In-State Recruiting is a MUST for Success

[huskysupporter]

Hard to tell, because coaching also has to be a factor, but if players like Ben Mason, Will Levis, Nico Ragini, John Sullivan, Andrew Steuber, Rondell Boothroyd, David Summers, AJ, Barber, Jah Joyner, and Matt Gulbin had committed to UConn we’d have one hell of a team.

An all time team maybe, but this is about a 5 year recruiting cycle.

 

[06029]

4 and 5 star kids want to play for a national championship. The only path to that dream is to play for a team in a P5 league. UConn does not offer that path and any expectation that the top kids will stay to play for the state U is pretty foolish especially given how low this program is on the national scene right now.

Uconn can and will be successful building with players that may not be highly rated. Randy started to rebuild with kids that can play D1 and Mora should continue that same way.

 

[Platt81]

4 and 5 star kids want to play for a national championship. The only path to that dream is to play for a team in a P5 league. UConn does not offer that path and any expectation that the top kids will stay to play for the state U is pretty foolish especially given how low this program is on the national scene right now.

Uconn can and will be successful building with players that may not be highly rated. Randy started to rebuild with kids that can play D1 and Mora should continue that same way.

4 and 5 star kids want to play where they’re best suited to prove they’re capable of playing at the next level, it just so happens that most programs that do that also fit the bill of playing for titles. But the majority of them are not going somewhere to win, they’re going there for themselves, contrary to what you may think or they may say.

 

[UConnJim]

Well given that there weren’t 18 prospects a year from Connecticut, I’m not sure it would have helped much. Between2008 and 2019 there were on average 10.2 FBS signees. Picked up in recent years, 2017-17; 2018-14, 2019-18, but the five years before that it was 5,10,10,9,9. These are players who were recruited and signed a FBS LOI. Canada produces about 6/year.

I don’t know if people understand the difference between Connecticut high school football and Florida or Texas, for example. At at least some of the bigger Florida schools, football coach is a job. Not History teacher/football coach or gym teacher/ football coach. They look at high school football the way we look at FBS football. Connecticut looks at high school football the way Wesleyan looks at it.

I would recommend that you do not use the 247 or Rivals databases as there are many omissions especially for prep school kids who are playing football in Connecticut, but are listed as being from another state in the databases.

Here are the current numbers:

There are currently >80 kids on FBS rosters that are either from or played HS football in Connecticut. Here are some numbers by teams:

P5 = 47 (I didn't look at every team, so there are probably more)

Michigan 8
BC 7
Penn State 3
Clemson 2
Wake Forest 2
Stanford 2
Iowa 2
Arizona 2
Rutgers 2
Wisconsin 2
Notre Dame 2
Kentucky 1
Minnesota 1
Cal 1
Ole Miss 1
Alabama 1
Nebraska 1
Virginia 1
Florida 1
Michigan St. 1
UCLA 1
Northwestern 1
Duke 1
Purdue 1

You have 19 kids from Connecticut on UConn's roster, although many are walk-ons.

And, you have >100 kids from CT on New England FCS rosters. Sure, they are playing FCS, but I would think there are 10+ that could be playing FBS but their potential was not identified in HS.

 

[JohnFSilver]

I would recommend that you do not use the 247 or Rivals databases as there are many omissions especially for prep school kids who are playing football in Connecticut, but are listed as being from another state in the databases.

Here are the current numbers:

There are currently >80 kids on FBS rosters that are either from or played HS football in Connecticut. Here are some numbers by teams:

P5 = 47 (I didn't look at every team, so there are probably more)

Michigan 8
BC 7
Penn State 3
Clemson 2
Wake Forest 2
Stanford 2
Iowa 2
Arizona 2
Rutgers 2
Wisconsin 2
Notre Dame 2
Kentucky 1
Minnesota 1
Cal 1
Ole Miss 1
Alabama 1
Nebraska 1
Virginia 1
Florida 1
Michigan St. 1
UCLA 1
Northwestern 1
Duke 1
Purdue 1

You have 19 kids from Connecticut on UConn's roster, although many are walk-ons.

And, you have >100 kids from CT on New England FCS rosters. Sure, they are playing FCS, but I would think there are 10+ that could be playing FBS but their potential was not identified in HS.

Good job here.

Talking with Edsall and Pasqualoni staffs over the decade I covered this I got a common theme of how you should do it.

For CT…even New England players, if he is a fringe prospect if you have room you should take them. Why? Roster building.

Edsall clearly had a love/hate with CT coaches. Undeniable. Root of the issue is the second/third tier player in CT. Edsall didn’t get the tip-flight CT FBS guy, but a lot of the coaches wanted/felt UConn should take the fringe fbs/I-aa guy.

Edsall wants them as PWOs.

You need special teamers and depth. PWOs and special teams types should be as local as possible. They won’t leave if they arent starters.

Problem with trying to go to Texas and Florida for too many players is if those players don’t hit — and instead are backups — they are going to transfer home.

The questions coaches ask is — if the caliber of player I am getting in Texas (third tier) is something I can get in New England. Why am I in Texas?

With the way transfer portal is now, I would probably take a second tier local guy at the end of my class because I know he is going to stick around and be program player.

As long as you have enough top flight talent up top. Roster building is hard.

Think about that dynamic.

 

[CONN78SEJ]

4 and 5 star kids want to play for a national championship. The only path to that dream is to play for a team in a P5 league. UConn does not offer that path and any expectation that the top kids will stay to play for the state U is pretty foolish especially given how low this program is on the national scene right now.

Uconn can and will be successful building with players that may not be highly rated. Randy started to rebuild with kids that can play D1 and Mora should continue that same way.

Randy couldn’t recruit for his life, high school coaches all over the state hated the guy, and to say he had a strained relationship with some of his assistants I think is accurate. Same thing at Maryland, he could not recruit. His one saving grace is he had a great eye for talented under the radar kids, but that’s going to only take a program so far. Unlike Edsall, Mora will get a couple 4 stars, but from where and when is anyone’s guess.

 

[hardcorehusky]

Randy couldn’t recruit for his life, high school coaches all over the state hated the guy, and to say he had a strained relationship with some of his assistants I think is accurate. Same thing at Maryland, he could not recruit. His one saving grace is he had a great eye for talented under the radar kids, but that’s going to only take a program so far. Unlike Edsall, Mora will get a couple 4 stars, but from where and when is anyone’s guess.

I don't think we need to continue to look back at RE, but how can he not recruit but had a great eye for talented under the radar kids. He recruited them. And he got a bunch of guys into the NFL.

 

[freescooter]

I don't think we need to continue to look back at RE, but how can he not recruit but had a great eye for talented under the radar kids. He recruited them. And he got a bunch of guys into the NFL.

And he had 19 Connecticut kids on the roster, so I don’t really buy the couldn’t recruit stuff. Actually I think the new TE coach hit on it when he talked about having serious talks with local coaches when they were pushing a kid who wasn‘t FBS level. He was one of them and knows it.

John I sort of agree with you but you need to get more than depth guys. And to do that you need to be looking to PA, NJ NC, and Florida and Texas. There simply aren’t enough kids who are well prepared here. of the 10-12 in a typical year, most are exactly what you describe. I’d be happy with them. But not at the expense of landing better talent from Florida.

 

[JohnFSilver]

Randy couldn’t recruit for his life, high school coaches all over the state hated the guy, and to say he had a strained relationship with some of his assistants I think is accurate. Same thing at Maryland, he could not recruit. His one saving grace is he had a great eye for talented under the radar kids, but that’s going to only take a program so far. Unlike Edsall, Mora will get a couple 4 stars, but from where and when is anyone’s guess.

I bet some of the high school coaches issues with Randy about going to his camp and also taking their second tier players.

But, the fact Lou Marinelli has never had a player go to UConn is an absolute joke. You telling me, all these years, there wasn’t one player where uconn was the best place for the kid to go?

Coaches don’t force kids to go anywhere, but they have tremendous influence about what coaches get access to players early.

Only way UConn would even be in contention for a Drew Pyne type of talent is to recruit him as a sophomore early. Things like that. Never involved it seems. So when he goes to transfer/if are they an option?

That is why you recruit and offer high talent guys. Look at what Hurley did to Clingan. I know hoops/FB, but that kid was always coming here. He is essentially an assistant coach .

 

[JohnFSilver]

And he had 19 Connecticut kids on the roster, so I don’t really buy the couldn’t recruit stuff. Actually I think the new TE coach hit on it when he talked about having serious talks with local coaches when they were pushing a kid who wasn‘t FBS level. He was one of them and knows it.

John I sort of agree with you but you need to get more than depth guys. And to do that you need to be looking to PA, NJ NC, and Florida and Texas. There simply aren’t enough kids who are well prepared here. of the 10-12 in a typical year, most are exactly what you describe. I’d be happy with them. But not at the expense of landing better talent from Florida.

You are right. I think the big thing though is if you go to Texas, make sure it is for a player you can’t get locally. Talent? You get talent anywhere you can take it.

 

[Pudge]

I would recommend that you do not use the 247 or Rivals databases as there are many omissions especially for prep school kids who are playing football in Connecticut, but are listed as being from another state in the databases.

Here are the current numbers:

There are currently >80 kids on FBS rosters that are either from or played HS football in Connecticut. Here are some numbers by teams:

P5 = 47 (I didn't look at every team, so there are probably more)

Michigan 8
BC 7
Penn State 3
Clemson 2
Wake Forest 2
Stanford 2
Iowa 2
Arizona 2
Rutgers 2
Wisconsin 2
Notre Dame 2
Kentucky 1
Minnesota 1
Cal 1
Ole Miss 1
Alabama 1
Nebraska 1
Virginia 1
Florida 1
Michigan St. 1
UCLA 1
Northwestern 1
Duke 1
Purdue 1

You have 19 kids from Connecticut on UConn's roster, although many are walk-ons.

And, you have >100 kids from CT on New England FCS rosters. Sure, they are playing FCS, but I would think there are 10+ that could be playing FBS but their potential was not identified in HS.

WOWOW ... Good researched data

 

[Waquoit]

I think this is a sewer theory proposition. We won't become a consistent winner just by in-state recruiting but I think the OP is correct, we won't grow without cultivating and helping grow Connecticut talent. Edsall should have started this from the beginning.

 

[huskymedic]

From last year:

All 50 states, ranked by their percentage of national blue-chip recruits

CT tied w/ Kentucky, Mass Oklahoma and Penn w/ 4 (QB Tyler VanDyke, QB Drew Pyne, WR Jaden Dottin and DT Lamar Goods). Only VanDyke and Pyne are CT residents..

Top 10:

State	2020	total share
Florida	59	16.3%
Texas	54	14.9%
Georgia	36	9.9%
California	30	8.3%
Louisiana	16	4.4%
Alabama	15	4.1%
Maryland	15	4.1%
North Carolina	13	3.6%
Tennessee	11	3.0%
Arizona	9	2.5%

Note: The IMG Academy in Florida juices the Sunshine State’s numbers a bit, as recruiting agencies count players at that sports academy as Floridians. Many of the players there aren’t really from Florida. This year, IMG has eight blue-chips.

 

[Pudge]

Randy couldn’t recruit for his life, high school coaches all over the state hated the guy, and to say he had a strained relationship with some of his assistants I think is accurate. Same thing at Maryland, he could not recruit. His one saving grace is he had a great eye for talented under the radar kids, but that’s going to only take a program so far. Unlike Edsall, Mora will get a couple 4 stars, but from where and when is anyone’s guess.

You do know Randy Edsall was considered the finest recruiter on campus at Syracuse in the years around 1990. He never lost his great eye for development talent. As we watch Jim Mora, we are getting a very clear picture of what Randy had as blind spots; and I do agree you saw it crystal clear in his brief posting at MD.

I agree with others: we are gonna burn the candle out going on about the Edsalls. Let's find a zone to put them off the sunset

 

[UConnDan97]

You do know Randy Edsall was considered the finest recruiter on campus at Syracuse in the years around 1990. He never lost his great eye for development talent.

I've often wondered if his eye toward talent was based on the talent required to run a 1990's offense.

The problem with that is the fact that offenses have changed pretty noticeably since then, and Edsall never seemed to change with them. You can't win games 12-10 anymore. And you can't be wrong every single year about the QB position as a former QB unless something is fundamentally wrong with your vision of what the position requires...

 

[SubbaBub]

I really don't care where our players come from. The premise here has been that RE didn't recruit elite in-state recruits. What is closer to the truth is that RE recruited kids who were interested in actually attending UConn and focused his energy accordingly. Hence the preference for kids attending his camp. Did that mean he likely missed out on a handful of in-state stars who might have signed had he carpet bombed prep schools or does it mean he might have missed out on other players across the country because he was so focused on in-state kids.

I see this entire debate as a byproduct of HS coaches looking out for themselves going back to the start of UConn's upgrade. The value to the program of recruiting in-state kids is that you should have a better idea of what they are about and their potential than just watching tape and the odd recruiting visit. In a state with an outsized amount of talent, this makes life easier, see FL. CT will never be able to consistently fill a majority of the two-deep on a winning FBS team. Mora is taking the carpet-bombing approach and it may very well improve on RE's philosophy, but let's be clear. He is looking for the one or two difference makers that he can convince to stay home. The rest are roster filler who we can hope will develop or guys who will never see the field with their high profile offers. It's only a good idea if it works. We still need a presence in the talent rich states and hope to uncover a few gems. Something that gets harder and harder as more programs become viable in those states.

Mora needs to look everywhere and take the best kids he can convince to sign. No one should care where they went to high school. I just want him to get a high return on investment of time.

 

[JohnFSilver]

I've often wondered if his eye toward talent was based on the talent required to run a 1990's offense.

The problem with that is the fact that offenses have changed pretty noticeably since then, and Edsall never seemed to change with them. You can't win games 12-10 anymore. And you can't be wrong every single year about the QB position as a former QB unless something is fundamentally wrong with your vision of what the position requires...

Let's stop some things right now.

Randy can coach, can spot talent, and develop talent. PP is a fantastic coach and for talent.

Bob? I actually question this from talent procurement (but he can coach). They all can coach (gameplan another story). Can they get talent here? So far, not really enough.

None of them (Randy second time around) were able to do the job adequately enough. Mora is going to have to recruit better players than has come in the last decade. No concerns whether he can coach them or even gameplan TBH.

Lastly, I remember the Jordan Reed recruitment story. He probably would have went to UConn if Randy told him he was going to play QB. Randy wanted him as TE. Florida, Adazzio, said come play QB. They never had any intention of him playing QB. They wanted him as a TE.

If they let him tryout as a QB, he probably ends up at UConn.

LOL. Kid only went to the NFL as a tight end.

 

[UConnDan97]

Let's stop some things right now.

Randy can coach, can spot talent, and develop talent. PP is a fantastic coach and for talent.

Bob? I actually question this from talent procurement (but he can coach). They all can coach (gameplan another story). Can they get talent here? So far, not really enough.

None of them (Randy second time around) were able to do the job adequately enough. Mora is going to have to recruit better players than has come in the last decade. No concerns whether he can coach them or even gameplan TBH.

Lastly, I remember the Jordan Reed recruitment story. He probably would have went to UConn if Randy told him he was going to play QB. Randy wanted him as TE. Florida, Adazzio, said come play QB. They never had any intention of him playing QB. They wanted him as a TE.

If they let him tryout as a QB, he probably ends up at UConn.

LOL. Kid only went to the NFL as a tight end.

EDIT: I won't even dive into the past. Just tell me where you would rank Zergiotis in our 2021 quarterback pool? If it's higher than 3rd, I'll know that I shouldn't have this discussion with you.

 

[DoctorWho85]

CT kids are great to get, but if UConn wants to compete they need to recruit NJ, PA, OH, TX and FL.

 

[noeynox]

Let's stop some things right now.

Randy can coach, can spot talent, and develop talent. PP is a fantastic coach and for talent.

Bob? I actually question this from talent procurement (but he can coach). They all can coach (gameplan another story). Can they get talent here? So far, not really enough.

None of them (Randy second time around) were able to do the job adequately enough. Mora is going to have to recruit better players than has come in the last decade. No concerns whether he can coach them or even gameplan TBH.

Lastly, I remember the Jordan Reed recruitment story. He probably would have went to UConn if Randy told him he was going to play QB. Randy wanted him as TE. Florida, Adazzio, said come play QB. They never had any intention of him playing QB. They wanted him as a TE.

If they let him tryout as a QB, he probably ends up at UConn.

LOL. Kid only went to the NFL as a tight end.

Amari Spivey and Nico Ragaini. Two names where their HS coaches could not get Randy and his staff interested. Years apart, same story. Both go on to big things at Iowa. Spivey played in the NFL. However, this talk is kind of tiring. We know Randy wasn't embraced by CT HS coaches and he didn't really go out of his way to endear himself to anyone really. He did a great job his 1st time around but ended up being a terrible fit at a non bcs school, where he couldn't really entice kids overlooked by P5 schools and offer anything better than any other G5 program.

I just want to see what Mora can do despite the obvious limitations he faces. He seems to think there aren't really many if you listen to him. He is offering more Jucos and transfers than ever seen before around here. Even if that is a change in approach being embraced by the school, all we have seen so far is the casting of a wider net.

 

[UCTitleTown]

Can’t go just by stars. Kids from the northeast are always under appreciated by the ranking systems.

The OP mentioned 5* players.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Hard to tell, because coaching also has to be a factor, but if players like Ben Mason, Will Levis, Nico Ragini, John Sullivan, Andrew Steuber, Rondell Boothroyd, David Summers, AJ, Barber, Jah Joyner, and Matt Gulbin had committed to UConn we’d have one hell of a team.

I can't say that I know all of the above names so please help me:

1) If recruited here, would all have been at UConn together at some point?

2) if we had the above, where would we have gotten the other ~70 players to complete the roster,

3) if those that you mentioned led our football team, at what level nationally (ease be honest) would the team have been able to compete?

 

[FfldCntyFan]

Edsall clearly had a love/hate with CT coaches. Undeniable. Root of the issue is the second/third tier player in CT. Edsall didn’t get the tip-flight CT FBS guy, but a lot of the coaches wanted/felt UConn should take the fringe fbs/I-aa guy.

Edsall wants them as PWOs.

Edsall did leave quite a bit to be desired but one thing that he excelled at during his first run was identifying players who could be developed far beyond what most would have thought possible while they were in high school. He had no problem offering a scholarship if he saw something (even if it didn't end up being a recruiting success. There were quite a few misses to go with the hits).

Lou Marinelli stated that RE wouldn't offer a kid LM recommended if that kid did not attend RE's camp. There may have been quite a bit more to that than what LM offered. I would love to see a list of the kids LM recommended and where they ended up (I personally know of a couple who played college ball a few levels below where UConn is today). Is it possible that if RE had the opportunity to see some of those kids up close he would have said "I can work with this kid, he should come here on scholarship"? I personally believe that quite a few coaches wanted RE to accept their recommendations at face value and were offended when he told them their word and the limited available tape wasn't sufficient.

 

[CONN78SEJ]

I've often wondered if his eye toward talent was based on the talent required to run a 1990's offense.

The problem with that is the fact that offenses have changed pretty noticeably since then, and Edsall never seemed to change with them. You can't win games 12-10 anymore. And you can't be wrong every single year about the QB position as a former QB unless something is fundamentally wrong with your vision of what the position requires...

Kind of makes sense, the spread offense really didn’t take hold in high school football until around 2000.