Colorado in Big XII

[tzznandrew]

We should have a thread with a do over draft and figure out which current P5s would be left hanging.

I mean, there are some clear ones that would be out: Wake being most prominent I think. It's a good but small school only in the ACC because of history. Every other school—even the Vandys, Northwesterns, and BCs makes some sense. Even ****ing Louisville makes some sense. They might not be in a P5 in a current redraft, but there is logic for them being there.

Wake, on the other hand...

 

[ZooCougar]

I mean, there are some clear ones that would be out: Wake being most prominent I think. It's a good but small school only in the ACC because of history. Every other school—even the Vandys, Northwesterns, and BCs makes some sense. Even ****ing Louisville makes some sense. They might not be in a P5 in a current redraft, but there is logic for them being there.

Wake, on the other hand...

“THE NEC WELCOMES BC TO THE CONFERENCE!!!!!”

 

[hoopsfan22]

We should have a thread with a do over draft and figure out which current P5s would be left hanging.

70% of them.

 

[ctchamps]

I mean, there are some clear ones that would be out: Wake being most prominent I think. It's a good but small school only in the ACC because of history. Every other school—even the Vandys, Northwesterns, and BCs makes some sense. Even ****ing Louisville makes some sense. They might not be in a P5 in a current redraft, but there is logic for them being there.

Wake, on the other hand...

I thought Vanderbilt in the SEC and Northwestern in the BIG were primarily included to prevent the types of investigations of those conferences if there were only public universities in a conference.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I thought Vanderbilt in the SEC and Northwestern in the BIG were primarily included to prevent the types of investigations of those conferences if there were only public universities in a conference.

The two schools you mentioned were members of their respective conferences long before the idea of needing schools for the purpose you mentioned ever existed.

 

[noeynox]

I think it’s dumb to give that much credit over ancient history. Ty Detmer must be in his 50s. Plus BYU routinely has like 24 year old sophomores or something like that.

Utah is the better program.

Eh, i think an argument could be made that BYU ONLY fell off cause they were excluded from the original BCS. UConn fans better than most should understand what huge downgrade that is.

 

[dayooper]

I thought Vanderbilt in the SEC and Northwestern in the BIG were primarily included to prevent the types of investigations of those conferences if there were only public universities in a conference.

Northwestern was a founding member of the Big10 (formed in 1896), a little before the need to avoid FOIA. Since USC is a private university, there will be 2 private schools in the Big10 (if you don’t count affiliate members Johns Hopkins and Notre Dame).

 

[NE Football]

BC is only attractive because of their location and nothing else. They have no interest in actually winning anything other than hockey championships.

 

[Rich]

i believe this as well, but i do wonder how much runway he has personally, to continue this difficult work as an independent. The good thing is that this is pretty much a zero-pressure job for him. We're grateful for whatever comes out of this turnaround, given where we are and where we're coming from. He would have a much shorter leash, pretty much anywhere else in the country. And at his age, why willingly put yourself through that stress? you have nothing to prove to anyone.

my other concern was $$ for staff - not even for him. i suspect he's good on the money, so that's not his personal driver. But you can't say the same for coordinators and younger staff, who are fresh up/comers for whom money is a massive driver. P5 money answered that concern for recruiting coaching talent. Retaining is not so much a concern, because assistant coaches come and go for career reasons. But it's the NEXT guy who you need to worry about convincing. So - indirectly, $$ matters to him, albeit not for personal gain.

what a complicated equation.

all that to say, I agree deep down that he's a keeper. but you never know.

So long as the school keeps investing in the program he'll be down for whatever, as the kids say.

What I do wonder about though is if we end up taking the B12 cheese, how will he handle the step up in recruiting and will UCONN adequately support that level of pursuit? That's all for another day though.

 

[tzznandrew]

Eh, i think an argument could be made that BYU ONLY fell off cause they were excluded from the original BCS. UConn fans better than most should understand what huge downgrade that is.

didn't they suspend an important basketball player for having consensual sex with his girlfriend? I feel like that sort of thing probably doesn't help...

 

[noeynox]

didn't they suspend an important basketball player for having consensual sex with his girlfriend? I feel like that sort of thing probably doesn't help...

Sounds right, but their customs or beliefs i.e honor code is what it is. Penn State had pedophile on campus for years. Baylor looked the other way on sex assaults. Far worse things have been overlooked.

 

[Patman]

didn't they suspend an important basketball player for having consensual sex with his girlfriend? I feel like that sort of thing probably doesn't help...

help with what? I'm sorry that don't follow your rules.

 

[djct1999]

For the Big 12, I think it comes down to ASU, Arizona, Utah and UConn for 1 or 3 spots. Pros and cons:

UConn:

Pros:

Athletics - best basketball program of the last 25 years, best women's basketball program in history, solid to excellent in almost all other sports.
Market - Large (3.5 million) wealthy market that extends beyond Connecticut borders
Local competition for eyeballs: UConn's fanbase extends beyond UConn alumni since UConn is the only state school with big time athletics in New York/New England. Connecticut will never have a major professional franchise in any of the three major sports, so there is limited local competition for sports entertainment dollars.
Academics - UConn is way ahead of the rest of the candidates academically.
Wildcard - Proximity to the media and financial capital of the world. Not taking UConn is writing off the northeast for the Big 12, forever.

Cons:

Athletics - Football team was competitive when it was in a major conference, but has sucked the last 10 years or so.
Market - state is not growing and is aging.
Wildcard - distance to other schools

Arizona:

Pros:

Athletics - Basketball is pretty good, but by no means dominant. No natural recruiting base for hoops now that UCLA and USC are in Big 10.
Market - Tucson is not that big, although it is fast growing.
Academics - Arizona is not top 100 academically.
Wildcard - Arizona is "hot" both literally and figuratively

Cons:

Athletics - Football sucks and has had some good coaches that were unable to win in Arizona. Heat may be a problem for recruiting.
Market - Arizona is getting close to the limit of human inhabitability in terms of heat, and is running out of water. Those are not opinions, they are facts. It is not a wealthy state (one of 10 poorest in country), making it less appealing to advertisers and creating uncertainty about how many people would pay for streaming. There are also a lot of the residents that are old transplants who already have a favorite team and are unlikely to switch.
Local Competition - Successful pro franchises two hours away in all three major sports.
Wildcard - Already being in a P5 conference seems to carry some weight

Arizona State

Pros:

Athletics - There is a picture of the Arizona State logo next to "above average" in the dictionary. They are OK in hoops and football, but not particularly exceptional in either, going back decades.
Market - Phoenix is one of the biggest (4.4MM) and fastest growing metro areas in the country, although environmental issues (heat and water) may be changing that. Maricopa county is massive geographically, about 2.5x the size of Connecticut geographically. Going to an Arizona State basketball game is not like driving from Fairfield to the XL Center.
Wildcard - Already being in a P5 conference seems to carry some weight

Cons:

Athletics - mediocre
Market - same issues as Arizona, and two schools are splitting the market
Local Competition - Successful pro franchises in all three major sports.

Utah:

Pros:

Athletics - Football is excellent, although it is hard to tell how much of that is Utah and how much is Kyle Whittingham.
Market - Market is not huge at 3.27 million in the whole state of Utah. It is a fast growing state.
Local Competition - successful local NBA team, but no NFL or MLB franchises
Academics - OK in STEM, below average in everything else. Barely top 100.
Wildcard - Already being in a P5 conference seems to carry some weight

Cons:

Athletics - Basketball has kind of sucked since Majerus left, which raises issues about what happens after Whittingham.
Market - Not a rich market, and BYU will always be the #1 option in this state.



When you spreadsheet it, UConn should win on almost every dimension but the fact that we are not already in a P5 conference.

This is your lane! Great stuff!

 

[tzznandrew]

Sounds right, but their customs or beliefs i.e honor code is what it is. Penn State had pedophile on campus for years. Baylor looked the other way on sex assaults. Far worse things have been overlooked.

help with what? I'm sorry that don't follow your rules.

I'd suggest that it's probably harder to recruit when the university doesn't let you freely sleep with your partner. The other schools can blame it on a coach that is gone and say it won't happen again. For BYU, if you go to the school right now, and you are caught violating their honor code (i.e. freely having consensual sex) you may be off the team.

If you have a few offers that are roughly equal, why the hell would you do that?

 

[Dizzy21]

I'd suggest that it's probably harder to recruit when the university doesn't let you freely sleep with your partner. The other schools can blame it on a coach that is gone and say it won't happen again. For BYU, if you go to the school right now, and you are caught violating their honor code (i.e. freely having consensual sex) you may be off the team.

If you have a few offers that are roughly equal, why the hell would you do that?

The code hasn't changed though, so how would that be part of their downfall?

 

[Patman]

I'd suggest that it's probably harder to recruit when the university doesn't let you freely sleep with your partner. The other schools can blame it on a coach that is gone and say it won't happen again. For BYU, if you go to the school right now, and you are caught violating their honor code (i.e. freely having consensual sex) you may be off the team.

If you have a few offers that are roughly equal, why the hell would you do that?

you talk like this is a new issue

 

[WestCoastHusky]

Looks like Arizona is ready to go.

Arizona can (and should) put the final nail in the Pac-12's coffin

If the Big 12 wants us, why say no?

www.azdesertswarm.com

 

[nelsonmuntz]

So, in other words you just made it up based on nothing.

Got it.

In other words, you are just trolling me to try to get me to repeat something I have already posted which you are actually responding to.

UConn is not in the ACC because a small private school in Boston promised it would deliver all of New England. Then the ACC doubled down on that ridiculous assertion by adding a mid-sized private school from a dead industrial city in central New York with the hope it would bring New York City.

As overly optimistic as the expectation that BCU could deliver New England or that Syracuse could deliver New York are (and therefore UConn would not be necessary for the ACC), it is a valid way to look at the incremental value of a school. If the Big 12 just added the Utah market by adding BYU, how many incremental fans does it get in Utah that it doesn't already get with BYU? If the Big 12 gets the state of Arizona by adding U of A, how many incremental fans does it get by adding ASU? UConn is a market that the Big 12 is nowhere near, and we get attention throughout the northeast. Even if we have to fight it out with two weak programs like BCU and Syracuse for fans, we are fighting it out over a massive northeastern market. If Utah is fighting it out with BYU over the Utah market, the market is not that big, and the Big 12 would be fighting with itself for share.

Did anyone at UConn study competitive strategy or Game Theory? I skipped a lot of classes, but I am pretty sure I was not the only one in the hall at Monteith when the professor went over how to evaluate competitive positioning.

 

[billybud]

With both ESPN and later the the ACCN, Cuse brought in in-state carriage for NY and BC brought in the populous Massachusetts

 

[nelsonmuntz]

With both ESPN and later the the ACCN, Cuse brought in in-state carriage for NY and BC brought in the populous Massachusetts

ESPN wasn't already on cable boxes in New York and New England before adding those two? The ACCN did not come until years after BCU was already in the league. I don't remember when it showed up relative to Syracuse, but it was at roughly the same time, and the incremental carriage fees for the ACCN had nothing to do with ESPN financing the second raid of the Big East. That raid was about ESPN having a tantrum when it looked like the Big East might get a TV contract with another network.

That decision, like every strategic decision ESPN has made with college athletics over the last 20+ years, might have had some logic to it, but has backfired badly. All ESPN has done is make its competitors stronger, which has in turn increased its own costs for the remaining conferences it still has.

 

[billybud]

ESPN was on cable boxes...but the "in footprint premium" came into play with Syracuse and Massachusetts...the conference made more money. The carriage charge for carrying outside footprint is one half of that inside footprint states.

 

[BigTenFan]

Karma now with ESPN. I remember people saying that ESPN was integral to sports at all levels. I had a friend in sales at the network who would go fly around the country selling the network to cable franchises. He had a great job because every cable network 'had' to have ESPN. They were like Coca Cola

As we all know- things change. ESPN did a lot of great and innovative things for sports- especially College sports. However, they forgot about their core customer along the way. I think college AD's need to think what's best for their core customers and alumni when making realignment decisions - for UConn there really is only one decision...go for the Big 12

 

[upstater]

With both ESPN and later the the ACCN, Cuse brought in in-state carriage for NY and BC brought in the populous Massachusetts

????

My cable company in NY doesn't even carry ACCN

ESPN2 showed rodeo and preempted a BC football game. In Boston!!!!

 

[HuskyHawk]

????

My cable company in NY doesn't even carry ACCN

ESPN2 showed rodeo and preempted a BC football game. In Boston!!!!

ESPN 2 does not have a separate local feed for Boston. They were probably contractually obligated to air the rodeo in full. It has nothing to do with BC.

 

[upstater]

ESPN 2 does not have a separate local feed for Boston. They were probably contractually obligated to air the rodeo in full. It has nothing to do with BC.

Whatever happened, ESPN2 had BC football scheduled at that time on that day. That's what lead to the article and the uproar. People tuned in.