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Why the ACC took Louisville

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HuskyHawk

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I hear you pepband. I am speaking more generally though - if we had a slate of BC, Miami, NC State, and UNC this year at home with Cuse, CLemson, Va Tech and UNC next year, etc. Then we would have big crowds regularly. The losing in football and continous nut sack kicks we have taken in CR has beaten the fanbase down. If we ever got into the ACC or B1G the season ticket sales would fly and fans would come out of the woodwork initially. As CAHUSKY posted earlier, when L'ville was losing under Kragthorpe their attendance was in the low 30s. It takes its toll. We currently have a ty conference and a losing football team. If L ville was 10-23 over the past three seasons and was playing SMU, Memphis and Temple in football they would not be getting anywhere near 55K in that place.

OK, this is all true...and it is also true that college football is just bigger in Louisville. It's much more a part of day to day life. This isn't surprising, we know it's the case. It is an extra burden that UConn has to overcome. We can talk about the grand old days at Yale all we want, but the reality is that there is no modern history of college football as a key component of life in Connecticut. We were on the way to building one and took a step back (or several), and now have to start over again.
 

Dooley

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You asked if we could sell 55K tickets for Miami tonight. No probably not given what has occurred here in the last 3 years. But if it were the season after we played in the Fiesta Bowl, were invited into the ACC and added new seats to the stadium then yes I think we would. The optimism would be off the charts here.

Yes, if we played the "what if?" game: if we had Warde as our AD after Randy left and had he hired Diaco in 2011 to replace him, then we probably could have sold 55k. But none of that happened as we all painfully know. So the question was posed as TONIGHT. That answer is a resounding no. To be quite honest, I'm not sure we could sell 55K tickets to watch any team come to the Rent without SIGNIFICANT help from a horde of visiting fans (ex - Nebraska or Penn State fans would surely pack the Rent to watch their teams play). Our fanbase has a very long way to go to unite as one - not as a segmented group that roots only for MBB or WBB or Football programs. That's where Louisville fans have a very significant edge over UCONN fans - their fans Cards Up when they're asked to. Our were asked to HuskyUp and we were 5K short of a sellout (for 40K...not 55K) against a very good opponent.

We have work to do Yarders. #HuskyUp
 

Dooley

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I always say that athletics are cyclical and academics are more a long-term measure. If (IF) Louisville is able to significantly improve their academics because of their athletics, then good for them. They obviously have a very long way to go to become a respectable academic institution but, holy , the proactive, progressive and aggressive nature of their athletic department is just leaps and bounds ahead of our own. When they were knee-deep in Kragthorpe, they didn't rest on their laurels of the old Bobby Petrino era and say things like "we will expand our stadium once there is demand". No. They expanded in spite of their 30K crowds knowing that athletics are cyclical and that they would trend upward again one day. So, they started expanding their stadium, made an excellent hire in Charlie Strong, and off they went. People here like to think that Louisville got into the ACC over UCONN because of what Tom Jurich did in 1 week while Warde was in the Virgin Islands with this WBB team. No. Louisville got into the ACC over UCONN because of what they did for the years leading up to that moment. They bet on themselves and now they are reaping the rewards.
 
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I always say that athletics are cyclical and academics are more a long-term measure. If (IF) Louisville is able to significantly improve their academics because of their athletics, then good for them. They obviously have a very long way to go to become a respectable academic institution but, holy , the proactive, progressive and aggressive nature of their athletic department is just leaps and bounds ahead of our own. When they were knee-deep in Kragthorpe, they didn't rest on their laurels of the old Bobby Petrino era and say things like "we will expand our stadium once there is demand". No. They expanded in spite of their 30K crowds knowing that athletics are cyclical and that they would trend upward again one day. So, they started expanding their stadium, made an excellent hire in Charlie Strong, and off they went. People here like to think that Louisville got into the ACC over UCONN because of what Tom Jurich did in 1 week while Warde was in the Virgin Islands with this WBB team. No. Louisville got into the ACC over UCONN because of what they did for the years leading up to that moment. They bet on themselves and now they are reaping the rewards.
And Tom Jurich was behind the development of strong athletic programs at Louisville. He was active throughout. Not sitting back waiting. Not monitoring. This is where Warde is left behind. He is still talking about monitoring in the latest news interview in the newspaper from Utah! After watching last nights Louisville game, it all became clear as day why they were chosen and UConn was left behind.
 
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The ACC chose Louisville because that was what FSU demanded at the time.

Let's not try to overcomplicate an incredibly simple matter.

And last night Louisville put on quite a show to vindicate/justify FSU's demands. I wanted/want UConn in the ACC, but last night was a pretty strong affirmation for FSU's/ACC's choice.
 

HuskyHawk

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The ACC chose Louisville because that was what FSU demanded at the time.

Let's not try to overcomplicate an incredibly simple matter.

And ask yourself why FSU wanted them. A. Better football program? B. Southern culture/not another Yankee school? C. Less likely to align with Tobacco Road? D. Lousiville and Jurich made great powerpoint presentations and lobbied effectively. E. All of A through C above? I think the answer is E. By the way, none of those things are Warde's fault.
 
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Nostalgia....

All of us middle age dudes grew up with a Louisville Slugger in our hands...
 
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Jurich has done a hell of a job at Louisville. No doubt about it.

He's dancing with the devil right now in Petrino. Hell of a football coach, but whenever someone tries to sell me on someone changing their spots I am very, very skeptical.
 

pj

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The fact is that if college athletics were going to slim down from a P6 to a P5, essentially all the Big East schools deserved a spot in the P5. It was a bit random which schools got selected, more based on personal relationships than value, since most of the Big East schools were about equally valuable.

Further expansion will happen, since the G5 are going to wither and there are major TV markets still stuck in the G5. That money will be captured somehow. No idea how or when it will happen though.
 
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Assuming you have a television that gets ESPN you don't ever need to question their decision again.

I'm still sticking to my guns that UConn would have been a better replacement for UMCP. UL has a strong AD and good fan support, but UConn does as well. As for the game, if not for the ineligible receiver call late in the 4th, the score could have been 24-20 (or 19 or 21) late in the game rather than giving UL the short field. Doesn't really matter though, because UL would have score again the way Miami's defense was playing. UL may win 9 or 10 games this year and could give FSU, Clemson & ND fits. Still waaaaayyyyy early, but UL may be the 2nd or 3rd best football team in the ACC this year.
 
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And last night Louisville put on quite a show to vindicate/justify FSU's demands. I wanted/want UConn in the ACC, but last night was a pretty strong affirmation for FSU's/ACC's choice.
One game is a great sample size!

I've never criticized the ACC's addition of Louisville because I don't think it was a bad decision. They have a tremendous athletic department and strong commitment to athletics, and the conference will be stronger for it.

But the reality is that Louisville was chosen for the same shortsighted reasons that were behind most of the ACC's expansion initiatives - mostly that they had a nice football ranking at the time. That thought process (and the lack of attention to markets) will make the ACC far less appealing, and profitable, for the foreseeable future.
 

whaler11

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I am pretty confused how anyone could have seen that game last night and think their decision was shortsighted.

UConn would obviously be a great addition for the ACC as well - but unless you are grasping at academic straws... Louisville steps in as a top 5 athletic department in the league.

Markets? Look at the television ratings in Louisville. They are completely off the charts. If you get that high of a percentage of people watching it doesn't matter that the market is smallish.
 
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Louisville will make the ACC a stronger athletic conference. But they're in a nothing TV market, and therefore will have just a minor influence the next time the ACC bargains for a new TV deal (or better yet, the next time they attempt to start their imaginary network).

There's a reason the B1G, SEC and Pac-12 all approached conference realignment completely differently than the ACC. And not coincidentally, there's a reason those conferences are far more stable and profitable.
 

CL82

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Louisville got into the ACC over UCONN because of what they did for the years leading up to that moment. They bet on themselves and now they are reaping the rewards.

True enough. Of course all that work could have squandered if Jurich had decided to a take that week off.
 

CL82

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UConn would obviously be a great addition for the ACC as well - but unless you are grasping at academic straws... Louisville steps in as a top 5 athletic department in the league.

The thing is Whaler that prior to the Louisville addition academics were a core part of the ACC's identity and not a straw man issue. Time will tell if that choice will bite them in the butt.
 
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There's a reason the B1G, SEC and Pac-12 all approached conference realignment completely differently than the ACC. And not coincidentally, there's a reason those conferences are far more stable and profitable.

I don't think Colorado and Utah are good fits for the ACC.
I don't think Texas A&M and Missouri are good fits for the ACC.
I don't think Nebraska is a good fit for the ACC.
I don't think Texas Christian is a good fit for the ACC

Of the recent non-ACC expansion schools, that leave Rutgers and West Virginia:

Rutgers:
For all the chiding of the ACC's football performance (and recent suboptimal basketball performance):
1) There would have been all-out mutiny within the ACC's "football" ranks if the ACC had invited Rutgers prior to their B1G invitation.
1a) The BoneYard would have been *quite* entertaining if the ACC had somehow added Rutgers but not UConn.

West Virginia:
1) There has been long-standing academic dissension within ACC toward WVU (before Louisville invitation, of course).
2) I think strong arguments can be made that Louisville is a better "conference expansion target" than WVU (hence the Big XII debate of 3 years ago).
3) WVU is the key to an ACC Network? (Market size? Demographics? Seriously?)

Yes, history will always look back at early 1990s when B1G grabbed Penn State (and ACC grabbed Florida State). Understand at that time that SEC was interested in Florida State, having none of the contemporary concerns regarding "redundant markets". Without question, B1G grabbing Penn State was brilliant, and it has paid HUGE dividends; but to a large degree the B1G *had* to invite Penn State to avoid eventual irrelevance.

Yes, BC sucks and I would much rather have UConn than BC in the ACC. Delany wanted a piece of NYC so he grabbed Rutgers, Swofford grabbed Cuse with similar motivations. If you like Rutgers in B1G, that is fantastic; neither Rutgers nor Syracuse excite me greatly, but I'd rather have Cuse if forced to choose (just my opinion).

Beyond turning the clock back 24 years and adding Penn State, I am not sure what you think the ACC could have done "more like B1G, SEC, Pac-12" (all of whom have passed on WVU and UConn as well)/
 
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Louisville looks like a great add right now because they are doing well in FB and BB, and they just expanded their stadium. If they have couple 3-9 seasons, let's see how strong their fan support will be. Like someone else posted, they already had number of 30K attendance seasons due to Krapsthorpe. If we had number of seasons where we were winning conferences and got into a P5 conference, I have no doubt our fan support would be much better than now.

UCONN would still be a much BETTER add for the ACC in the long term. UL is looking good now, but UCONN is still a much better fit for the ACC. That being said, I really really hope we end up in the B1G and ACC can have UL.
 

Dooley

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If the ACC felt like it was going to "lose" Louisville to the B12, then it was a good move. After seeing the B12 continue to drag their heels on expansion and insist upon a round-robin conference tournament, it doesn't seem like they were/are in a hurry to add anyone. But I guess the decision was whether or not they felt Louisville was at greater risk to be added by another conference before UCONN. Judging by how each school's football programs have performed and have/have not been supported by their fan bases, perhaps the B12 would have beed motivated to add Louisville (with possibly Cincinnati to give WVU an eastern "pod"). I think Louisville would have been added by the B12 long before the B1G would add UCONN, hence their decision.
 
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I don't think Colorado and Utah are good fits for the ACC.
I don't think Texas A&M and Missouri are good fits for the ACC.
I don't think Nebraska is a good fit for the ACC.
I don't think Texas Christian is a good fit for the ACC
Uh, what exactly is your point?
 

whaler11

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The thing is Whaler that prior to the Louisville addition academics were a core part of the ACC's identity and not a straw man issue. Time will tell if that choice will bite them in the butt.

How could it 'bite them in the butt'.

Most people understand at this point major college sports has nothing to do with academics.
 
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Uh, what exactly is your point?
I was listing the schools that "successful" conferences added during conference realignment. If Delany. Slive, and Scott were brilliant leaders for adding these schools, I presume Swofford would be deemed brilliant if he had added some of these schools.
UConn990411 said:
There's a reason the B1G, SEC and Pac-12 all approached conference realignment completely differently than the ACC.
I am trying to understand how the ACC could have approached realignment differently or more successfully. I don't think any of the schools added to the B1G*, SEC, or Pac-12 were good fits for the ACC; do you?

* UMd notwithstanding
 
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Great atmosphere last night at Louisville.

Frankly, if UCONN had its debut in the ACC hosting Miami in a night game the Rent would have been packed (44k or whatever it was for Michigan). Folks make too much out of one game. Neither of those teams looked like all that to me.
 
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