Not Developing or Not Identifying Talent?

[8893]

Barring injuries, this season should tell us a lot more about both than we know now.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

He can and has, open your eyes

4/14 is not a good rate.

I have a question too, what exactly did Bouknight, Jackson, and Sanogo get better at?

 

[Icehawk]

As we do better, we can recruit better kids - and right now combined with the Covid year & transfer rule we are where we are. I think yet again we'll end up with a better team than the year before.

 

[CbbisGreat]

Total nonsense . transfers our the way of the college basketball world right now .The rules of basketball allow 5 players to be on the court for each team . Anyone who has ever competed at this high a level wants to play .Those who do not play or think they wont play look to transfer to somewhere they will see the court. Welcome to CBB in 2022 .
To blame Hurley for his is unfounded ,

 

[LIuconn]

Now do our peers. I bet it's closer to normal than the outlier you try painting it as

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

FWIW in this same timeframe this is how many players have transferred from other top programs. Only counting the recruiting classes since 2018.

UNC- 2
Villanova- 2
Duke- 2
UCLA- 2
Michigan- 5
Creighton- 3

UConn- 6

 

[auror]

FWIW in this same timeframe this is how many players have transferred from other top programs. Only counting the recruiting classes since 2018.

UNC- 2
Villanova- 2
Duke- 2
UCLA- 2
Michigan- 5
Creighton- 3

UConn- 6

National Champions Kansas in the last 2 years only - 6

 

[John]

National Champions Kansas in the last 2 years only - 6

Extenuating circumstances

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

FWIW in this same timeframe this is how many players have transferred from other top programs. Only counting the recruiting classes since 2018.

UNC- 2
Villanova- 2
Duke- 2
UCLA- 2
Michigan- 5
Creighton- 3

UConn- 6

In the last handful of years, I wouldn't say our peer group is the first four of that list (UNC, Villanova, Duke, UCLA) as they've been more the creme de la creme/stable and we've been rebuilding with a new coach.

 

[navery12]

4/14 is not a good rate.

I have a question too, what exactly did Bouknight, Jackson, and Sanogo get better at?

It's not 4/14, for a few reasons. First, there were 13 players. Second, even if I'm very generous with the list it's 5/13 that haven't developed

Success - Bouknight, Jackson, Sanogo, Hawkins


TBD - Springs, Diggins, Floyd, Johnson

I also have no idea why Sid Wilson who is a KO recruit is on the list and guys like Whaley and Polley who played 4 years for Hurley are not. Just seems like a cherry picked list.

Bouknight became an NBA lottery pick, but yeah other than that didn't get better. Sanogo's defense improved a ton from year 1 to year 2, and he just was BE 1st team all conference. Jackson went from a guy who couldn't score year 1 to shooting 36% from 3 (on low volume) while averaging 7/7/3 and playing elite perimeter defense

 

[willie99]

Did you know? We improved every year

Did you know? There are 1,300 kids in the transfer portal, and counting. That's about 4 per school average

Did you know? We've landed better players than we lost via transfers in the Hurley regime

Does any of that matter?

 

[dogpause]

All of the stats regarding player transfer are clouded by a number of things, including the introduction of the portal, and extended eligibility. Hurley is not perfect, but to question whether players improve under his tuteledge is seems unfair.

 

[willie99]

Any concerns about what Geno is doing wrong?

Even national champions are losing key players.

What the heck is going on out there? Vince Lombardi


It's a different world people. Adapt or demise. We're good

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

National Champions Kansas in the last 2 years only - 6

Shoot. Well that’s convenient. Promise I didn’t leave them out on purpose. Lol

They are an exception there. I’m sure Kentucky has a lot too but I don’t want to be like Kentucky.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

In the last handful of years, I wouldn't say our peer group is the first four of that list (UNC, Villanova, Duke, UCLA) as they've been more the creme de la creme/stable and we've been rebuilding with a new coach.

That’s where we want to be though.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

It's not 4/14, for a few reasons. First, there were 13 players. Second, even if I'm very generous with the list it's 5/13 that haven't developed

Success - Bouknight, Jackson, Sanogo, Hawkins



TBD - Springs, Diggins, Floyd, Johnson

I also have no idea why Sid Wilson who is a KO recruit is on the list and guys like Whaley and Polley who played 4 years for Hurley are not. Just seems like a cherry picked list.

Bouknight became an NBA lottery pick, but yeah other than that didn't get better. Sanogo's defense improved a ton from year 1 to year 2, and he just was BE 1st team all conference. Jackson went from a guy who couldn't score year 1 to shooting 36% from 3 (on low volume) while averaging 7/7/3 and playing elite perimeter defense

Yeah we can remove Sid. I don’t want to excuse injuries too much either. Alterique suffered two shoulder injuries and larrier sufferer an ACL and both were still fine for the most part. Gilbert was all conference, Larrier averaged his career high in his last season.

Did Bouknight significantly improve his game or did he just get more playing time and usage along with everyone else on the list?

 

[ConnHuskBask]

The Boneyard "We don't take enough kids like Donnell Beverly that happily sit on the bench for four years"

The Boneyard "Player X only plays minimal minutes, why hasn't Hurley developed him"

 

[metsfan2323]

I've been looking at DH's record with incoming freshman. I think I have covered everyone and it's not the best look. In four years we've developed 4 players that I'd consider starting caliber players (bouk, Jackson, sanogo and Hawkins)

It seems rather arbitrary that you would not include transfers especially given the current landscape. Cole and Martin were certainly starting caliber Big East players. Akok would have been a starter if not for the devastating achilles injury.

Vital developed into a first team all AAC player under Hurley's guidance, and Whaley developed into the Big East defensive player of the year but I know that doesn't fit into your slanted agenda.

BTW its really only been 3 full recruiting seasons not 4, tough to come in under the old rules and recruit a stellar class in April. To DH's credit he was loyal to Ollie's recruits and didn't push them out the door.

 

[businesslawyer]

How often does anyone strive to be like everyone else? Did you seek the median in law school?

You are making the assumption that a good coach can recruit all four star players to a 13 man roster and have the five who aren’t getting real playing time satisfied in staying under the new transfer rules. What I’m asking is whether anyone has evidence that other coaches are doing this, or whether people are just making up things to whine about it.

(I won’t even say where the smart money is in your case.)

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

FWIW in this same timeframe this is how many players have transferred from other top programs. Only counting the recruiting classes since 2018.

UNC- 2
Villanova- 2
Duke- 2
UCLA- 2
Michigan- 5
Creighton- 3

UConn- 6

Gonzaga- 1
MSU- 3
Arizona- 4

 

[mauconnfan]

It seems rather arbitrary that you would not include transfers especially given the current landscape. Cole and Martin were certainly starting caliber Big East players. Akok would have been a starter if not for the devastating achilles injury.

Vital developed into a first team all AAC player under Hurley's guidance, and Whaley developed into the Big East defensive player of the year but I know that doesn't fit into your slanted agenda.

BTW its really only been 3 full recruiting seasons not 4, tough to come in under the old rules and recruit a stellar class in April. To DH's credit he was loyal to Ollie's recruits and didn't push them out the door.

No doubt Vital became better under Hurley mostly his attitude for sure. Whaley I disagree. He was waiting in wings and until there were injuries and he needed to play him no one recognized the impact he would bring. That one was a combo of DH and the prior staff as well as just a kid who worked his butt off to be part of the program. Most of the kudos to Isaiah himself on this one.

 

[HuskyWarrior611]

No doubt Vital became better under Hurley mostly his attitude for sure. Whaley I disagree. He was waiting in wings and until there were injuries and he needed to play him no one recognized the impact he would bring. That one was a combo of DH and the prior staff as well as just a kid who worked his butt off to be part of the program. Most of the kudos to Isaiah himself on this one.

Another example of Hurley being forced to play a player to only find out he should’ve been playing him more.

 

[navery12]

Yeah we can remove Sid. I don’t want to excuse injuries too much either. Alterique suffered two shoulder injuries and larrier sufferer an ACL and both were still fine for the most part. Gilbert was all conference, Larrier averaged his career high in his last season.

Did Bouknight significantly improve his game or did he just get more playing time and usage along with everyone else on the list?

The reason I listed the injury for Akok is it's an Achilles injury which is a really tough injury to come back from, especially for a guy who's game is all about his athleticism

I think Bouk significantly improved his game, he was somewhere around the 50th recruit in his class coming out of HS which doesn't make him a lock to become a lottery pick.

But I'm also not sure it really matters, the question was is Hurley not identifying or not developing talent. So whether he developed Bouknight or saw a HS recruit ranked in the 60s that was so good he could make the NBA in spite of Hurley's awful development, that's a success based on the premise

 

[dennismenace]

I don't think player development is an issue. Look at how much better CV got under Hurley. Jackson got a lot better this year. Bouknight got so much better. Sanogo has come really far. Martin got better. Whaley got better.

The only guys that didn't get better are guys who lost a lot of time to injury and Gaffney. The rest are tbd

CV got better despite Ollie and possibly DH. CV got better because he wasn't going to allow anything or anybody to stop him. That kid had the will to win the day he walked onto the campus. No one challenged him more than himself. Maximized his potential which is pretty rare in all walks of life. He took what he needed and left the rest and then gave back everything on the floor.

 

[yungdowork]

I think Hurley could have handled certain players differently (Diggins, Floyd), but most of the guys who work hard and show toughness have improved as much or more than expected in my opinion. I think that certain personalities don't blend that well with the way that Hurley runs the program, and that has probably led to some falling outs. Except for Gilbert, who was solid enough at Wich St, I don't really think anyone who transferred out in the Hurley era has had too much success at their next school.

In 2019, we all expected big things from both Gaffney and Akok's respective careers, and it's sad that they didn't rise to those heights, but I don't think I can blame Hurley for it not panning out that way. Akok's injury derailed him and now he's looking for a new beginning as a guy who will be 23 at the start of next season. Gaffney unfortunately just didn't seem to have a killer instinct and would get in his own head after every mistake. Sad to see them go and grateful they came here when the program was struggling, wish them nothing but success as long as they don't wind up in the BE.