One of the G.O.A.T talks about a Rising Superstar...

[JS]

NB - it was sometime in December when Geno was quoted as saying 'Stewart being our best 3 point shooter is an indication that not everything is perfect in our world' or words to that effect - at the time Stewart was hitting .450+ from three.

Can see his point. Been trying to think of an example of a 6'4" post player leading a major team in 3 point shooting over a statistically significant number of attempts and period of time.

Couldn't think of anybody.

Let alone a post player whose main and very successful contribution is to be unstoppable down low on offense and a demon rebounder, shot and pass blocker/tipper, amazingly swift runner of the floor and a not too shabby ball thief.

Am not particularly comfortable weighing in on who's the "greatest" -- college level, cross-position, active players on the same team who cooperate beautifully.

Maybe in retrospect when they've moved on to the next level.

 

[UcMiami]

Can see his point. Been trying to think of an example of a 6'4" post player leading a major team in 3 point shooting over a statistically significant number of attempts and period of time.

Couldn't think of anybody.

Let alone a post player whose main and very successful contribution is to be unstoppable down low on offense and a demon rebounder, shot and pass blocker/tipper, amazingly swift runner of the floor and a not too shabby ball thief.

Am not particularly comfortable weighing in on who's the "greatest" -- college level, cross-position, active players on the same team who cooperate beautifully.

Maybe in retrospect when they've moved on to the next level.

Too lazy to check, but I think a certain Australian out in Seattle may in fact have done so for an extended period if not for a whole year. And I would suspect that a certain ex Husky (brief though it was) has probably done the same in both college and the pros.

 

[VAUConnFan]

Winning in basketball is and will always be a function of the team and great players within that team function. As has been mentioned, far too much is made of the three championship teams on which Ms Taurasi played, the last two with, supposedly, leass than steallar talent as her claim to being the GOAT at UConn. yes, compared tot he 2002 team the 2003 and 2004 teams do not match up. But Ms Taurasi did not win those championships by herself. There were rebounds that had to be grabbed, picks that had t be set, offenses and players that had to be defended. Ms Taurasi was blessed to have very good teammates in 2003 and 2004.
Why then, if Ms Taurasi's individual talents are so transcendant did it take her Phoenix Mercury team four years to even make the playoffs? However, as the team around her got better(read: when Cappie Pondexter joined the team), Taurasi and the Mercury became champions. Pondexter leaves the Mercury and Phoenix slides until Brittney Griner joins the team; A Phoenix team that is obviously darn good without her considering last season's success.
Does Ms Taurasi have a defensive play in her UConn archive that comes close to the sequence Maya had against Seton Hall her freshman year, the sequence of which was so mind boggling it is hard to keep the exact sequnce straight, but in it she blocked a shot, chased a ball out of bounds, saved it falling into the stands which led to a Ketia Swanier layup, then on the very next play, Maya did something on the defensive end that led to an and one on the other end of the floor.
Does Ms Taurasi have a hustle play in her archive coming anywhere close to the plays Maya Moore made against DePaul and against Texas in the second round of the 2008 tournament.

IMO, Maya Moore was better offensively than Diana Taurasi, but will allow that it is a debatable point. But defense, hustle, and influence on the game is where Maya separates herself from the pack.

It is OK to like Ms Taurasi more, but to say she was a better player at UConn than Maya Moore. Where? At what aspect of the game? Points, rebounds, shooting percentage, games won, winning percentage, strength of schedule. My goodness, where does it end? The four losses UConn sustained in the Maya era, not a bad one among them: Rutgers, Stanford, Stanford, and Notre Dame. Two losses in the tournament and two on the road; All to outstanding teams with outstanding players.

Basketball is a team game. Championships are won by teams with very good players. UConn 2003 and UConn 2004 had some very good players in addition to Diana Taurasi. For those who still want to use the ring count as the separator, IMO, suggests that it was Maya Moore's fault that UConn did not win three championships while she was here. We all remember the Notre Dame game. Anyone here willing to lay that loss solely at Maya's feet?

 

[hoophuskee]

It's difficult to explain, but okay I'll try. I wasn't attempting to be outrageous or contrarian. I really do believe it. There are obviously incredible, god-given differences in terms of their physical attributes- Moriah will never dunk the ball, nor at a wiry 5'7" will she ever be able to defend a 6'4" power player inside. But her mid-range jumper and her 3-pointer are just as good as Stewie's; Moriah's handle and her passing skills are clearly superior; despite Stewie's incredible length, athleticism and the shot-blocking skills that come with it, Moriah is every bit as talented a defender, and one-on-one I think she's better while Stewie's strength is more as an off-ball, help defender. Stewie is incredibly tough, taking a beating on a regular basis, and so does Moriah, but Stewie is built a little better to handle it and gets a few more calls as the NCAA POY, while #4 continually takes a licking and keeps on ticking. Moriah's toughness and motor are epic.

That said, there's no doubt that a great and talented big kid almost always garners more attention and acclaim than a great little one. Objectively comparing a point guard to a forward is kind of impossible, apples and oranges, where very different skill sets have to be evaluated. (Another shaky justification for my claim.)

While it's not necessarily pertinent to this discussion, we constantly hear what an insane work ethic Stewie has, to become the best player she can be. The exact same can be said about Moriah. What Moriah does on both sides of the ball, the unreal energy she expends every second, the way she gets her team going as its leader (like a great Stewie play does) is spectacular. Both have been pretty much equally indispensable and significant to UConn's special run.

My reasoning is a lot intuitive, hard to verbalize, and based upon the eye test by a fan who is a profound neophyte in judging the nebulous determinants of "greatness."

But pound for pound (and inch for inch) there is nobody better and nobody tougher in WCBB today than Moriah Jefferson. [A mini-version of the USS Missouri- MIGHTY MO.]

I love Mojeff and I've made clear over-and-over again I prefer guard/wing play. Though Stewie can play like a wing. But Stewie is superior. What does "pound-for-pound" mean in the grand scheme of things? IMO nothing. Who is better? Stewie. Which is why no doubt she'll be picked 1st in WNBA. She is better.

Defensively- MoJeff is tremendous one-on-one lockdown defender as long as you're around her size. Stewie affects all positions defensively.

Offensively until recently Stewie led the team in 3pt shooting. MoJeff now 1st. We've heard Geno say teams are packing in their defense in order to protect the paint. It has to do with BOTH Tuck and Stewie but Stewie doe get double teamed or triple. This allows MJ to do her thing a bit easier when two players or the paint is packed in guarding. Stewie. Stew forces at least double teams whne she goes inside. Defenses plan to pack the paint because of her (and Tuck). Her mere presence is awesome - on both sides. Hard to measure but imo it does mean a lot.

 

[hoophuskee]

1. Stats describe what you are seeing and do it better than just seeing it. For example, you can't tell a player who shoots 30% 3-pt shooter over a season from a 40% one over the course of one game (unless they're both taking 10 shots in that game and even then, players experience highs and lows). Not everything can be quantified, of course, but a lot of things can be.

2. Please don't assume I haven't watched the games. Thanks!

3. Diana was a better defender than Maya? Did you watch the games? Maya didn't have nearly twice as many steals as D for no reason. See, STATS.

4. If you can't explain why player X is better than player Y, even in a qualitative manner, your dismissal of arguments you don't care for is little more than nattering. Huskies Rule did a fine job of it.

5. Diana sacrificed stats, obviously, but you don't believe that Maya sacrificed stats, too? That's quite the cognitive dissonance you have going on.

6. "Understand what they mean to their team." Oh, did Maya mean something different to the team than Diana?

Wally - I got to say months ago - you got me rethinking Lobo vs Tina. so much so - I wouldn't argue either way. A lot of it has to do with I didn't see Lobo much. Personally I give Tina for me. Only because I never saw much of RL an I actually did see Tina become a monster. Therefore - can't convince anyone. And we have had our differences regarding 2001.

**But in this case - I am not arguing -- but I never got a chance to watch Bill Russell much. But for example I used to post a lot on the old ESPN Boards - especially NBA. I got to know a Laker fan pretty good along with another fan that moved around a lot. They both said Russell was best ever. OFC many disagree but these were guys I respected. When I look at lists Russell is always near the top etc. Heck Phil Jackson said if he had 1st pick over anybody else his pick would be Russell.

I read somewhere - I can't find the link anymore in which Russell spoke of how he would defend Wilt at times. Let him score early on - then by the 4th qtr Wilt's team was out of rhythm - he and the team would play Wilt much tougher and that's why Bill thought he got the better of Wilt. Thus Wilt didn't make his teammates better in these instances.

*************SO even in this case if you don't put Russell ahead of Wilt - where would you put him-- specifically interms of beign a great overall player? Please don't distinguish "Best winner ever" blah blah blah. The blah blah blah is not a bash on you or anyone--- maybe etc etc etc more appropriate. But where would you put Russell on a list of all-time great players? Top 5? Top 10? Top 20? Why would he be anywhere near there if his stats aren't that great? What do the stats tell us about Russell?

*** And as far as DT vs Maya- yes Maya sacrificed some shooting for passing. IMO DT sacrificed a lot more. She was a guard. SO I think her assist numbers for example were higher. Therefore also counting assists - those assists (getting players involved/ out of rhythm like Russell spoke of) plus the points could be the difference of UCONN beating Texas in 2003 vs losing to Notre Dame 2011.

 

[Wally East]

It is OK to like Ms Taurasi more, but to say she was a better player at UConn than Maya Moore. Where? At what aspect of the game?

Bravo

The four losses UConn sustained in the Maya era, not a bad one among them

Well, that '03-'04 Villanova team was just a killer! So too was '03-'04 Boston College!

 

[Wally East]

*************SO even in this case if you don't put Russell ahead fo WIlt - where would you put him-- specifically interms of beign a great overall player. Please don't distinguish "Best winner ever" blah blah blah. The blah blah blah is not a bash on you or anyone--- maybe etc etc etc more appropriate. But where would you put Russell on a list of all-time great players? Top 5? Top 10? Top 20? Why would he be anywhere near there if his stats aren't that great.

Yeah, but his stats ARE that great. Russell AVERAGED 22.5 rebounds per game for his career. AVERAGED. That's second all-time (just a smidge behind Wilt). Without thinking about it seriously, he's a top 5 center or better and probably top 15 or 20 overall.

*** And as far as DT vs Maya- yes Maya sacrificed some shooting for passing. IMO DT sacrificed a lot more. She was a guard. SO I think her assist numbers for example were higher. Therefore also counting assists - those assists (getting players involved/ out of rhythm like Russell spoke of) could be the difference of UCONN beating Texas vs losing to Notre Dame.

Okay but then you'd expect the margin between D's career assists per game and Maya's to be greater than one. Does a single assist make up for 4 ppg and 4 rpg?

 

[hoophuskee]

It is OK to like Ms Taurasi more, but to say she was a better player at UConn than Maya Moore. Where? At what aspect of the game?

Offensively if you combine passing and scoring. As I posted to Wally just a little while ago- Bill Russell used to speak of how they defended Wilt - Let him score with not much resistance then really go after him in the 4th quarter. Russell would say that would put Wilt's teammates out of rhythm by the 4thquarter. Which Russell felt that was eventually why his team's got the better of Wilt's.

Maya was a scorer as her number 1 strength. DT was more of a combination passer/scorer. So who can argue that if DT was on the 2011 team instead of Maya that she wouldn't have gotten her teammate more involved than Maya did? So we mention how Maya got no help. Well maybe Maya's game doesn't allow for others to get as easily involved as guard like DT, right?

 

[Fiftyish]

Maria Conlon was able to play like she did because Diana made those players around her better players.

Just to deviate from this debate a little.......do we all remember what many of our fellow BY'ers thought of Maria Conlon during her freshman, sophomore, and part of her junior year? Shouldn't have been recruited. No speed. Can't play at D1 level.
Like Maria, I'm also from the Valley so she was always one of my favorite kids to root for. She turned into a pretty good D1 player; steady and dependable and able to drop in a 3 every now and then.

 

[hoophuskee]

Yeah, but his stats ARE that great. Russell AVERAGED 22.5 rebounds per game for his career. AVERAGED. That's second all-time (just a smidge behind Wilt). Without thinking about it seriously, he's a top 5 center or better and probably top 15 or 20 overall.



Okay but then you'd expect the margin between D's career assists per game and Maya's to be greater than one. Does a single assist make up for 4 ppg and 4 rpg?

1-- SO you are saying rebounds per game-- that ONE stat is the qualifier reason why you can say he is top ten all-time? A rebounding stat? SO where is Rodman in your all-time great list? His OREB% and DREB% are on Russell's and Wilt's level.

 

[Wally East]

Just to deviate from this debate a little..do we all remember what many of our fellow BY'ers thought of Maria Conlon during her freshman, sophomore, and part of her junior year? Shouldn't have been recruited. No speed. Can't play at D1 level.
Like Maria, I'm also from the Valley so she was always one of my favorite kids to root for. She turned into a pretty good D1 player; steady and dependable and able to drop in a 3 every now and then.

More than every now and then -- her senior year she shot 41.1% for 3-pters (I know, I know, STATS.)

 

[NoelAustin]

Offensively if you combine passing and scoring. As I posted to Wally just a little while ago- Bill Russell used to speak of how they defended Wilt - Let him score with not much resistance then really go after him in the 4th quarter. Russell would say that would put Wilt's teammates out of rhythm by the 4thquarter. Which Russell felt that was eventually why his team's got the better of Wilt's.

Maya was a scorer as her number 1 strength. DT was more of a combination passer/scorer. So who can argue that if DT was on the 2011 team instead of Maya that she wouldn't have gotten her teammate more involved than Maya did? So we mention how Maya got no help. Well maybe Maya's game doesn't allow for others to get as easily involved as guard like DT, right?

In the 2004 championship game DT had a subpar game shooting and finished with 17 points. However UConn was able to prevail over an underacheiving TN team with one AA, Shyra Ely. That Tennessee team was less talented than the Notre Dame team that ended Maya's college career in 2011. And Maya scored 36 points in that losing effort.

 

[hoophuskee]

In the 2004 championship game DT had a subpar game shooting and finished with 17 points. However UConn was able to prevail over an underacheiving TN team with one AA, Shyra Ely. That Tennessee team was less talented than the Notre Dame team that ended Maya's college career in 2011. And Maya scored 36 points in that losing effort.

What about the final four game in which DT had to go through Minnesota? That was an over-achieving very tough-minded gritty team. A lot like ND.

And again I'll mention you are throwing ppg at me. If you are a guard - and you are also an excellent passer how many assists did DT have? Maybe ot many but I can tell you Maay had 2 assists in that ND game.

As we have all seen a lot of hoop, was Maya a special passer? Was she a creator when it came to passing? Was DT?

If we can "forgive' Stewie's low point per game last year vs ND- why focus on scoring so much? Or for those that favor Steiw is last year's finals from Stewie in which she scored just 8 points.

Now when we are comparing Bird vs MoJeff let's go back to MJ's frosh and soph years in the final four. In the final four in her soph years anyone can look at the games and see that BOTH Stanford and ND were allowing MoJeff to shoot wide open from the outside anytime she wanted. Who EVER did that to Sue Bird? Leaving her deliberately wide open? So if we were to look at stats is her being left wide open so the opposing team can collapse inside the same as Sue Bird bricking in Oklahoma finals?

 

[Wally East]

1-- SO you are saying rebounds per game-- that ONE stat is the qualifier reason why you can say he is top ten all-time? A rebounding stat? SO where is Rodman in your all-time great list? His OREB% and DREB% are on Russell's and Wilt's level.

Rodman is 12th all-time with a much more earthly 13 rpg. Rodman averaged 7 ppg while Bill averaged 15 ppg (and nearly 5 assists per game, t00). Sorry for not mentioning that before. So, yes, if you average 15 and 22, yes, you get into the Hall. (Quick ranking: Wilt, Kareem, David Robinson, Russell, Shaq, Hakeem, but that's just off the top of my head.)

I can't find Russell or Wilts REB% numbers to compare. Do you have a link because at basketball-reference.com, those stats aren't there for Russell or Chamberlain. On that site they don't start until '70-'71 for the NBA.

 

[Kibitzer]

Now that Russ has been made part of this discussion, permit two comments.

1. His greatest skill was blocking shots and no stats were maintained in his era.

2. The quality that set him apart from any player to ever play the game was his incredible ability to inspire his teammates to heights they never imagined. Proof? How else could guys like Jim Luscotoff and Larry Siegfried earn five NC rings? Eight for Satch Sanders?

Wilt was beyond category. He once averaged 50 ppg. He also averaged over 48 mpg over a grueling NBA season. And led the league in assists in another.

But somehow Russ earned more rings than any pro player in any sport. Ever. And he did it because he was incomparably inspirational. I rest my case.

 

[Wally East]

As we have all seen a lot of hoop, was Maya a special passer? Was she a creator when it came to passing? Was DT?

One of them averaged 4.5 assists per game. One of them averaged 3.5 assists per game. There's not THAT much difference.

And, yes, Maya was a gifted passer. That's why she has 544 career assists.

 

[boontonbomber]

She just is. Years and years of watching her play. It's fairly obvious to me.

I have no problem with you disagreeing with me, I'll just consider you wrong. And you can pick Moore, and I'll take DT and we'll beat your team everyday and twice on Sunday.

You'd have to do without her the second game on Sunday, as her Russian sugar daddies would not her to play 2 games the same day.

 

[hoophuskee]

Rodman is 12th all-time with a much more earthly 13 rpg. Rodman averaged 7 ppg while Bill averaged 15 ppg (and nearly 5 assists per game, t00). Sorry for not mentioning that before. So, yes, if you average 15 and 22, yes, you get into the Hall. (Quick ranking: Wilt, Kareem, David Robinson, Russell, Shaq, Hakeem, but that's just off the top of my head.)

I can't find Russell or Wilts REB% numbers to compare. Do you have a link because at basketball-reference.com, those stats aren't there for Russell or Chamberlain. On that site they don't start until '70-'71 for the NBA.

You choose to look at rebounds per game but the only reason he is averaging so many rebounds per game is because he played so many minutes and players of that era played at a faster pace and shot a lot more bricks thus resulting in more rebounding opportunities. Because Russell has a lot more rebounding opportunities that shouldn't count against Rodman (BTW I hate Rodman). Thus if it is about stats stats stats - then Rodman is at Wilt's and Russell's numbers. Below is one link in whch statistical estimates are used in which the article states they are pretty near accurate. But I have to say- using just the rebounding stats of average 22 rebounds vs 15 means the guy with 22 is "better"- imo that is much more flawed than oreb% and dreb%. The guy (or woman) is using STATS to show Rodman may be a greater rebounder than both.

https://skepticalsports.com/the-case-for-dennis-rodman-part-14-c-rodman-v-ancient-history/

And if you want to include stats then if we are looking at Russell's scoring - we have to look at his anemic fg%. Why is it good for Russell that we're using stats of scoring in order to elevate Russell if his STATS are SHOWING US his shooting is so lousy? If we're going to use stats then we have to count fg% from big men and Russell's - if you just look at the fg stats- Russell's are downright awful. So again why is he so highly ranked?

 

[hoophuskee]

One of them averaged 4.5 assists per game. One of them averaged 3.5 assists per game. There's not THAT much difference.

And, yes, Maya was a gifted passer. That's why she has 544 career assists.

So someone that averages 3.5 assists is a "gifted passer?"

Can you tell me if you feel there is a difference between passing great let's say vs a Notre Dame or vs a University of Hartford?

 

[Wally East]

Can you tell me if you feel there is a difference between passing great let's say vs a Notre Dame or vs a University of Hartford?

Nope, not doing single game comparisons. Players have good games and bad games, such as 1 for 15 vs. ND or 3 for 13 vs Villanova or 4 for 15 vs ND or ...

Yes, people have called players "gifted passers" when averaging that many assists per game or even fewer.

 

[johnnyc]

Well if it is the eye test.....there's a reason Maya is talking about Stewart and not Jefferson.

 

[Scud49]

Now that Russ has been made part of this discussion, permit two comments.

1. His greatest skill was blocking shots and no stats were maintained in his era.

2. The quality that set him apart from any player to ever play the game was his incredible ability to inspire his teammates to heights they never imagined. Proof? How else could guys like Jim Luscotoff and Larry Siegfried earn five NC rings? Eight for Satch Sanders?

Wilt was beyond category. He once averaged 50 ppg. He also averaged over 48 mpg over a grueling NBA season. And led the league in assists in another.

But somehow Russ earned more rings than any pro player in any sport. Ever. And he did it because he was incomparably inspirational. I rest my case.

And Russ would often times block a shot, control it, flick it out to a teammate for a fast break and layup. Other times he would just make an opponent alter a shot and create a turnover, another form of "disruption".

Simply knowing you have a teammate who can accomplish those types of things, it is truly inspirational.

 

[VAUConnFan]

Maya was a scorer as her number 1 strength. DT was more of a combination passer/scorer. So who can argue that if DT was on the 2011 team instead of Maya that she wouldn't have gotten her teammate more involved than Maya did? So we mention how Maya got no help. Well maybe Maya's game doesn't allow for others to get as easily involved as guard like DT, right?

1. We are talking about one of four losses in the Maya era. One out of four; In an era that included a 90 game winning streak. Whether Maya's game allows for others to get involved or not(again, you are going to have to supplement that argument considering that Tina Charles and Renee Montgomery were AAs during Maya's time at Storrs), it was a formula/coaching decision that worked all but four times in four years.
2. UConn did not lose that national semifinal to Notre Dame due to lack of offense or because Maya got no help. UConn played well enough offensively to win that game. They scored 32 points in the first half and went into the locker room with a six point lead. UConn scored 31 points in the second half and lost by 9 with Notre Dame exploding for 46 second half points; Reminiscent of the 2001 national semifinal against the same program. A team is not going to win too many tournament games when an opposing team gets that hot; And, when an individual opposing player plays a game that puts them among all time great opponent performances.
3. Are you suggesting that scoring was not Ms Taurasi's Number 1 strength? She could flat out score.

 

[hoophuskee]

Nope, not doing single game comparisons. Players have good games and bad games, such as 1 for 15 vs. ND or 3 for 13 vs Villanova or 4 for 15 vs ND or ...

Yes, people have called players "gifted passers" when averaging that many assists per game or even fewer.

1-- Name one - who was a gifted player with just a 3 assist career average.

2-- I just showed you the data - the stats why Rodman was a better rebounder than Russell and Wilt. And you have the stats at your fingertips that Russell's fg% was God-awful. So isn't it better that he doesn't shoot? A guy taking that many shots with such a crummy %, how can that be good? Secondly, what kind of defensive stats do you show for Russell? What stats are out there that he was a great defender than Unseld, Reed, Bellamy or Hayes?

3-- So you don't think looking game-to-game matters / who is the opponent etc? So the type of stats you have been throwing out on here - if we were to use the stats that you and some others have been using, how can you justify Tuck being better than Gabby while Tuck gets close to 7 more minutes per game? Gabby shoots better from the floor. She shoots ft's better. She has a higher rebounding average. If you gave her the same minutes as Tuck she'd have a slightly higher scoring average. The only thing is Tuck averages 3 assists with about 1.5 turnovers while Gabby is a little over 1 ass ist and little over 1 turnover. Gabby averages more blocks and more steals. So while Tuck has more minutes ---> other than assists to to ratio of 1.5-to-1 for Tuck vs Gabby for 1-to-1 ---> Gabby beats out Tuck on everything else.

And we don't know who the better defender is, do we? Unless we have defensive rating stats? So you and I can't use some logic and look at stats vs the top tier teams and see that Tuck is superior? Wouldn't those stats more reflect who really is that much better?

 

[jsss66]

It's difficult to explain, but okay I'll try. I wasn't attempting to be outrageous or contrarian. I really do believe it. There are obviously incredible, god-given differences in terms of their physical attributes- Moriah will never dunk the ball, nor at a wiry 5'7" will she ever be able to defend a 6'4" power player inside. But her mid-range jumper and her 3-pointer are just as good as Stewie's; Moriah's handle and her passing skills are clearly superior; despite Stewie's incredible length, athleticism and the shot-blocking skills that come with it, Moriah is every bit as talented a defender, and one-on-one I think she's better while Stewie's strength is more as an off-ball, help defender. Stewie is incredibly tough, taking a beating on a regular basis, and so does Moriah, but Stewie is built a little better to handle it and gets a few more calls as the NCAA POY, while #4 continually takes a licking and keeps on ticking. Moriah's toughness and motor are epic.

That said, there's no doubt that a great and talented big kid almost always garners more attention and acclaim than a great little one. Objectively comparing a point guard to a forward is kind of impossible, apples and oranges, where very different skill sets have to be evaluated. (Another shaky justification for my claim.)

While it's not necessarily pertinent to this discussion, we constantly hear what an insane work ethic Stewie has, to become the best player she can be. The exact same can be said about Moriah. What Moriah does on both sides of the ball, the unreal energy she expends every second, the way she gets her team going as its leader (like a great Stewie play does) is spectacular. Both have been pretty much equally indispensable and significant to UConn's special run.

My reasoning is a lot intuitive, hard to verbalize, and based upon the eye test by a fan who is a profound neophyte in judging the nebulous determinants of "greatness."

But pound for pound (and inch for inch) there is nobody better and nobody tougher in WCBB today than Moriah Jefferson. [A mini-version of the USS Missouri- MIGHTY MO.]

I agree. Moriah ranks right up there with the best. She is a terrific force on both sides of the ball, even though she she is unselfish on offense. Mariah deserves more accolades and more ink.