly appreciably higher travel costs.

I hear you regarding taxes and investments. If MLSE is the group who ends up owning the franchise, that helps to negate the issues of investment as they're a Canadian group and have the experience to deal with these challenges.

Playing in Canada hasn't scared off quality NBA or NHL players from making Toronto their home. In some cases, their contracts are paid in USD to help deal with some of those challenges as well.

It's not easy, but it's possible. Only time will tell in the end.

 

[BRS24]

Dallas Wings have waived Abby Meyers.

 

[Dillon77]

On one hand, a slightly raised eyebrow that such a good talent (first-round material) got cut pretty early.

On the other, one could've seen this coming. Dallas GM Greg Bibb is known for focusing on a position and then bringing in players. And more players. Maybe even more! Marina Mabrey and Alisha Gray leave and in comes Diamond DeShields to join Arike Ogunbowale and Jasmine Dickey.

So Bibb drafts Lou Lopez Senechal, Abby Meyers and Ashley Joens. Meyers got five minutes in the first game and 1+ in the second. Dickey and Joens pretty much the same. Lou, of course, is out with an injury. On top of this, they've moved Satou Sabally to the wing (at least for now).

Who knows? Might be a blessing in disguise for Meyers to find another team that needs a smart, accurate scorer. On the other hand, just so many slots ....

 

[BRS24]

On one hand, a slightly raised eyebrow that such a good talent (first-round material) got cut pretty early.

On the other, one could've seen this coming. Dallas GM is known for focusing on a position and then bringing in players. And more players. Maybe even more! Marina Mabrey and Alisha Gray leave and in come Diamond DeShields to join Arike Ogunbowale and Jasmine Dickey.
So he drafts Lou Lopez Senechal, Abby Meyers and Ashley Joens. Meyers got five minutes in the first game and 1+ in the second. Dickey and Joens pretty much the same. Lou, of course, is out with an injury. On top of this, they've moved Satou Sabally to the wing (at least for now).

Who knows? Might be a blessing in disguise for Meyers to find another team that needs a smart, accurate scorer. On the other hand, just so many slots ....

In my limited knowledge of WCBB and the WNBA, I view Meyers and Westbrook in a similar vein - smart, older players, came into a program and immediately melded into the team, providing some leadership, maturity, and a few other nuts/bolts to help the teams win.

On edit, Lou LS also.

 

[cancontent]

A decent start for national TV coverage for the season.