Bowlsby on Texas, expansion, conference title games and College Football Playoff

[jostar1]

“I don’t know if there’s anybody out there that really adds value,” Bowlsby said. “Rutgers and Maryland came in (to the Big Ten). You look at Utah and Colorado (to the Pac-12). Most of the expansion, the ACC is another good example, most of the expansion has come in the lower half of the league when they come in. Anybody that’s out there for us would have to come in logically the lower half of our league in terms of the prominence of the institution and the amount of value that they bring.

“I think that expansion is probably fairly stable right now. I will say, just as an aside, I don’t think the whole expansion process was really a source of pride for high education. I think we commoditized the institutions of higher learning, and I don’t think it was our finest hour. It’s settled down now and will probably stay settled down.”

“We don’t want to be forced into having two more just for the sake of adding a championship game,” Bowlsby said. “It’s among the worst reasons to expand. There are lots of good reasons to expand, but those are among the worst. So we’ve asked to have it deregulated.

“It’s been approved by the football oversight committee. It’s been approved by the council. It’s out for membership comment right now, and it’ll come back to the football oversight committee. I feel pretty good about the likelihood of it getting through, partly because I think it’s the right thing to do and partly because I’m the chairman of the oversight committee. If I can’t shepherd that one through, I’ve really fallen short.

http://www.thegazette.com/subject/s...e-games-and-college-football-playoff-20150916

 

[Kolumbo]

"Anybody that’s out there for us would have to come in logically the lower half of our league in terms of the prominence of the institution and the amount of value that they bring."
Is he referring to the institution or just athletic success? Either way, I wouldn't consider UCONN to be the lower half although still not a good fit geographically. UCONN Soccer deserves a better home anyway. RIP Joe Morrone.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

He would have more credibility if he had known that the B1G had assigned rights.

Lower half? Bob, I am going to let you in on a secret. TCU tied for first in your league last year, and WVU had a winning record and beat co-champion Baylor. Pitt and Maryland were .500 in their conferences and Rutgers was 3-5. Utah had a winning record in the Pac 12 as did Louisville in the ACC. Syracuse sucked and Colorado is taking a nap, and neither of those institutions were represented as anything other than what they are, warm bodies. Missouri has won the SEC East 2 years in a row.

It was a wholly ignorant and insulting commentary, and if I was TCU, I would rip him a new one publicly for saying something so insulting about an institution that Bowlsby reports to.

As for "value", it is hard to argue that Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville did not increase the ACC's value by bringing new markets and high profile schools with great basketball and football tradition, albeit distant tradition in Syracuse's case.

The Big 10 got two big markets, although Rutgers' ability to deliver it is definitely questionable.

The Pac 12 got 2 big new states.

The SEC got 2 big new states.

How many plains' schools does the Big 12 need? Maybe the Big 12's problem is that they picked a program in a small, poor state like WVU or a program too close to Texas in a city they already had.

 

[Kolumbo]

I think he is very nervous, as he should be. He knows every other conference made moves for better or worse while the big 12 did nothing but partially back-fill and leave itself vulnerable. He's just trying to spin it positive but is clearly worried.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

He is not going to get deregulation. I don't see any way the other 4 leagues allow the Big 12 to have a CCG with just 10 teams. There is a chance the ACC's bid to be able to pick its top 2 will have a chance, but that is probably going down too.

So either he doesn't have a CCG or he adds teams.

 

[NYUConn]

Agree with Nelson above that this comment is mostly BS and insulting to a lot of schools, though this line is actually refreshingly honest:

I will say, just as an aside, I don’t think the whole expansion process was really a source of pride for high education. I think we commoditized the institutions of higher learning, and I don’t think it was our finest hour. It’s settled down now and will probably stay settled down.​

 

[Kolumbo]

Agree with Nelson above that this comment is mostly BS and insulting to a lot of schools, though this line is actually refreshingly honest:

I will say, just as an aside, I don’t think the whole expansion process was really a source of pride for high education. I think we commoditized the institutions of higher learning, and I don’t think it was our finest hour. It’s settled down now and will probably stay settled down.​

My initial take was the same, or is he trying to appear to take the high road after the fact, the fact that his conference is a net-loser, and trying to stop the bleeding?

 

[NYUConn]

My initial take was the same, or is he trying to appear to take the high road after the fact, the fact that his conference is a net-loser, and trying to stop the bleeding?

I think that is a big part of it. Expansion is great when you're killing off a competitor (Big East), but when you suddenly realize that you're the new Big East it's not so fun.

 

[UConn9604]

He would have more credibility if he had known that the B1G had assigned rights.

Lower half? Bob, I am going to let you in on a secret. TCU tied for first in your league last year, and WVU had a winning record and beat co-champion Baylor. Pitt and Maryland were .500 in their conferences and Rutgers was 3-5. Utah had a winning record in the Pac 12 as did Louisville in the ACC. Syracuse sucked and Colorado is taking a nap, and neither of those institutions were represented as anything other than what they are, warm bodies. Missouri has won the SEC East 2 years in a row.

It was a wholly ignorant and insulting commentary, and if I was TCU, I would rip him a new one publicly for saying something so insulting about an institution that Bowlsby reports to.

As for "value", it is hard to argue that Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville did not increase the ACC's value by bringing new markets and high profile schools with great basketball and football tradition, albeit distant tradition in Syracuse's case.

The Big 10 got two big markets, although Rutgers' ability to deliver it is definitely questionable.

The Pac 12 got 2 big new states.

The SEC got 2 big new states.

How many plains' schools does the Big 12 need? Maybe the Big 12's problem is that they picked a program in a small, poor state like WVU or a program too close to Texas in a city they already had.

Of the eight participants in the first four ACC Championship games, five (Va. Tech three times, BC twice) were ex-Big East schools.

 

[Stinger92860]

Of the eight participants in the first four ACC Championship games, five (Va. Tech three times, BC twice) were ex-Big East schools.

Yet the Big East sucked, not!

 

[UConn9604]

Yet the Big East sucked, not!

When a school like BC -- which had something like a .250 record against teams not named Temple or Rutgers in Big East play -- walks in with players that were recruited to play in the Big East and makes the title game twice, you know that quality of play in the Big East was never an issue.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I think that is a big part of it. Expansion is great when you're killing off a competitor (Big East), but when you suddenly realize that you're the new Big East it's not so fun.

Bingo!

 

[DarthGrumpy]

He is not going to get deregulation. I don't see any way the other 4 leagues allow the Big 12 to have a CCG with just 10 teams. There is a chance the ACC's bid to be able to pick its top 2 will have a chance, but that is probably going down too.

So either he doesn't have a CCG or he adds teams.

Agree on that. The ACC, B1G, and PAC made the investments to be able to have a conference championship football game, even if it is a very LONG term investment - see Rutgers and Colorado. The XII, i.e. the folks in Austin, did not. The general consensus is that at some point in time there will be 4x power conferences with 16 to 20 schools. Breaking-up the XII will help accomplish that. So, why on earth would the other P5 conferences, especially the ACC which looks to be then next weakest after the XII, give the XII a lifeline by allowing a championship game with just 10 members?

 

[CallMeBruce]

Agree on that. The ACC, B1G, and PAC made the investments to be able to have a conference championship football game, even if it is a very LONG term investment - see Rutgers and Colorado. The XII, i.e. the folks in Austin, did not. The general consensus is that at some point in time there will be 4x power conferences with 16 to 20 schools. Breaking-up the XII will help accomplish that. So, why on earth would the other P5 conferences, especially the ACC which looks to be then next weakest after the XII, give the XII a lifeline by allowing a championship game with just 10 members?

But shouldn't the ACC also want to avoid giving the Big 12 incentive to expand?

 

[DarthGrumpy]

But shouldn't the ACC also want to avoid giving the Big 12 incentive to expand?

Yes, that is part of the equation over the long term; but, many feel that this issue will be resolved in some way within the next 5 years, especially if the XII continues to be shut out a majority of the time by the conference champions from the other P5 conferences regarding the football playoff. The success of Missouri and A&M who have been able to escape the control of Austin in other conferences has not helped. While Texas controls the XII (see the talk of adding Houston to the XII), Oklahoma is the key. Without Oklahoma, the XII is Snow White (the Longhorns) and the 8 wannabes. Oklahoma has options (PAC, B1G, maybe SEC) and if things don't change soon, they will likely leave. If they leave, the XII is done as Kansas and Oklahoma St are likely to follow the Sooners out the door. Thus, the ACC just has to hold itself together long enough for the XII to implode and the requirement to have 12 teams to have a conference championship is a tool that they can use.

 

[Ldandy]

When a school like BC -- which had something like a .250 record against teams not named Temple or Rutgers in Big East play -- walks in with players that were recruited to play in the Big East and makes the title game twice, you know that quality of play in the Big East was never an issue.

As a PSU Fan I agree that The Big East got a bad rep. It was a solid football conference for its time. I wish people affiliated with the football side of it had more vision in the 80's and 90's to see the coming landscape of major college sports. Maybe they would have dumped the parasitic basketball only members and banded together instead of trying to defend whatever little piece of the pie they believed they owned at the time. JMO but I think something like this could have been brought together quite easily, and would have been a pretty fun all sports conference. Control the entire Northeast with a little influence in the South and Midwest.

BC
UCONN
Cuse
RU
PSU
Pitt
Temple
Cincy
WVU
VPI
Ville
Miami

 

[kyleslamb]

Agree with Nelson above that this comment is mostly BS and insulting to a lot of schools, though this line is actually refreshingly honest:

I will say, just as an aside, I don’t think the whole expansion process was really a source of pride for high education. I think we commoditized the institutions of higher learning, and I don’t think it was our finest hour. It’s settled down now and will probably stay settled down.​

Like others have said, don't be deceived by those comments. He's not being honest, he's simply being a sore loser. The Big 12 tried expanding too and failed because they were barely able to keep some of their own members together. If the Big 12 would have been able to do what the SEC, Big Ten or Pac-12 did, they would have. Bowlsby is simply trying to spin his conference's failure into nobility.

 

[NYUConn]

Like others have said, don't be deceived by those comments. He's not being honest, he's simply being a sore loser. The Big 12 tried expanding too and failed because they were barely able to keep some of their own members together. If the Big 12 would have been able to do what the SEC, Big Ten or Pac-12 did, they would have. Bowlsby is simply trying to spin his conference's failure into nobility.

Just because they have ulterior motives, doesn't mean they aren't honest comments.

 

[Kolumbo]

Interesting how he was addressing students at the University of Iowa when he said this. Almost as if he threw the ACC out there so as not to offend the B1G. What he really wanted to say was "Maryland and Rutgers?!! Are you serious?!!"
“I don’t know if there’s anybody out there that really adds value,” Bowlsby said. “Rutgers and Maryland came in (to the Big Ten). You look at Utah and Colorado (to the Pac-12). Most of the expansion, the ACC is another good example, most of the expansion has come in the lower half of the league when they come in. Anybody that’s out there for us would have to come in logically the lower half of our league in terms of the prominence of the institution and the amount of value that they bring."

 

[kyleslamb]

Just because they have ulterior motives, doesn't mean they aren't honest comments.

But if they're only being said because of said motives, they're completely insincere and thus become dishonest. Do you honestly believe he'd be taking this stance if they'd landed FSU and Clemson, as they initially tried to do? The only reason he's saying this is because the Big 12 was unable and continues to be unable to land anyone of stature. Thus, he's simply trying to make it seem like they're above the 'commodifying' of the institutions since they failed to land them.

On a side note, TV networks have been placing value on athletic brands now for three decades and Division I leagues have been finding ways to monetize them. I'm not really sure why only now during this latest realignment wave that Bowlsby has come to the conclusion institutions are being commoditized .

 

[NYUConn]

But if they're only being said because of said motives, they're completely insincere and thus become dishonest. Do you honestly believe he'd be taking this stance if they'd landed FSU and Clemson, as they initially tried to do? The only reason he's saying this is because the Big 12 was unable and continues to be unable to land anyone of stature. Thus, he's simply trying to make it seem like they're above the 'commodifying' of the institutions since they failed to land them.

On a side note, TV networks have been placing value on athletic brands now for three decades and Division I leagues have been finding ways to monetize them. I'm not really sure why only now during this latest realignment wave that Bowlsby has come to the conclusion institutions are being commoditized .

Let's start a thread in the cesspool about the human condition and whether or not absolute honesty can exist in the world.

 

[jostar1]

"Most of the expansion, the ACC is another good example, most of the expansion has come in the lower half of the league when they come in. Anybody that’s out there for us would have to come in logically the lower half of our league in terms of the prominence of the institution and the amount of value that they bring."

Sounds like sour grapes over not taking Louisville when they had the chance.

 

[kyleslamb]

Let's start a thread in the cesspool about the human condition and whether or not absolute honesty can exist in the world.

If a thief were to comment about how stealing is immoral and wrong, would you appreciate his honesty despite continuing to steal things?

Not sure why Bowlsby's comments are commendable when you and everyone else in this thread know it wouldn't stop him and the Big 12 from doing their best to poach other leagues if they had the ability to do so. His comments are just for show.

 

[NickyNewark]

He would have more credibility if he had known that the B1G had assigned rights.

Lower half? Bob, I am going to let you in on a secret. TCU tied for first in your league last year, and WVU had a winning record and beat co-champion Baylor. Pitt and Maryland were .500 in their conferences and Rutgers was 3-5. Utah had a winning record in the Pac 12 as did Louisville in the ACC. Syracuse sucked and Colorado is taking a nap, and neither of those institutions were represented as anything other than what they are, warm bodies. Missouri has won the SEC East 2 years in a row.

It was a wholly ignorant and insulting commentary, and if I was TCU, I would rip him a new one publicly for saying something so insulting about an institution that Bowlsby reports to.

As for "value", it is hard to argue that Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville did not increase the ACC's value by bringing new markets and high profile schools with great basketball and football tradition, albeit distant tradition in Syracuse's case.

The Big 10 got two big markets, although Rutgers' ability to deliver it is definitely questionable.

The Pac 12 got 2 big new states.

The SEC got 2 big new states.

How many plains' schools does the Big 12 need? Maybe the Big 12's problem is that they picked a program in a small, poor state like WVU or a program too close to Texas in a city they already had.

RU already delivered faster than even they expected with TV contracts signed and sealed before their 1st season. At least if its about cable boxes.

 

[NickyNewark]

UConn9604, post: 1415837, member: 3825"]When a school like BC -- which had something like a .250 record against teams not named Temple or Rutgers in Big East play -- walks in with players that were recruited to play in the Big East and makes the title game twice, you know that quality of play in the Big East was never an issue.[/QUOTE]
And that was before RU and Temple became decent and BC lost their way. BC is just now getting decent again though with few fans and being isolated and Cuse FB went into deep decline.