New Mexico State & Liberty Model - what can we learn?

[DMTCYNAW]

A lot of NMSU talk on here...as an alum I approve.

Jerry Kill when he was hired, made a list of improvements that needed to be done to be considered a legit FBS program. That included a new locker room, field turf for practice field, new cooling system for the locker room/coaches offices, new scoreboard, and wanted a couple of parking lots paved. Now, almost all of these things UConn already has and are probably still better than NMSU put out there The boosters stepped up in a big way to make most of this happen, the parking lot hasn't been paved yet but still is in the works.

Kill brought with him a bunch of guys who were assistants or grad assistants from TCU. Also brought in a former player, David Cobb to help out. In terms of salary, I have no doubt Mora and all of his assistants are paid way more than NMSU coaches (obviously cost of living is significant cheaper in Las Cruces.)

What I have seen in the two years we had Kill was that he had an unbelievable eye for talent, he also knew what type of player was needed for his program. He brought in some P5 guys like Andre Seldon (Michigan), Eli Stowers Texas A+M (QB to WR), Monte Watkins (TCU), He also found some FCS guys who fit the mold of what he was looking for.

He really hit the junior colleges hard, focusing on the power houses like Independence and Iowa Western. The programs in the midwest/south that churn out a good amount of FBS level players. (I feel like these guys may not get into UConn for academic reasons, NMSU is much easier to get into and they also utilize Dona Ana community college which is apart of the campus to help get guys qualified.)

I cannot speak to NIL, I know NMSU has the A Mountain Collective and that is comprised of about 15-20 local businesses and donors. They were able to get enough money to secure Trent Hudson (who I think was going to come to UConn.)

It is hard to recruit to Las Cruces, it is a beautiful college town and the weather are big selling points but the closet major city is El Paso and well, that's not going to get a lot of people to commit.

This year's NMSU team was the best I've ever seen. It is evident that Kill had a great eye for talent and for coaches. The offensive cordnitaor and defensive back coach are both off to Vanderbuit. The guys who have enterered the portal are getting some big offers, our second string QB went to Vandy, Andre Seldon is getting offers to Wisconsin and Texas A+M, Keyshaun Elliot is off to ASU. We are after Myles Rowser (would be huge but doubt he is going to come here), Josiah Charles (no opininon on himsas he didn't see the field much) and Reggie Akles (athlete but was probably 3rd or 4th best CB on the team) but UConn needs athlete's like him.

Not too sure what is going to happen now, there are 30 players in the portal from NMSU, they hired Tony Sanchez (NMSU alum and former UNLV head coach). Let's hope he learned a lot under Kill otherwise we will be lucky to win 4 or 5 games a year.

thanks for the insights - I presumed NMSU was the closer comparison to us, and these points further that assumption. I really like the IDEA of uconn playing football against p4 brands to keep up our own brand but at this point idk if it's worth the repeated embarassments. All it's doing is giving the haters more data points against us.

If I think about it, I feel like UConn is the only g5/indep program that's giving the naysayers the ammunition needed to keep them out of the club (consistent p4 losses). Most other G5 (p4 hopefuls) stay far away from P4 opponents for the most part, as far as I can see. They will schedule them, but not to our degree. The lack of P4 data works in SMU/Tulane's favor (yes yes i know - Tulane has the USC bowl game win), which I think is partially why they're viewed positively.

If we're (UConn) truly not willing to play jacksonville state, Charlotte, NMSU, etc. then we really need to do the impossible to get the kids that will keep us competitive in the 4th quarter against a Tennessee/Michigan/OH State, and who give us reasonable expectation to WIN against Duke/NC State/Purdue/Indiana/UNC/etc.

 

[DMTCYNAW]

We should join CUSA as football only. Love to play UD. UMass to end every year. Stick with an in-state FCS and/or perhaps URI.

i hate this so much, and 1 year ago i would have been insulted by this post. But if we go 2-10 again next year, i seriously feel that this should be a consideration. I'll never like it and would hope we move up to a better situation ASAP after joining, but if it puts us on an actual path to competitiveness and stability, then i think it's worth considering.

I think this is what Liberty is doing with CUSA. They don't like it either, but it's the stop they need at this phase in their ascension.
clearly my fellow huskies disagree and dislike liberty specifically, but a the end of the day the resume they're building cannot be ignored. My "3-4 years" prediction may be a bit over-optimistic, but again - consistency like that is attractive to a conference. As a university president, You don't have to "like" a school to decide to let them into your conference. Let's be real; everyone is using everyone else.

 

[Patman]

A lot of NMSU talk on here...as an alum I approve.

Jerry Kill when he was hired, made a list of improvements that needed to be done to be considered a legit FBS program. That included a new locker room, field turf for practice field, new cooling system for the locker room/coaches offices, new scoreboard, and wanted a couple of parking lots paved. Now, almost all of these things UConn already has and are probably still better than NMSU put out there The boosters stepped up in a big way to make most of this happen, the parking lot hasn't been paved yet but still is in the works.

Kill brought with him a bunch of guys who were assistants or grad assistants from TCU. Also brought in a former player, David Cobb to help out. In terms of salary, I have no doubt Mora and all of his assistants are paid way more than NMSU coaches (obviously cost of living is significant cheaper in Las Cruces.)

What I have seen in the two years we had Kill was that he had an unbelievable eye for talent, he also knew what type of player was needed for his program. He brought in some P5 guys like Andre Seldon (Michigan), Eli Stowers Texas A+M (QB to WR), Monte Watkins (TCU), He also found some FCS guys who fit the mold of what he was looking for.

He really hit the junior colleges hard, focusing on the power houses like Independence and Iowa Western. The programs in the midwest/south that churn out a good amount of FBS level players. (I feel like these guys may not get into UConn for academic reasons, NMSU is much easier to get into and they also utilize Dona Ana community college which is apart of the campus to help get guys qualified.)

I cannot speak to NIL, I know NMSU has the A Mountain Collective and that is comprised of about 15-20 local businesses and donors. They were able to get enough money to secure Trent Hudson (who I think was going to come to UConn.)

It is hard to recruit to Las Cruces, it is a beautiful college town and the weather are big selling points but the closet major city is El Paso and well, that's not going to get a lot of people to commit.

This year's NMSU team was the best I've ever seen. It is evident that Kill had a great eye for talent and for coaches. The offensive cordnitaor and defensive back coach are both off to Vanderbuit. The guys who have enterered the portal are getting some big offers, our second string QB went to Vandy, Andre Seldon is getting offers to Wisconsin and Texas A+M, Keyshaun Elliot is off to ASU. We are after Myles Rowser (would be huge but doubt he is going to come here), Josiah Charles (no opininon on himsas he didn't see the field much) and Reggie Akles (athlete but was probably 3rd or 4th best CB on the team) but UConn needs athlete's like him.

Not too sure what is going to happen now, there are 30 players in the portal from NMSU, they hired Tony Sanchez (NMSU alum and former UNLV head coach). Let's hope he learned a lot under Kill otherwise we will be lucky to win 4 or 5 games a year.

What I will say to that is uconn while it has Hartford lacks a dedicated urban area with a specific focus. This is a problem that's long plagued connecticut. That singular focus is important.

 

[Purple Stein]

Pretty simple. Both schools decided to invest in hiring proven successful coaches. Liberty hired a successful former SEC coach, Hugh Freeze, who was unhireable by most schools, and replaced him with a successful coach from Coastal Carolina. NM State hired a very good coach, Jerry Kill, although his health issues are what prevented him from other head coaching jobs and caused him to retire after this season.

Bottom line, if you want a successful football program, you have to hire and pay your coaches. You don't say this is what I'll pay for coaches and I want great results. You say I want great results, so how much do I have to pay the coaches?

And those schools got those guys because they were considered undesirable (for very different reasons).

Art Briles is as undesirable as they come and still coaching in Italy - have to look in the mirror and ask if that’s who you want at OC.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

i hate this so much, and 1 year ago i would have been insulted by this post. But if we go 2-10 again next year, i seriously feel that this should be a consideration. I'll never like it and would hope we move up to a better situation ASAP after joining, but if it puts us on an actual path to competitiveness and stability, then i think it's worth considering.

I think this is what Liberty is doing with CUSA. They don't like it either, but it's the stop they need at this phase in their ascension.
clearly my fellow huskies disagree and dislike liberty specifically, but a the end of the day the resume they're building cannot be ignored. My "3-4 years" prediction may be a bit over-optimistic, but again - consistency like that is attractive to a conference. As a university president, You don't have to "like" a school to decide to let them into your conference. Let's be real; everyone is using everyone else.

They both run very low SOSs according to Sports Reference.

 

[noeynox]

What we can learn from them is to hire good coaches. Coaches who like to push the ball dowm the field and not try to win rock fights. Good athletes want to play in wide open offenses.

 

[UConnJim]

Pretty sure we outspend New Mexico State by a significant amount. It's all relative to your competition. If we played a C-USA schedule we would be closer to their results but considering we are trying to compete against P4 schools and scheduling like it, the results are what they are.

Liberty outspends UConn. Yes, NM St. spends less, but they brought in a known good coach who has well known health issues and, sure enough, he is retiring. I still come back to pick the results you want and hire and spend accordingly.

 

[uconnbill]

If we need to copy Liberty, we should just shut the entire thing down.

You have to get over hatred of Liberty because of whatever political issue you have

 

[Kolumbo]

No one is arguing that they are not on the rise, that's a fact. It's the assumption that they are P4 bound that is getting push back

I guess it depends on how many programs are included in the P4 and where the other Virginia and North Carolina programs end up. Who knows, the ACC carcass would be an ideal candidate to make another bad decision.

 

[shizzle787]

NMSU has made two bowl games the last two years because they had a good coach. They were only independent for about 7 years. They were in a conference for decades and sucked. They made one bowl game in about 60 years.

Liberty has one of the few football budgets in the G5 that is bigger than ours. Liberty was good two years ago as independent as well.

Point being that being in a conference has had zero effect on the success (or in NMSU's case- usually failure) of these programs.

 

[Kolumbo]

NMSU has made two bowl games the last two years because they had a good coach. They were only independent for about 7 years. They were in a conference for decades and sucked. They made one bowl game in about 60 years.

Liberty has one of the few football budgets in the G5 that is bigger than ours. Liberty was good two years ago as independent as well.

Point being that being in a conference has had zero effect on the success (or in NMSU's case- usually failure) of these programs.

How can you say zero effect? First, 6 years is too small a sample size to measure any correlation. That said, Liberty just went 13-0 in its first year in a conference. Number of wins in those 6 years: 6, 8, 10, 8, 8, 13

 

[shizzle787]

How can you say zero effect? First, 6 years is too small a sample size to measure any correlation. That said, Liberty just went 13-0 in its first year in a conference. Number of wins in those 6 years: 6, 8, 10, 8, 8, 13

They also played the worst SOS in possibly a decade. The played almost all of the bottom 10 teams in the country. That doesn't say much.

 

[Kolumbo]

They also played the worst SOS in possibly a decade. The played almost all of the bottom 10 teams in the country. That doesn't say much.

But it did have a direct effect on their success this year. It got them ranked and playing in the Fiesta Bowl. Sometimes it IS the Destination.

 

[shizzle787]

But it did have a direct effect on their success this year. It got them ranked and playing in the Fiesta Bowl. Sometimes it IS the Destination.

The only reason they got in the Fiesta Bowl was because every other G5 champ had at least TWO losses. That in itself was a miracle.

 

[Viet Vet]

ok, so what's the formula?

it sounds like nothing Liberty is doing, is putting them in a position to make the jump to the big table, according to your responses

• multiple P5 wins vs. ACC/SEC opponents
• massive stadium expansion & renovation, rivaling P5 southern schools, which are the CFB "gameday atmosphere" benchmark. See Kolumbo's picture above.
• massive facilities/amenities upgrade (and i mean MASSIVE, SEC/NFL level)
• the RIGHT coaching hires for the transition from FCS to FBS (freeze + chadwell - home run BOTH times)
• 13-0 season 2023 (SOS aside, this is still hard to do and deserves some respect)
• $$$$$
• Idk their NIL collective situation, but i'm almost positive they're already ahead of most G5's on this, given their other investments. There's clearly an open checkbook somewhere.

not judging, just asking - are you simply not a Liberty fan? because if you take the "liberty" brand off and put "Tulane/ECU/Memphis" on these accomplishments, wondering if that would make a difference.

If none of the bullets above are good enough, then what the heck is even the point of trying/yearning for p5 invite, if you're UConn? I mean come on. this is why i'm trying to determine if you just hate liberty, or objectively there's another standard i'm not seeing.

"massive stadium expansion"? It seats (after expansion) 25,000.

 

[DMTCYNAW]

"massive stadium expansion"? It seats (after expansion) 25,000.

yes. note i said expansion + renovation (or upgrade)

massive stadium expansion is a multi-faceted term and applies here, given where Liberty was until very recently. (FCS - big south conf)
Their stadium grandstand 12 years ago was barely bigger than memorial stadium. From that, to williams stadium's current layout today, is friggin massive and is indicative of how serious they are about making it to the top echelon of CFB.

Liberty is just starting out, and the sky's the limit for them at this rate. For a just-starting-out program, that stadium is LEGIT.

Massive Upgrade (expansion + renovation) in the 21st century is not just sheer seat numbers, but quality of atmosphere, technology, modernity, sightlines etc. if Williams was 70,000 wooden bleachers from 1955, Liberty haters would cry cuz it's not nice enough. Go check out Rice Stadium in Houston to see how worthwhile a big stadium is in 2023 when it has nothing else to offer but... seats.

pro teams are REDUCING capacity to provide a modern gameday experience. So numbers isn't all it's charged up to be. not anymore.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

I think history has shown that beating P4 schools had little bearing in getting invited to a P4 conference.

I think it helped UCF, Houston, BYU, Cinci that they were very competitive against their P5 schedules over the years.

 

[Kolumbo]

yes. note i said expansion + renovation (or upgrade)

massive stadium expansion is a multi-faceted term and applies here, given where Liberty was until very recently. (FCS - big south conf)
Their stadium grandstand 12 years ago was barely bigger than memorial stadium. From that, to williams stadium's current layout today, is friggin massive and is indicative of how serious they are about making it to the top echelon of CFB.

Liberty is just starting out, and the sky's the limit for them at this rate. For a just-starting-out program, that stadium is LEGIT.

Massive Upgrade (expansion + renovation) in the 21st century is not just sheer seat numbers, but quality of atmosphere, technology, modernity, sightlines etc. if Williams was 70,000 wooden bleachers from 1955, Liberty haters would cry cuz it's not nice enough. Go check out Rice Stadium in Houston to see how worthwhile a big stadium is in 2023 when it has nothing else to offer but... seats.

pro teams are REDUCING capacity to provide a modern gameday experience. So numbers isn't all it's charged up to be. not anymore.

The stadium has cabanas! That beats indoor luxury suites.

"At the South end zone, 23 cabanas will be added above a newly graded berm with additional space for students and overflow seating. Complete with seating for eight and a roof to keep the sun and weather out, each cabana will be furnished with a TV, fan, heater, and waiter service."

Liberty Athletics announces Williams Stadium expansion plans | Liberty News

In anticipation of the best home football schedule in program history, Liberty University Athletics will be making several renovations to Williams Stadium prior to the 2022 season. The renovation plans include new seating options, including a seating upgrade for nearly...

www.liberty.edu

 

[Waquoit]

You have to get over hatred of Liberty because of whatever political issue you have

No, I do not. It is not a real school, it’s a football team with a cult attached. No real university should have anything to do with them.

 

[husky429]

No, I do not. It is not a real school, it’s a football team with a cult attached. No real university should have anything to do with them.

Rarely agree with you, but this is about as accurate as it gets.

 

[Waquoit]

Rarely agree with you

It's never too late to increase one's hit percentage.

 

[Duncan Idaho]

But it did have a direct effect on their success this year. It got them ranked and playing in the Fiesta Bowl. Sometimes it IS the Destination.

They had 8 home games

 

[Kolumbo]

They had 8 home games

On campus

 

[Patman]

No, I do not. It is not a real school, it’s a football team with a cult attached. No real university should have anything to do with them.

So is BYU

 

[nycscooby]

Neither of those schools will get a P4 invite. P4 schools will wave the “no football tradition” flag as a way to keep any deserving program out. Even us if we ever got our FB together.

Will there be a league of the top 50 programs and then another league between that one and FCS?