The View From Section 241 — Army | The Boneyard

The View From Section 241 — Army

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Yes, this was a great season and players and coaches alike should be proud of that. That’s fine for a season end post, and I’ll do one eventually. But it doesn’t excuse what happened yesterday. We were the better team coming into this game, and we played more than well enough from scrimmage for 3 quarters that this should have been a comfortable win. And yet, it ended as a blowout loss. WTF happened? The short answer is if you shoot yourself in the foot enough times, eventually your foot is going to hurt, and then if you keep doing it you’re not going to be able to run any more. And boy, did we find way after way after way to shoot ourselves in the foot while being generally the better team from scrimmage:

So what happened? Where do you want to start. First, we spotted them 7 points by giving up the blocked punt TD right from the start. In a game where they didn’t want to throw at all, and we didn’t want to throw a lot, playing from ahead was critical and that play changed a game that should have had us up big in the first 20 minutes to one where we never got in front of them by more than a nose. I view the blocked punt as a combo of a low snap, the punter taking too much time and an unnecessarily risky scheme of not making any effort at all to even brush the outside guy. Any one of them different …. That then led to a coaching meltdown, and Mora benching Caratan, going to a walk on frosh who made two horrible punts that took us from a 50/50 game, where we were slightly behind but outplaying them, to one where we were two scores down. Penalty after penalty on offense, contributing to the first failure to score from the 1, but multiple drives killed by putting us in long yardage situations where we had to stop running the ball down their throat. The number of pre-snap offensive penalties this year was outrageous, and given the experience of the OL Chalton’s biggest failure. Then the two failures to score from 1st and goal from the one. Giving up 11 points. Now, while on both of those TDS were signaled on the field, I think the replays were pretty clear that neither was a TD (although both missed by inches and we lost a foot on the firat spot and two feet on the second). The play calling also contributed. Throwing to Rayonte Brown on 3rd and goal from the 1? Really? The pass was easily catchable by anyone who turned and ran, instead of trying to backpeddle for 5 yards. The one defensive penalty at the end of the 1st half on Malcolm Bell, a soft PI that probably didn’t have to be called but did happen, where instead of getting the ball back and trying to add to a 3 point lead it led to us going into the locker room behind. And then, for the second straight game, taking the lead in the 3d Q and watching the D give up a 70 plus yard TD run on a reverse WITHOUT ANYONE EVER TOUCHING THE RUNNER.

Beyond all the breakdowns and gifts we gave them, I thought we outplayed them by a decent amount from scrimmage. There was zero reason the offense shouldn’t have been able to dominate the game from the beginning, and forcing Army out of its offense, except that we kept stopping ourselves from grabbing the game by the threat. And once they got up by two scores, game over. We hadn’t come back from a 2 score deficit all year, and the team that went 5-1 at home beating Fresno State, BC and Liberty went 1-5 on the road, losing perfectly winnable games against very mediocre Utah St, Ball State and Army teams.

So while I don’t want to turn this into a review of the season, because yesterday was a really really disappointing loss and should not be sugarcoated, this is an incredibly young team. Subject to the new reality of the transfer portal, we lose one starter (Jake Guidone) and Robert Burns on offense, and 2 and a half starters (Trey Wortham and Swenson, with Bouyer Randle — who I thought was great yesterday by the way — sharing a spot with Shearin based on how many DBs we play with) on D, and the roster overall was unbelievably young this year. And while I am not convinced Zion Turner will be our full time QB next year, he played well enough for us to win 6 games as a true frosh and I have no doubt he’ll be better if he is on the field next year. By the way — I thought he played very well until we fell two scores down, but the first pick we’ve seen before from him and is why we don’t open up the playback — he’s really bad in man coverage on seeing where he’s leading a WR to a corner or safety who will be coming off someone else and in position to make an easy play. But one of the things a more mature team will have to learn is being able to win on the road. Because getting above 6-6 next year, based on our schedule and assuming that teams next year are comparable to how they were this year (which won’t be the case), we’re going to have to be able to beat better teams on the road next year than we did this year if we’re going to get above 6-6.

So that is it for now. A very disappointing end to a very unexpectedly positive season, not that we were more than mediocre but that I thought it would take an entire roster change and a few years to get back to mediocre, and that was without knowing we’d lose all of our starters at the skill positions. As I said on the Bowl Math thread this morning, I expect the odds are good that we’ll be bowling, but we won’t know that for sure at least until next Sunday, and if there are enough bowl eligible teams possibly not until selection Sunday. I’ll do a 241 talking about the season as a whole another time, when the annoyance and disappointment from yesterday goes away a bit.
 
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I watched the game again yesterday. A second viewing can really do wonders. Excluding the overturned TDs we were screwed over mightily on many calls.

Benching Caratan did not work out well for us. I thought that was very strange.

And I am not sold on Charlton at all.

He just makes puzzling decisions. We just needed to keep running the ball. Why did we stop? Zion Turner does not throw accurately often enough. Why did we stop running so that Zion could throw the ball ahead of, behind and at the feet of our guys?

Our whole offense is predicated on ZT not throwing and ZT not throwing INTs.

This loss is 70% on the coaches and 30% on the players. I just don’t see how the team could compete yesterday with those decisions.
 

cohenzone

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Given how abysmal the last several seasons have been, my test has been can we be at least watchable, winning being gravy. Mora has us passing the watchable test with flying colors thanks largely to a leaps and bounds defensive improvement and a good O line with a stable of very good runners. Yesterday was certainly watchable even with the obvious failures to score and the bad punting.

I’m unconvinced by Turner. In fairness he was thrown into the starter role and was missing some important skill players. But aside from a strong arm, none of his decision making, his accuracy, timing in releasing his passes or foot speed/agility are very good. Does Phommachanh have a future? He showed an ability to move an offense.

Anyway, yesterday aside, this season gets a high grade from me and gives us something to look forward to. A bowl would be nice.
 
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We stopped running the ball because Army made a defensive adjustment (just as Ball State did) that stuffed our running game. They showed this on the TV broadcast. They started switching their LBs after the snap and that led to better identification of the holes and plugging them.

Once a team stuffs our run game our offense is essentially dead.
 
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We didn't know at the time that Utah St was mediocre and we lost our starting QB and WR for the season in the first qtr that game. It's easy to be critical in retrospect but this team was barely figuring out who they were at the time in a tough road environment.

But you're right about road games - next year we have to learn how to win them and to minimize mistakes. Ball St and Army were very winnable games.
 
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I think the long TD run by Murphy in the 3rd qtr broke us. It had been a mistake-prone game for us and we had just put together a long TD drive to get the lead back, then Army takes it back with one play. We couldn't do a thing right after that.
 

ClifSpliffy

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players, coaches, fans, facilities? tailgaters, band, record, future?
expectation for a bowl invite at regular season end, jim mora?
1376871035_ts20_00_closeup_of_kellogg_s_frosted_flakes_tony_the_tiger_they_re_great_cereal2-e1328579138782.jpg

i ain't greedy.


the winter pigskin, all slippery and whatnot (pretty darn chilly on the gridiron yesterday), is nothing like the summery one. movin' on.
 

SubbaBub

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Army's offense is designed to generate those long breakaways. Credit the D for not giving up more of them. Especially when we had obvious trouble getting to the pitch runner.

Yesterday was a giant freaking buzzkill for what should have been a capstone moment to a first winning season since the fiesta bowl. I have no idea why so many played so poorly in key moments.

It was obvious that staying in front was paramount and there was a lot of good leading to an improbable 2nd half lead before it all fell apart. The mistakes never got corrected and the dominance from scrimmage flipped completely as Charlton was forced to rely on Zion passing because Army's time of possession was going to limit our 4th quarter drives, which then did.

We allowed Army to get into a position to dictate the 2nd half in their favor and it played out just as they planned. Us having to pass the ball and execute on every drive while they ran the clock.

It's the first game in the Mora era they played well below their talent and the lowest of expectations.
 

Chin Diesel

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We stopped running the ball because Army made a defensive adjustment (just as Ball State did) that stuffed our running game. They showed this on the TV broadcast. They started switching their LBs after the snap and that led to better identification of the holes and plugging them.

Once a team stuffs our run game our offense is essentially dead.

that goes to in-game coaching and adjustments.
 
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I too am not sold on Charlton yet. Too many head scratching play calls in key situations. Credit to the Army D though on the goal line stands, but I think everyone and their mother knew it was going to be Burns up the middle.

I'm not sold on ZT yet either. I realize he's a true freshman that was thrown into the fire the first game of the season, but I did not see much improvement in his passing decisions over the next 11 games.

All that aside, to go 6-6 after the complete dumpster fire of the past 5 years is friggin' amazing!!
 
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We stopped running the ball because Army made a defensive adjustment (just as Ball State did) that stuffed our running game. They showed this on the TV broadcast. They started switching their LBs after the snap and that led to better identification of the holes and plugging them.

Once a team stuffs our run game our offense is essentially dead.

Yeah they showed that and the very next play we busted out a big run. Sorry but that explanation isn’t acceptable.
 

SubbaBub

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I too am not sold on Charlton yet. Too many head scratching play calls in key situations. Credit to the Army D though on the goal line stands, but I think everyone and their mother knew it was going to be Burns up the middle.

I'm not sold on ZT yet either. I realize he's a true freshman that was thrown into the fire the first game of the season, but I did not see much improvement in his passing decisions over the next 11 games.

All that aside, to go 6-6 after the complete dumpster fire of the past 5 years is friggin' amazing!!
Charlton has stuff to learn but if you credit our running game, overcoming injuries and Zion's lack of disastrous turnovers, you have to credit Charlton. The guy did a huge job this season with scheme and play calling. Once he stopped overuse of the gadget plays, he was on point. Players have to execute.

We should all pray he returns, or would you all refer going back to run, run, pass, punt?
 

hardcorehusky

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The Charlton hate is difficult to understand. We have a true freshman qb who is slow at reading defenses and is exposed if the first option is not open. Our OLine is good not great at run blocking(need to be able to open holes in short yardage and they aren't mobile enough to run a normal screen game. Out WR corp has been decimated by injury and our TE position has severe limitations. But Charlton is the problem? It isn't his fault the olne with a size advantage can't open a gap for a rb to get 1 yard? Is it his fault the oline gets 5 or more illegal procedures? A more experienced qb could change cadence and help but our qb is still trying to learn his basics.
What pass plays can he dial up if the qb has trouble reading defenses? Gadget plays have been hit and miss. The reason teams don't run them often is because they are high risk or high reward.
You can scheme so much when your hands are tied. Charlton deserves a raise considering what he worked with and what we accomplished. There is so much room for improvement offensively, it is exciting to see what yr 2 brings after the bowl game.
 

FfldCntyFan

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My guess on the hate towards Charlton is that too many of those complaining know football solely from playing Madden on XBox. They think that all that is required to change an offensive playbook is selecting a different one from a menu.

The reality is from the second quarter of the season forward we had a true freshman (meaning no spring practice with the team or staff) QB, we went nearly the entire season without our top two WRs and a very good amount of the season without our top two (a few games without our top three) RBs and what was basically a brand new OL.

We played an enormous percentage of our offensive plays with true freshman as our QB, top RB (Rosa) top receiving threat (Joly) yet people are complaining that we didn't play more wide open on offense.

There were numerous, extremely valid reasons to limiting the playbook. If someone wants to question Charlton, wait until he is a couple years into implementing what he wants to do.
 
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Charlton has done a very good job. The running game improved by leaps and bounds. He developed young receivers. The offensive line opened holes and provided a decent pocket. The offensive players, stats and victories all improved under difficult circumstances.

To be honest, squeezing six wins out of Zion borders on miraculous.
 
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My guess on the hate towards Charlton is that too many of those complaining know football solely from playing Madden on XBox. They think that all that is required to change an offensive playbook is selecting a different one from a menu.

The reality is from the second quarter of the season forward we had a true freshman (meaning no spring practice with the team or staff) QB, we went nearly the entire season without our top two WRs and a very good amount of the season without our top two (a few games without our top three) RBs and what was basically a brand new OL.

We played an enormous percentage of our offensive plays with true freshman as our QB, top RB (Rosa) top receiving threat (Joly) yet people are complaining that we didn't play more wide open on offense.

There were numerous, extremely valid reasons to limiting the playbook. If someone wants to question Charlton, wait until he is a couple years into implementing what he wants to do.

Stop.

You can’t dismiss the mis timed and terrible decision making when we trotted out Millen or calling high risk plays like Zion throwing down the middle, when it would be best to just keep it simple and maybe just punt.

Sometimes he calls the worst play imaginable given the situation and it’s maddening.
 
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Charlton has stuff to learn but if you credit our running game, overcoming injuries and Zion's lack of disastrous turnovers, you have to credit Charlton. The guy did a huge job this season with scheme and play calling. Once he stopped overuse of the gadget plays, he was on point. Players have to execute.

We should all pray he returns, or would you all refer going back to run, run, pass, punt?

Uhhh where is he going to go? I guess if Ambrose goy hired away then anything is possible.

I don’t want the guy fired but his judgement in certain situations is puzzling to say the least,

Like yesterday. Both times on the one yard line, heh just had to call a QB sneak. Why?
 
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I did think that the stripes took the whole Military Appreciation Day thing a bit too much to heart. Most egregious to me were the pass Interference call that kept the Army drive alive was questionable. Missing the obvious pancake block on BR that sprung the Army QB on that long run made me puke. But, the blocked punt and legit penalties killed the Huskies. Not the one way flags.

Hoping that a bowl calls, having another month of practices with such a young team will reap benefits for next year.
 

FfldCntyFan

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Stop.

You can’t dismiss the mis timed and terrible decision making when we trotted out Millen or calling high risk plays like Zion throwing down the middle, when it would be best to just keep it simple and maybe just punt.

Sometimes he calls the worst play imaginable given the situation and it’s maddening.
I seem to remember the first handful of Times Millen went in for some type of gadget play they seemed to work exceptionally well. I'm curious as to how he was wrong for being too conservative when the results of a conservative approach didn't work out yet he also was wrong when he chose to take risks and they didn't work out. If you want an opinion to be taken seriously you need to look at the entire picture, then judge the entire picture, not cherry pick things you don't like and judge it on that.

If we hadn't lost anyone on offense this season and ended up with the same offensive results, we still would have exceeded any realistic expectations by a considerable amount. Having done so with the injuries we had to deal with is borderline mind boggling.

Was I happy with the play calling on the first two first and goal series'? No, I personally would have preferred spreading the offense if we were going to attempt to force the ball up the middle but that doesn't some without potential pitfalls. Neither does a QB sneak, which for some reason you seem to believe would have guaranteed a TD every time, Thinking that we know our offensive personnel better than he does, that we know their grasp on the playbook better than he does or that we know how to attack the opponent's defense better than he does is delusional.

I don't expect his play calling to be perfect, better offensive minds than we could ever hope to land at UConn will never be perfect. Hell, Bill Walsh wasn't perfect and while I don't like the idea of using what could be interpreted as an Edsall reference, sometimes the result is due more to execution than play call.

If you want to gripe about Berhalter on the soccer forum, have at it. That type of football is obviously more in your wheelhouse than this version is.
 
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I seem to remember the first handful of Times Millen went in for some type of gadget play they seemed to work exceptionally well. I'm curious as to how he was wrong for being too conservative when the results of a conservative approach didn't work out yet he also was wrong when he chose to take risks and they didn't work out. If you want an opinion to be taken seriously you need to look at the entire picture, then judge the entire picture, not cherry pick things you don't like and judge it on that.

If we hadn't lost anyone on offense this season and ended up with the same offensive results, we still would have exceeded any realistic expectations by a considerable amount. Having done so with the injuries we had to deal with is borderline mind boggling.

Was I happy with the play calling on the first two first and goal series'? No, I personally would have preferred spreading the offense if we were going to attempt to force the ball up the middle but that doesn't some without potential pitfalls. Neither does a QB sneak, which for some reason you seem to believe would have guaranteed a TD every time, Thinking that we know our offensive personnel better than he does, that we know their grasp on the playbook better than he does or that we know how to attack the opponent's defense better than he does is delusional.

I don't expect his play calling to be perfect, better offensive minds than we could ever hope to land at UConn will never be perfect. Hell, Bill Walsh wasn't perfect and while I don't like the idea of using what could be interpreted as an Edsall reference, sometimes the result is due more to execution than play call.

If you want to gripe about Berhalter on the soccer forum, have at it. That type of football is obviously more in your wheelhouse than this version is.

Sorry but you are fooling yourself. His situational play calling is bizarre at times. The Millen thing worked until it didn’t.

I think it was BC or Liberty where he called an option to Millen TO THR WEAK SIDE and it resulted in a fumble.

There was just no need for it, He was too cute.

I can assure you that Mora sees it and hopefully Charlton does too,

Try watching a few of the games from the second half of the season. You’ll be metaphorically gouging your eyes out with the stupidity.

Even the announcers pointed it out time and time again.

Is he a creative play designer. Yes without a doubt. Does he call them in the right context and situation at critical points? Not as often as you think. Hopefully he learns from this because right now he is not a complete offensive coordinator at this level yet.

Oh and stay off the soccer board because you don’t know a damn thing about either football.
 
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Charlton has done a very good job. The running game improved by leaps and bounds. He developed young receivers. The offensive line opened holes and provided a decent pocket. The offensive players, stats and victories all improved under difficult circumstances.

To be honest, squeezing six wins out of Zion borders on miraculous.
…The reality is from the second quarter of the season forward we had a true freshman (meaning no spring practice with the team or staff) QB, we went nearly the entire season without our top two WRs and a very good amount of the season without our top two (a few games without our top three) RBs and what was basically a brand new OL.

We played an enormous percentage of our offensive plays with true freshman as our QB, top RB (Rosa) top receiving threat (Joly) yet people are complaining that we didn't play more wide open on offense.

There were numerous, extremely valid reasons to limiting the playbook. If someone wants to question Charlton, wait until he is a couple years into implementing what he wants to do.

Mora talks about Nick Charlton this season starting @ 14:05 to 15:55. It’s easy to criticize specific calls that didn’t work for whatever reason - the successful ones get little second look because they worked (whether because of the call itself or execution by the offensive players or lack of execution by the opposition).

Worth the 2 minute listen (the whole call was 20 minutes):

 
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Mora talks about Nick Charlton this season starting @ 14:05 to 15:55. It’s easy to criticize specific calls that didn’t work for whatever reason - the successful ones get little second look because they worked (whether because of the call itself or execution by the offensive players or lack of execution by the opposition).

Worth the 2 minute listen (the whole call was 20 minutes):



I listened to that earlier. Mora criticizes his own play calling in those but has never criticized his coaches.

You guys are living in fantasy island if you don’t think Mora has noticed Charlton’s miscues as well as the beyond chronic procedural penalties the offense has committed.

This was actually pointed out by a reporter on the call today.

Charlton’s a good play designer. But not so great of a play caller yet. This is not disputable.
 
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He’s trying to do something to keep defenses off balance when he’s not comfortable calling about 80 Per cent of passes that are probably in his play book. With the lack of weapons available, I’m not willing to criticize play calling this year.

The procedure penalties, however, are another matter. Yes, the failure of the staff to have fixed this is a failing. One failing in a season of successes, but a failing nonetheless.
 
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Did anyone notice if Ross was on the field for any offensive plays? I only saw him on punt returns.
 
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I need help from the guys who have played football. Do you think we covered the edge well this year? I think it improved, but it has to get better.
 

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