Why the ACC took Louisville

[UConn990411]

I was listing the schools that "successful" conferences added during conference realignment. If Delany. Slive, and Scott were brilliant leaders for adding these schools, I presume Swofford would be deemed brilliant if he had added some of these schools.

I am trying to understand how the ACC could have approached realignment differently or more successfully. I don't think any of the schools added to the B1G*, SEC, or Pac-12 were good fits for the ACC; do you?

* UMd notwithstanding

And herein lies the point that so many ACC fans can't seem to grasp.

While the ACC was busy plucking away whichever Big East football programs were ranked at the time, the B1G, SEC and PAC-12 were expanding into new (major) markets. By adding new schools located near major metropolitans, those conferences have been able to drastically improve their financial situations ... to the point where they may double up the ACC in their TV contracts alone.

Who knows how things will play out in the future, but I suspect that gap in revenue will eventually lead to a gap on the field.

 

[whaler11]

And herein lies the point that so many ACC fans can't seem to grasp.

While the ACC was busy plucking away whichever Big East football programs were ranked at the time, the B1G, SEC and PAC-12 were expanding into new (major) markets. By adding new schools located near major metropolitans, those conferences have been able to drastically improve their financial situations ... to the point where they may double up the ACC in their TV contracts alone.

Who knows how things will play out in the future, but I suspect that gap in revenue will eventually lead to a gap on the field.

They were already worth a lot more. Sure Rutgers and Missouri for example helped. But even with no expansion they were going to get a lot more

 

[clmssun]

And herein lies the point that so many ACC fans can't seem to grasp.

While the ACC was busy plucking away whichever Big East football programs were ranked at the time, the B1G, SEC and PAC-12 were expanding into new (major) markets. By adding new schools located near major metropolitans, those conferences have been able to drastically improve their financial situations ... to the point where they may double up the ACC in their TV contracts alone.

Who knows how things will play out in the future, but I suspect that gap in revenue will eventually lead to a gap on the field.

The gamechanging event of the college athletics landscape was the B1G adding Penn State, period. If the ACC had added Penn State (alongside Florida State) at that time, the the ACC would be a titan of a conference right now (and the B1G would be withering). But that did not happen 24 years ago...

With Penn State demarcating the ACC and B1G for the last 24 years, there was no way the ACC was ever going to pry away Ohio State or Michigan... (and why would the ACC have any interest in Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Iowa, Wisconsin, Minnesota?)

South Carolina left the ACC in 1971. When they were added to the SEC in 1991 (alongside Arkansas), no one was talking about "markets". With the ACC getting Florida State (and with the past acrimony with South Carolina), the ACC had no interest in South Carolina. The ACC has since added Miami, increasing their share of the state of Florida.

I have never gathered that Florida, Georgia, or Tennessee were poach-able; have you?

I am still puzzled as to what white whale Swofford was supposed to harpoon (given my statements in previous posts about who was available).

 

[Cleanface]

Imma let the UCONN folks handle this thread.

Love your postings so far tho, clmssun. Do it again.

 

[UConn990411]

If he had added Rutgers and UConn after adding Syracuse (like many thought they should have), the ACC would have actually had a good presence in NYC and a stranglehold on New England. Sure, Boston and NYC will always be predominantly pro cities, but they're still valuable markets to have from a TV standpoint.

As it stands, the only markets the ACC owns are North Carolina and Virginia. Their presence in NYC and Boston, meanwhile, is virtually non-existent.

Good luck getting a network off the ground with that.

 

[larryredbull]

The OP was correct. Louisville had the home stands full and loud for their opening game and won. UConn only had 35k for a pretty good home opening opponent and was routed. Expansion was about football and Uconn is a BB school.

 

[UConn990411]

The OP was correct. Louisville had the home stands full and loud for their opening game and won. UConn only had 35k for a pretty good home opening opponent and was routed. Expansion was about football and Uconn is a BB school.

Guess what? Louisville is also a bball school.

Go home, clown.

 

[pj]

I am pretty confused how anyone could have seen that game last night and think their decision was shortsighted.

The outcome of one football game demonstrates farsightedness?

If the ultimate goal of realignment was to get good TV ratings in September 2014, then adding Louisville was farsighted, to be sure.

 

[Calamitous]

Look at the television ratings in Louisville. They are completely off the charts. If you get that high of a percentage of people watching it doesn't matter that the market is smallish.

I've never thought of it that way. Right now the big conferences are swallowing up the biggest TV markets they can find so cable companies can charge us unwittingly for networks we may never watch. Once consumers figure this out, potential lawsuits against cable companies may be filed. If so, the key may be having a TV market where TV ratings matter more than just the shear number of subscribers. In that case, Louisville is a great move. But then again, so is UConn. I still think Maryland was a homerun for the B1G no matter if it's shear cable subscriber numbers or TV ratings.

Right now, the ACC is good with the Virginia, North Carolina and South Carolina markets. Georgia is Bulldog country. Florida is Gator country even if the ACC added USF and UCF. The majority of Northeast ACC schools will not be big ratings boosters except for maybe Syracuse during basketball season. The only two northeast schools that are good for TV ratings year round are Penn State and UConn. Another good addition would be WVU by this logic.

Also, will the Network media product quality be critical down the road? Right now, the B1G network and PAC networks seem to be a low grade product compared to the SEC Network. The SEC is already superior whether we like to admit it or not. The B1G and PAC at least have a network, but they have a lot of work to do to make their product sexy like the SEC has done. The ACC is still asleep behind the wheel with Raycom's high school production graphics.

 

[Cleanface]

How exactly is the wildly successful and ground-breaking BTN "low grade" vs the SEC Network that just started days ago??

Bc of their recent football success?? lol. We love our Big Ten football up north too.


edit; BTW - of course Maryland was a home-run. In every way. The only people who don't think so are ACC drones.

 

[frankthetank]

If the ACC felt like it was going to "lose" Louisville to the B12, then it was a good move. After seeing the B12 continue to drag their heels on expansion and insist upon a round-robin conference tournament, it doesn't seem like they were/are in a hurry to add anyone. But I guess the decision was whether or not they felt Louisville was at greater risk to be added by another conference before UCONN. Judging by how each school's football programs have performed and have/have not been supported by their fan bases, perhaps the B12 would have beed motivated to add Louisville (with possibly Cincinnati to give WVU an eastern "pod"). I think Louisville would have been added by the B12 long before the B1G would add UCONN, hence their decision.

Whether it was intentional or not, the ACC really did box in the Big 12 by picking Louisville. The Big 12 adding a Louisville/BYU or Louisville/Cincinnati combo would have been much more valuable for that league compared to their options right now (i.e. Cincinnati/BYU, etc.). Remember that this was back during the period where there was a loud contingent (not me, but others in the Internet sphere to the point that FSU's president and Board of Trustees had to address it publicly) that believed that the Big 12 could poach the ACC of its top football brands. I don't think that was the only factor in the ACC's decision-making process (as I'll give Tom Jurich all of the credit in the world for spending 15-plus years preparing for the moment when an opportunity like an open spot in the ACC presented itself), but it was a clear benefit. I said it back then: the Big 12 partisans got way too big of heads for their britches and completely overestimated their power in conference realignment. Their inane thinking that they could get Florida State to move prevented them from moving forward with an obtainable Louisville. Many Big 12 partisans won't ever admit it, but the ACC legitimately screwed the Big 12 with the Louisville addition since their options are much weaker now.

 

[WestHartHusk]

The OP was correct. Louisville had the home stands full and loud for their opening game and won. UConn only had 35k for a pretty good home opening opponent and was routed. Expansion was about football and Uconn is a BB school.

Oh piss off. I have seen a ton of L'Ville football games with a TON of empty seats. I promise you, if we had a two-year build-up towards the ACC and Miami as a home opener our stadium would look no different. You got in, and deserved to, but to think there is a difference between L'Ville and UConn is ridiculous. And we are both basketball schools, we are just better at it than you are.

 

[3d2bcards]

And ask yourself why FSU wanted them. A. Better football program? B. Southern culture/not another Yankee school? C. Less likely to align with Tobacco Road? D. Lousiville and Jurich made great powerpoint presentations and lobbied effectively. E. All of A through C above? I think the answer is E. By the way, none of those things are Warde's fault.

I thought I lived in the midwest?

 

[pj]

Many Big 12 partisans won't ever admit it, but the ACC legitimately screwed the Big 12 with the Louisville addition since their options are much weaker now.

Why should the ACC have cared about screwing the Big 12? If the Big 12 takes Louisville and BYU or Cincy it doesn't hurt the ACC.

 

[Calamitous]

How exactly is the wildly successful and ground-breaking BTN "low grade" vs the SEC Network that just started days ago??

First off, my comment wasn't meant to offend B1G fans, but I get why some might be a little overprotective and take that the wrong way. "Superior" is different than "wildly successful." I said superior as in a more superior media platform.

That said, "Low Grade" is probably a poor choice of words, but the ESPN (SECN) > Fox (B1GN), much to my chagrin. I'd love to see Fox or NBC sports take some wind out of the ESPN sails, but right now ESPN has too much power and momentum. Unfortunately, most people (not me) want glitz and over-the-top visual stimulation. For me, I just want to watch the game. But 90% of Americans can't watch more than 5 minutes of anything, much less a game, without needing to see tickers scrolling across the screen with random pop-up ads pimping a new program. My hat's off to Delany for many of the moves he made, but Slive will win the cable network battle... sorry.

True, the SECN has only been out for several weeks, but their ratings are through the roof already. ESPN has been shoving the SEC down our throats for decades and now they have an official ESPN/SEC platform. No conference will be able to compete with that IMO.

Bc of their recent football success?? lol. We love our Big Ten football up north too.

I'm sure B1G fans love their football. I never questioned that.

 

[whaler11]

First off, my comment wasn't meant to offend B1G fans, but I get why some might be a little overprotective and take that the wrong way. "Superior" is different than "wildly successful." I said superior as in a more superior media platform.

That said, "Low Grade" is probably a poor choice of words, but the ESPN (SECN) > Fox (B1GN), much to my chagrin. I'd love to see Fox or NBC sports take some wind out of the ESPN sails, but right now ESPN has too much power and momentum. Unfortunately, most people (not me) want glitz and over-the-top visual stimulation. For me, I just want to watch the game. But 90% of Americans can't watch more than 5 minutes of anything, much less a game, without needing to see tickers scrolling across the screen with random pop-up ads pimping a new program. My hat's off to Delany for many of the moves he made, but Slive will win the cable network battle... sorry.

True, the SECN has only been out for several weeks, but their ratings are through the roof already. ESPN has been shoving the SEC down our throats for decades and now they have an official ESPN/SEC platform. No conference will be able to compete with that IMO.



I'm sure B1G fans love their football. I never questioned that.

From a pure television standpoint the Big Ten Network is excellent.

They obviously can't compete with the SECN on their football game inventory, but they have excellent non-game programming.

I just got SECN right before the season started so I haven't seen much yet, but obviously they have high production value.

Both are lightyears ahead of the Pac12 net which can be tough to watch sometimes.

 

[whaler11]

The outcome of one football game demonstrates farsightedness?

If the ultimate goal of realignment was to get good TV ratings in September 2014, then adding Louisville was farsighted, to be sure.

Of course it doesn't. But Louisville had been building towards this for the better part of two decades and they knocked it out of the park last night.

The ACC was stupid to not take Louisville before Pitt and Syracuse.

I get why UConn fans don't want to come to grips with Louisville's obvious success... but you have to ignore what is blatently obvious.

 

[Calamitous]

From a pure television standpoint the Big Ten Network is excellent.

They obviously can't compete with the SECN on their football game inventory, but they have excellent non-game programming.

I just got SECN right before the season started so I haven't seen much yet, but obviously they have high production value.

Both are lightyears ahead of the Pac12 net which can be tough to watch sometimes.

Nothing is better than Raycom

 

[Cleanface]

My hat's off to Delany for many of the moves he made, but Slive will win the cable network battle... sorry.

Blasphemy.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

And last night Louisville put on quite a show to vindicate/justify FSU's demands. I wanted/want UConn in the ACC, but last night was a pretty strong affirmation for FSU's/ACC's choice.

I assume you're serious. I have no idea why but I assume you are. You're "vindication" scenario is like trumpeting a replacement at second base because the new guy went two-for-four. Or calling a pitching change brilliant because the new pitcher's first pitch was a strike. What the hell is your/the ACC's time horizon on deciding on proposed new membership? We want the team that's likely be the best performer through the middle of next week. And what's your strategy? Find out who's most pissed off and let them pick the next member? I'm not saying Louisville won't turn out to be a good add. I like Louisville and wish then well. I'm saying that you're celebration of the Louisville add is more reminiscent of a 5-year-old wanting to be a fireman because the class visited the firehouse today than a deliberative response. I'm saying that that decision making process won't serve you well in the future. Perhaps you got lucky this time. Time will tell. But you've also gotten stung by Boston College and Miami, and likely Syracuse...maybe Pitt.

 

[Seaa Blue]

My hat's off to Delany for many of the moves he made, but Slive will win the cable network battle... sorry.

Coming in second (however you might want to work the numbers to achieve that result) is not "losing" in that 2-horse race.

-B1G

 

[gioff23]

UConn did not get passed over for Louisville; we got passed over for Pitt. Our best chance to join the ACC was the prior raid that originally had us paired with Cuse. The last round was a great strategic move by the ACC (see FTT's comments above). They could have easily yelled checkmate after that move. Taking UConn and leaving Ville for the B12 at a time when FB was everything and many in the ACC were left questioning their southern heritage could not happen. Instead, they took the Ville, appeased their most (er, only) powerful FB schools, and left us sitting there.

The B12 aint touching us and I just remain unconvinced the BIG ever will.

ND in the ACC will be the turning point, the year they get an invite to the playoff while only playing a few conf games. The ACC will be forced to make ND a full member (which ND never will) or be asked to exclude them from consideration as a league member for the playoff. They might then want another team to create balance. Might.

 

[NickyNewark]

Imma let the UCONN folks handle this thread.

Love your postings so far tho, clmssun. Do it again.

What a "yokel" Clampson is with his lack of understanding of CR move wisdom.

 

[Bobol]

In my opinion UConn has been past over for ACC membership because the old boys in the Carolina's still have a distaste in their mouth over the ill conceived lawsuit against their league by former Connecticut Attorney General Richard Blumenthal.

Yes, I know that other schools such as Pitts were also plaintiffs along with UConn but Blumenthal took the vocal lead on the lawsuit and the old boys of the ACC carry grudges.

 

[FDNY99]

And Tom Jurich was behind the development of strong athletic programs at Louisville. He was active throughout. Not sitting back waiting. Not monitoring. This is where Warde is left behind. He is still talking about monitoring in the latest news interview in the newspaper from Utah! After watching last nights Louisville game, it all became clear as day why they were chosen and UConn was left behind.

Warde wasn't the one who sat back...and caused UCONN athletics to wrap around a tree at a EXTREMELY high rate of speed. That was one Mr Jeff Hathaway! If you want to pin the excuse on why we are where we are...make sure you place blame where it deserves!!!