OT: NBA SemiFinals

[Scoe]

Good points, one thing the Warriors have going for them besides they are really good and have home court is that they have good options to guard Lebron. Nobody can come close to stopping him but Klay, Draymond, Harrison Barnes and Iguadola would probably be in my top 20 guys in the league to guard him.

Yes definitely, my head is spinning on who I'm picking I don't care who wins this series just wanna see a great series.

 

[aceboon]

I respect your basketball knowledge, what's your take on the finals matchup?

Honestly have no clue, everything on paper says GSW(by the numbers they're a historically great team) but with the way Bron is playing and how all of his role players are completely tuned in I can see them pulling it off as long as Kyrie can go. That being said I don't know what to take out of them running thru the East, as a Bulls fan they've been on and off all season and its clear they laid down in Game 6, and the Hawks haven't looked like the team they did for most of the regular season in the playoffs because Korver had been neutered even before the injury.

 

[jfuchs91]

LeBron is the first player since Bill Russell to make five consecutive Finals. There's never been a player quite like him before. By the time his career is done, he's going to have a legitimate argument for GOAT.

 

[tzznandrew]

If Kyrie is truly healthy, they'll pick off some games. But I don't see how they beat the Warriors over 7: they have 3 bodies they can throw at James (Green, Barnes, AI), and without Love the Cavs won't have the world class spacing they normally do. The Warriors defense is really really good, and while Houston has made 3 of the games competitive, that is largely due to Harden shooting at an absurd level...

As for on defense, the Cavs are going to have to run themselves ragged, and there's nowhere to hide Kyrie. I think this series goes 5, maybe 6 (and the 6 is out of deference to LeBon), barring Love having a Kobe-like miraculous trip to Germany and coming back rejuvenated.

 

[A10 fan]

So, I compiled the stats for NBA punishment during this season to punish players who committed fouls during games wherein the punishment was in addition to required fines for fouls called during the game. This does not include Howard's jab into Bogut's face, which is likely to make the list. The stats speak for themselves. If these stats were in reverse, there'd be a boycott of the NBA by all of the usual interest groups. However, as I noted above, discussions of race can't occur openly or on a two way street, no matter how compelling the evidence.

SUMMARY - there were 22 single person punishments. Of those, 9 were black on white. 4 were black on biracial (1/2 black 1/2 white), 8 were black on black, and 1 was white on white. 13 of the 22 fouls/attacks were by black players on white or half white players, which is about 60% of all fouls/attacks. Black players are about 76% of the league, so, if random, you'd expect 76% of all attacks/fouls to be on black players. The actual number is 36% for this season.

CONCLUSION - there is evidence, like it or not, that white players are targeted in the NBA for fouls/attacks because of their race. Not liking it doesn't change the numbers. If you want to talk about race, it should be a two way street, and the NBA should start with an acknowledgement that guys like Delavedova get targeted because of race. Notably, no white player was punished for a unilateral attack/foul on a non-white opponent, which is probably a good career move.

5/11/15 The NBA fined Dwight Howard $15,000 for making contact above the shoulders on Matt Barnes B/(half black/half white).
5/2/15 The NBA suspended Giannis Antetokounmpo (Mil) for 1 game for shoving Mike Dunleavy B/W.
4/27/15 Suspended J.R. Smith for 2 games for hitting Jae Crowder in the face B/B.
4/27/15 Suspended Kelly Olynyk for 1 game for locking up Kevin Love W/W.
4/27/15 Fined Kendrick Perkins $15,000 and upgraded his flagrant foul on Jae Crowder to a level 2 B/B.
4/5/15 Suspended Shaun Livingston for 1 game for striking Dirk Nowitzki in the groin B/W.
3/21/15 Suspended Marcus Smart for 1 game for hitting Matt Bonner in the groin B/W.
3/14/15 Suspended Joel Freeland and Shawne Williams for 1 game for head butting each other OFFSETTING.
3/13/15 Fined Kevin Seraphin $15,000 for making excessive contact with Jon Leuer B/W.
3/10/15 Suspended Hassan Whiteside for elbowing Kelly Olynyk B/W.
3/3/15 Fined Alex Len and Whiteside for an altercation OFFSETTING.
3/3/15 Fined Markieff Morris $15,000 for his flagrant foul on Goran Dragic B/W.
2/28/15 Suspended Festus Ezeli for 1 game for initiating an altercation with Tyler Hansbrough B/W.
2/7/15 Suspended Kendrick Perkins for 1 game for head butting Tyreke Evans B/B.
2/5/15 Fined DeMar DeRozan $15,000 for excessive contact with Bojan Bogdanovic B/W.
1/13/15 The Suspended Kevin Garnett for 1 game and fined Dwight Howard $15,000 B/B.
12/26/14 Suspended Quincy Acy and fined John Wall $15,000 B/B.
12/22/14 Fined Samuel Dalembert $15,000 for elbowing Jonas Valanciunas B/W.
12/18/14 Suspended Larry Sanders for 1 game for pushing Nicolas Batum B/(half black/half white).
12/4/14 Fined Kyle O'Quinn $15,000 for his flagrant foul on Blake Griffin B/(half black/half white).
12/2/14 Fined Aaron Afflalo $15,000 for his foul on Alec Burks B/B.
11/13/14 Suspended Ronnie Price for flagrant foul on Austin Rivers B/(half black/half white).
11/8/14 Suspended Darrell Arthur for shoving Dion Waiters B/B.
11/5/14 Suspended J.R. Smith for striking Glen Rice B/B.
10/8/14 Joakim Noah and Paul Pierce were fined for altercation. OFFSETTING.

25 total.

22 single actor (Blacks are about 76% of the leauge. Whites, about 19%).

Black on Black - 8.
Black on Biracial (half white) - 4
Black on White - 9
White on Black - 0
White on White - 1

Interesting final note - if you include the 3 bilateral altercations, then whites or half white players were involved in 17 out of 25 of these incidents, or 68%, whereas they comprise no more than 24% of the league.

Including biracials is just silly. Black people tend to follow the one drop rule, nearly without exception. Biracials are regarded by them as being black, period.

 

[CallMeBruce]

Including biracials is just silly. Black people tend to follow the one drop rule, nearly without exception. Biracials are regarded by them as being black, period.

Yes, that's the part that's silly.

 

[boba]

This made me laugh. You're out of your element and you sound ridiculous.

That post has me wondering if "Taste" is Frank Ivy's new handle. Only Frank could pack that much stupid into any given post.

 

[TasteofUConn]

The finals is going to be all about matchups and health. Nobody on the GSWs is particularly dominant other than Steph The Jedi Curry, who is otherworldly. As he goes, so will the GSWs go. The question becomes can the taller Cavs dog him enough to disrupt him and contain him. If they can, then it could be a great series. If they can't, then the GSWs would seem to be the strong favorites. As for throwing people at LeBron, the GSWs gave up 128, 98, and 106 in 3 of the 4 games. Their defense doesn't look as good as their #1 ranking this season.
In the post season, Cleveland is #1 in points allowed, #2 in points per shot, #1 in FG%, #1 in 3pt FG% - by a lot at .281%. GSWs are somewhere in the 3-6 range for most of those. Sure, sure, I know the east sucks and the Cav's #s are all therefore skewed horribly, but there is a very clear trend for the Cavaliers, and that is their defense has tightened up considerably in the post season. And I'll say it, notwithstanding the fact that I liked the Love trade - Love on the bench makes them a better defensive team - they are fairly long and quick. And with Dirty Dela, they can play hardball .

 

[superjohn]

What on earth constitutes a flagrant in the NBA? Howard just set a pick by giving a forearm shiver to Iguadola's shoulder/neck and it's not a flagrant. He gives a playful little push to Bogut's chest in the first half and it's a flagrant. He swings at Bogut's face last game and it's just a flagrant. There is no rhyme or reason as to how things are officiated.

 

[Gurleyman]

John Starks could be off the hook in terms of most memorable Game 7 train wreck. Although his was in the finals.

 

[superjohn]

John Starks could be off the hook in terms of most memorable Game 7 train wreck. Although his was in the finals.

Doubtful that a superstar has ever had that bad of a performance in a big game. 13 turnovers with 2 field goals, he was dribbling it off his freaking foot.

 

[Gurleyman]

Doubtful that a superstar has ever had that bad of a performance in a big game. 13 turnovers with 2 field goals, he was dribbling it off his freaking foot.

Darn - you quoted me after I wrote "game 7" instead of "elimination game". Got my brain turned in knots.

 

[tjhusky]

What on earth constitutes a flagrant in the NBA? Howard just set a pick by giving a forearm shiver to Iguadola's shoulder/neck and it's not a flagrant. He gives a playful little push to Bogut's chest in the first half and it's a flagrant. He swings at Bogut's face last game and it's just a flagrant. There is no rhyme or reason as to how things are officiated.

The NBA doesn't care 1 bit about DH's thug play. He should have been ejected last game and the league could have done that after the fact.

Tonight he clearly stepped into Iguadolo to get the full force of his weight into the hit. He aimed right at his head and made a square hit. Terrible calls and no league fines are a joke.

 

[Robertelamin]

Meh, he had nothing to lose at that point since he would likely have been gone the next game anyway. I do think the NBA needs to revisit how they call the flagrant fouls with all the refs. it is too inconsistent.

 

[bfair]

bron is the best player ever and he will prove it this finals... Betting my house on it!!! I love curry and love watching him but lebron is out to prove something and make the city of cleveland's dream come true... cleveland in 5

 

[tzznandrew]

bron is the best player ever and he will prove it this finals... Betting my house on it!!! I love curry and love watching him but lebron is out to prove something and make the city of cleveland's dream come true... cleveland in 5

1) He's not the best player ever, at least not yet.
2) Is your house also bet on Cleveland in 5, specifically? What do I have to do to get in on that bet, because you have him beating Golden State on the road twice in three games...when they've only lost at home three times all year.

I get people who think since LeBron is the best player he should win this series, but, as I've pointed out, this reminds me of last year. He's taken a fundamentally flawed team to the Finals, but that team hasn't looked as flawed as they are because the East is garbage. This Cavs team is probably equivalent to last year's Heat, but the Warriors are better than last year's Spurs.

 

[TasteofUConn]

bron is the best player ever and he will prove it this finals... Betting my house on it!!!

Do you live in Detroit?

 

[TasteofUConn]

What do I have to do to get in on that bet, because you have him beating Golden State on the road twice in three games...

Seems impossible at this point. Less heart-driven Cavs fans are praying to for the proverbial "steal one" at GS and then fight like mad to win at home. Should be a fun series. Hope CT is okay - bleeding from the ear is just awful.

 

[CallMeBruce]

The Warriors are definitely the better, more complete team, but nobody on that team is as good as Bron, so I wouldn't be shocked if he pulled something off. I'm still betting the Warriors hold serve and win in 7.

 

[tzznandrew]

The Warriors are definitely the better, more complete team, but nobody on that team is as good as Bron, so I wouldn't be shocked if he pulled something off. I'm still betting the Warriors hold serve and win in 7.

That's how I feel. If the Cavs win, it's going to be a hard fought series; they won't run away from the Warriors. The Warriors, on the other hand, could run away with the series.

You have to expect there's one game LeBron just plays out of his mind, and you have to hope that Irving is healthy enough to have one of those vintage Irving games. That happens, and they pull off those two games, the Cavs have a real shot.

Thompson's injury could play a role, if the concussion syndromes aren't gone by Game 1. But we also have until 6/4 until Game 1. Should help Clay and Kyrie.

I wish Love were healthy so that we could see the series at it's apex.

 

[Hoophound]

I'd love to see this series with Love playing. Nonetheless, I think LeBron can elevate his team and win it. His supporting cast has really grown into their roles and they went from struggling to steamrolling. It definitely seems that the Warriors are a more complete team but the Cavs have LeBron and then they have assassin types like J.R. Smith. They aren't the type of team to lack confidence. I think the first team that blinks at home loses and I expect the Cavs to win once in the first 2 games. So, I say Cavs in 6.

 

[tzznandrew]

I'd love to see this series with Love playing. Nonetheless, I think LeBron can elevate his team and win it. His supporting cast has really grown into their roles and they went from struggling to steamrolling. It definitely seems that the Warriors are a more complete team but the Cavs have LeBron and then they have assassin types like J.R. Smith. They aren't the type of team to lack confidence. I think the first team that blinks at home loses and I expect the Cavs to win once in the first 2 games. So, I say Cavs in 6.

Let's remember who they steamrolled. They didn't steamroll the Bulls. They steamrolled an injured and mediocre Hawks team.

Meanwhile, the Warriors have beaten 3 teams that would give the Cavs a series, and did so losing only one more game.

The Cavs look good. But they did so against a subpar team (subpar due to key injuries).

 

[Hoophound]

Let's remember who they steamrolled. They didn't steamroll the Bulls. They steamrolled an injured and mediocre Hawks team. Meanwhile, the Warriors have beaten 3 teams that would give the Cavs a series, and did so losing only one more game. The Cavs look good. But they did so against a subpar team (subpar due to key injuries).

I agree with you, and but I feel like the Cavs are playing the best that they have all year. Being a UConn fan, that means a lot. LeBron can completely carry a decent cast of characters. He's definitely got that to work with. I agree, the Warriors are better, but I just have a feeling this is the year LeBron establishes himself as a Jordan level talent.

 

[Scoe]

Im torn on who to pick you look at it on paper and the season as a whole you would take GS, the eye test tells you Cleveland of late I know they have come out of the east but how have they done against those teams steam roll them. If Lebron wins it he is in the discussion for GOAT, if Curry wins it he's already a 1st ballot HOF, he's already a lock for the Hall.

Lebron will be ready but will his team mates is the question. Remember in in the 1990 playoffs MJ was ready to win a title and his younger teammates were not they were a year away. Lebron will have to be a little selfish and play like MJ did in the 93 Finals. JR and Kyrie will have to average about 20 in this series, and other guys will have to average anywhere from 6-10 a game. The Cavs will be favored next year they would have more experience and a healthy Kevin Love (assuming he returns) and Varajeo. I say it goes 7 games and I say Cleveland pulls it off if Kyrie is healthy but if he's not then GS in 6.

 

[tzznandrew]

I agree with you, and but I feel like the Cavs are playing the best that they have all year. Being a UConn fan, that means a lot. LeBron can completely carry a decent cast of characters. He's definitely got that to work with. I agree, the Warriors are better, but I just have a feeling this is the year LeBron establishes himself as a Jordan level talent.

He can carry a team to the Finals, but in 2007 and 2014 he had the clearly inferior team, and got trucked each time.

I also don't get this narrative that the Cavs are steam-rolling people.

They did beat a sub-.500 Celtics team in 4, but only 1 of those games was decided by double figures. Granted, no one thought the Cavs would lose, but this was with Love. Against the Bulls, they were a corner 3 from being down 3-1. If and buts, I know, but that was a close series that could go either way, certainly not a steam-roll.

And then we come to the Hawks. They killed a Korver-less, Carroll-less, Thabo-less Hawks team already down 3-0 in Game 4. But Game 3 was an OT game and 1-2 were close throughout. These weren't blowouts. I mean, who is better, the current Hawks, minus their only player who can guard LeBron and a few others, or the Rockets? The Warriors margin of victory in wins was better than the Cavs margin of victory.

TL;DR: The Cavs beat the 40-win Celtics, 50-win Bulls, and 60-win (but hugely injured) Hawks by an average of 10.75ppg; the Warriors beat the 45-win Pelicans, 55-win Grizzlies, and 56-win Rockets by an average of 12.6ppg.