B1G

[CL82]

Except for these:

PSU point of view

1. Academic mission -Sorry, but staying in the Big10/CiC is much more aligned with what's really important to the university, educating students. PSU has said many times that CiC membership has brought up the level of academics that wouldn't (or couldn't) have happened without it. I'm not saying that the academics would drop of they went to the ACC (it's schools are very good, as good as the Big10), but they would have to start over. PSU is a large research school already intertwined into the other Big10 schools. Breaking those chains would harm the main purpose of the school.

2. Money - The Big10 schools already make more than The ACC schools do and stand to make more, much more in the next few years.

3. Image - PSU is trying to put a decimating incident and the image issues it caused behind them. The Big10 is not perfect (tattoo gate at OSU, stretch gate at Michigan), but The ACC is getting reputation of going rogue. UNC, 'Cuse, FSU, all are in the midst of issues that could really harm the image of The ACC. I understand this is a stretch, but I know the admin of PSU will not put the image of the school in jeopardy again.

Big10 point of view

1. It's Pitt - Pitt has no where near the appeal nor the draw of PSU. Pitt barely captures Pittsburgh let alone the entire state. Nationally, Pitt doesn't even register.

2. It's Pitt - They don't fit the mark of a Big10 school. They are small and private. They are a great university and a top notch research school, but that's the only similarity.

3. Location - Pitt is Midwestern. PSU is Eastern. Pitt doesn't fit where The Big10 wants to be.

4. It's Pitt

Well yeah, but other than that it makes perfect sense.

 

[Seaa Blue]

they get tens of thousands PSU fans to show up in Ann Arbor with or without a ticket and run wild through the town's bars and restaurants .

I've heard the same thing... Younger crowd, "with or without a ticket"

Michigan won the first conference meeting, lost a few, then won something like 9 straight. They didn't care for that too much. The referees helped on a couple of those, and the conspiracy theorists were everywhere.

 

[MASSconn]

Penn State is comparable to UCONN in many ways. I see it as a case study that administration should look into. This could be discussed in depth.

-Campuses in the middle of nowhere, developed from land grants
-Campuses that have aided and developed their towns
-Top D1 Sports with superb facilities
-Similar in academic rankings
-$$ being pumped into development
-History of Tradition

I dont care about proximity to a major city (Hartford is not a major city). Storrs is still the middle of nowhere in the quiet corner. Surrounding towns as well.

Think about this- the people of State College adore PSU Athletics, almost in a cult kind of way. Not to mention their larger fanbase throughout the nation. They travel very well. The whole town stops for tailgates. The residents interact with the students- I've seen it firsthand. Is it tradition or is it the demographic? Not sure.

On the contrary, Storrs-Mansfield seems to despise UCONN's development at times. People outside of Storrs don't even want to come to Storrs. 20 minutes off the highway is such a 1st world problem. The atmosphere you see in State College before big athletic events you simply don't see in Storrs. Nor do you see local support as the same.

Other than that, I think the schools are pretty linear (other than our national titles). If we are putting all of our eggs in the B10 bucket, I wonder what we could learn from Penn States' community relationship and how it developed over the years. Storrs Center is a big addition, and we will see how the Hockey Arena on 195/275 pans out (across from the Mansfield Community Center). But this relationship can be greatly improved. This issue bothered me immensly during my own time in Storrs.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

When we played at Michigan years ago, we went to "The Brown Jug" on the Friday afternoon before the game. After they saw our UCONN shirts and remarked how surprised they were to see lots of UCONN fans in Ann Arbor, we asked which fanbase usually packs the town on gameday weekends. Without hesitation, and all at the same time, they said "Penn State". I was surprised. I thought they'd say Ohio State or even Michigan State because of the more heated rivalries with those schools. They said that on years that Penn State plays at Michigan, they get tens of thousands PSU fans to show up in Ann Arbor with or without a ticket and run wild through the town's bars and restaurants. Also said that "Penn State weekend" is ALWAYS the weekend that the most fights and arrests occur on.

Not only are Penn State fans willing to drive hours for home games, but they are willing to drive hours and days for road games too. But we can't get UCONN fans to drive 20 minutes in a little rain to go to any game. Connecticut people sure do thrive on complaining.

I agree with one point. It may take 3 hours for someone from Philly to drive the 200 miles to State College or 4 hours for a PSU alumni 3 hours to drive from the 285 miles from Pitt to Ann Arbor. But, for a Friday night football game, it can take me 4 hours to drive the 120 miles from NNJ to Hartford for a game in a Friday night because CT highway traffic is horrendous. Whoever designed I-84 through Danbury and Waterbury should be sent to State College to be used as tackling dummies at Linebacker U for eternity.

 

[Kolumbo]

I agree with one point. It may take 3 hours for someone from Philly to drive the 200 miles to State College or 4 hours for a PSU alumni 3 hours to drive from the 285 miles from Pitt to Ann Arbor. But, for a Friday night football game, it can take me 4 hours to drive the 120 miles from NNJ to Hartford for a game in a Friday night because CT highway traffic is horrendous. Whoever designed I-84 through Danbury and Waterbury should be sent to State College to be used as tackling dummies at Linebacker U for eternity.

CT did not have the luxury of planning its road system in more recent times like other urban areas. The worst section of 84 is in West Hartford and Hartford. And we don't charge New Yorkers and Mass[achusetts)holes () to use our roadways either. Lots of lost revenue there.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

CT did not have the luxury of planning its road system in more recent times like other urban areas. The worst section of 84 is in West Hartford and Hartford. And we don't charge New Yorkers and Mass[achusetts)holes () to use our roadways either. Lots of lost revenue there.

True on the planning issue; but, I have more issues with I-84 in Waterbury where it goes from 3 lanes in Middlebury, to 2 in Waterbury, then 4 in Waterbury, then 2 right before Cheshire. That is always jammed, including both Saturday night at 6 PM heading east and 8 PM on Sunday night heading West this weekend. I can at least avoid Hartford if I am heading towards Boston (stuck if I am heading towards Springfield) by taking I-691 over to I-91 in Meriden, though the back-up onto the Charter Oak can be painful, too. Just wait until CT start to replace I-84 viaduct in Hartford.

 

[SubbaBub]

How do you figure Penn State is simply a bigger version of UConn? Sure they are similar in that they are both universities, but I really don't see them as that similar.

They are very similar. Former agricultural colleges turned land grant universities that became the sole primary state university.

The difference is that UConn was foot bound like an old time Chinese school girl by the presence of stiff competition from private schools and a lack of support from the state and the surrounding municipality.

If UConn was given the land and local autonomy that PSU was given 60-80+ years ago, they'd be mirror images as institutions. UCONN might be bigger based on proximity to larger cities.

UConn just started following in PSUs footsteps, and has a long ways to go. Control of planning and zoning and additional space would help tremendously. If a governor wanted to do that, it might be worth more than just $$.

 

[TerryD]

I'm sorry - were you outraged last week when FSU got a "gift call" against ND to scratch out a win? The refs served to keep the ACC's only hope in the Football playoffs alive with that call. I hope ND learned a lesson. Half ass membership in a conference gets you half ass treatment. The ACC wants to protect its own and ND is not included.

No school is going to join a conference because of a bad call, either.

 

[Seaa Blue]

No school is going to join a conference because of a bad call, either.

I used to get some laughs on the ND board (II) when they would complain about the refs after a Michigan game at Michigan... For the last several years they were ND's ref rentals when @Michigan.

 

[SubbaBub]

I agree with one point. It may take 3 hours for someone from Philly to drive the 200 miles to State College or 4 hours for a PSU alumni 3 hours to drive from the 285 miles from Pitt to Ann Arbor. But, for a Friday night football game, it can take me 4 hours to drive the 120 miles from NNJ to Hartford for a game in a Friday night because CT highway traffic is horrendous. Whoever designed I-84 through Danbury and Waterbury should be sent to State College to be used as tackling dummies at Linebacker U for eternity.

It's 3-5 hours from the following cities:
Philly
Pittsburgh
Baltimore
NYC
Buffalo
Cleveland
Hartford
DC
Trenton
Newark, NJ
Newark/Wilmington

Add in a dearth of local entertainment, and a decent sized local tech/retirement demo in addition to the campus, and you have a base to draw as they do.
60 years of living people attending games doesn't hurt either.

As for the atmosphere, it's only been at the "white out" level for about 10 years. After their last down turn, (6-4 Iowa) they scored a very good recruiting class that openly talked about returning to the top. The students climbed on board and created Paternoville, now Nittanyville, and the rest is history. The students created their version of the white out, seven nation army, zombie nation, and it continues on today.

Now 10+ years of alumni who know nothing but a supercharged gameday atmosphere. The band, the older folks, everyone has bought in to keep it going. Herbstreit called it the greatest show in college football and the University ran with that branding.

So, the challenge to the two or three rows of diehards in the dog pound is to create a club, get it funded, grab a sponsor or two and run with it. The rest of us will follow, because deep down we all want to be stupid drunken college kids for a couple hours a week.

 

[pj]

Penn State has good freeway access. Extend I-384 to Mansfield and build a feeder highway, cars only, from I-84 to north campus and maybe extend it down the east side of campus, and it would be a lot easier to get to UConn. Then improve the highways elsewhere in the state.

 

[Husky25]

A referendum won't pass in Mansfield/Storrs because there is an "acceptable" alternative in East Hartford. Those townies are the largest NIMBY population in Connecticut.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Penn State has good freeway access. Extend I-384 to Mansfield and build a feeder highway, cars only, from I-84 to north campus and maybe extend it down the east side of campus, and it would be a lot easier to get to UConn. Then improve the highways elsewhere in the state.

I-84 was supposed to run from Hartford to Providence via I-384 and those random segments of Route 6 that is a highway in Willimantic and that spur off of I-395. RI shot down their portion of I-84 due to concerns over building the highway over the Scituate Reservoir, which is Providence's primary water source, and then CT gave-up shortly thereafter. I-84 was then renumbered up to Sturbridge and thus eliminating I-86. That was the best chance that UConn had to get a highway near it. There was talk about widening Route 6 to highway standards to Willimantic, in part due to it's reputational name of 'Suicide 6;' but such attempts have been killed. There is no chance of linking Storrs to a highway today, especially with highway re-construction needs elsewhere (Hartford viaduct, Waterbury Mixmaster, completing Route 11) etc.). Best UConn can hope for is for US 44 or Route 195 to be widened between I-84 and Storrs, which would then look something like Route 34 between Derby and New Haven or Route 5 between Meriden and Hartford (less the stores).

http://www.kurumi.com/roads/ct/pics/art-hfd-fwy-60s.png

 

[SubbaBub]

Penn State has good freeway access. Extend I-384 to Mansfield and build a feeder highway, cars only, from I-84 to north campus and maybe extend it down the east side of campus, and it would be a lot easier to get to UConn. Then improve the highways elsewhere in the state.

That freeway is about 7 years old. Wasn't a factor, for 8 days a year they dealt with it. What they did do is adjust their parking scheme once it was finished.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

I'm sorry - were you outraged last week when FSU got a "gift call" against ND to scratch out a win? The refs served to keep the ACC's only hope in the Football playoffs alive with that call. I hope ND learned a lesson. Half ass membership in a conference gets you half ass treatment. The ACC wants to protect its own and ND is not included.

I understand you're trying to give an analogy but that replay showed the ND wide receiver holding the FSU defender, preventing him from trying to defend the other receiver. Is the ACC perfect? Hell naw. Was Sandusky protected by the PSU old guard until he was caught? I think so. Does it change the fact that Penn State was jobbed Saturday night? No, it doesn't.

Too much of this happens it doesn't matter about the academic associations and TV monies, etc.. Integrity still matters, even when UNC and FSU continually let people down. I don't defend either of those schools' actions.

Look, you think I'm rooting for this to happen. No, what I'm saying is schools have known to change conferences for reasons other than money. PSU's perception of the Big Ten's treatment of them since they joined could be a catalyst for change. That's all I'm saying.

There was always a segment of the Texas A&M fanbase that wanted to join the SEC but weren't strong enough to force a change. Then, in one year, all that changed. Don't assume that the Big Ten is some kind of fortress that can't be breached. Things change. Organizations that don't manage feedback are looked at as stubborn and resistance to change can corrode even the most historic companies. The ACC didn't heed certain warning signs and we paid the price with losing Maryland.

Just some friendly advice.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Except for these:

PSU point of view

1. Academic mission -Sorry, but staying in the Big10/CiC is much more aligned with what's really important to the university, educating students. PSU has said many times that CiC membership has brought up the level of academics that wouldn't (or couldn't) have happened without it. I'm not saying that the academics would drop of they went to the ACC (it's schools are very good, as good as the Big10), but they would have to start over. PSU is a large research school already intertwined into the other Big10 schools. Breaking those chains would harm the main purpose of the school.

2. Money - The Big10 schools already make more than The ACC schools do and stand to make more, much more in the next few years.

3. Image - PSU is trying to put a decimating incident and the image issues it caused behind them. The Big10 is not perfect (tattoo gate at OSU, stretch gate at Michigan), but The ACC is getting reputation of going rogue. UNC, 'Cuse, FSU, all are in the midst of issues that could really harm the image of The ACC. I understand this is a stretch, but I know the admin of PSU will not put the image of the school in jeopardy again.

Big10 point of view

1. It's Pitt - Pitt has no where near the appeal nor the draw of PSU. Pitt barely captures Pittsburgh let alone the entire state. Nationally, Pitt doesn't even register.

2. It's Pitt - They don't fit the mark of a Big10 school. They are small and private. They are a great university and a top notch research school, but that's the only similarity.

3. Location - Pitt is Midwestern. PSU is Eastern. Pitt doesn't fit where The Big10 wants to be.

4. It's Pitt

So you're saying that you'd rather soldier on with 13 members (and no lacrosse or hockey conference-sponsored league) than take in schools you consider "beneath" your standards.

OK, then. The Big 12 and ACC had other ideas and they're still fine.

 

[Fishy]

The next person to propose an on- campus stadium or a reworking of the state's highways to facilitate one is going to have his account cancelled, his pets shot and all of his posts scrubbed from the internet.

 

[dayooper]

So you're saying that you'd rather soldier on with 13 members (and no lacrosse or hockey conference-sponsored league) than take in schools you consider "beneath" your standards.

OK, then. The Big 12 and ACC had other ideas and they're still fine.

What are you talking about? The "trade" wouldn't work because PSU isn't going to cave to their fans. It's a ridiculous idea that makes no sense. The reason UMD left was money. The treatment The ACC gave them opened the door, but the money was the reason. Unless I'm mistaken, The ACC makes quite a bit less than The Big10, and that gap will widen in the next few years. If PSU has that little backbone to do what's not in their best interest because their fans want to, than good riddance.

To top it all off, Pitt plays neither hockey, nor lacrosse. You claim "soldiering on" with 13 schools without sponsored lacrosse or hockey conferences, but Pitt wouldn't help in that regard!

Pitt is a great school and their research/academics fit right in. Their athletics? Not so much.

I gave many reasons why PSU would not move, and I do discount your "speculation" as nonsense. If you want to play this stupid game you are playing, please continue. It's fun to banter back and forth with someone else interested. That doesn't mean you get to set the parameters of it to the crazy setting and not be called out on it.

 

[beerfan]

If anyone thinks it is easy to get to PSU for a football hasn't been there. Going to PSU is a weekend event, it is not a Saturday after mowing the lawn event. It's just a different culture. you plan a weekend around it and are there Friday night. Storrs to the Rent is a cake walk compared to Route 80 to State College.

 

[buddy]

When we played at Michigan years ago, we went to "The Brown Jug" on the Friday afternoon before the game. After they saw our UCONN shirts and remarked how surprised they were to see lots of UCONN fans in Ann Arbor, we asked which fanbase usually packs the town on gameday weekends. Without hesitation, and all at the same time, they said "Penn State". I was surprised. I thought they'd say Ohio State or even Michigan State because of the more heated rivalries with those schools. They said that on years that Penn State plays at Michigan, they get tens of thousands PSU fans to show up in Ann Arbor with or without a ticket and run wild through the town's bars and restaurants. Also said that "Penn State weekend" is ALWAYS the weekend that the most fights and arrests occur on.

Not only are Penn State fans willing to drive hours for home games, but they are willing to drive hours and days for road games too. But we can't get UCONN fans to drive 20 minutes in a little rain to go to any game. Connecticut people sure do thrive on complaining.

When we played at Michigan years ago, we went to "The Brown Jug" on the Friday afternoon before the game. After they saw our UCONN shirts and remarked how surprised they were to see lots of UCONN fans in Ann Arbor, we asked which fanbase usually packs the town on gameday weekends. Without hesitation, and all at the same time, they said "Penn State". I was surprised. I thought they'd say Ohio State or even Michigan State because of the more heated rivalries with those schools. They said that on years that Penn State plays at Michigan, they get tens of thousands PSU fans to show up in Ann Arbor with or without a ticket and run wild through the town's bars and restaurants. Also said that "Penn State weekend" is ALWAYS the weekend that the most fights and arrests occur on.

Not only are Penn State fans willing to drive hours for home games, but they are willing to drive hours and days for road games too. But we can't get UCONN fans to drive 20 minutes in a little rain to go to any game. Connecticut people sure do thrive on complaining.

Put a good team on the field playing an opponent that people actually care about and you will get fans in the stadium. Season ticket holders that I know can't even give their tickets away for free.

 

[CL82]

The next person to propose an on- campus stadium or a reworking of the state's highways to facilitate one is going to have his account cancelled, his pets shot and all of his posts scrubbed from the internet.

Meh, it marginally more relevant than the 2nd best pizza thread.

 

[pj]

If anyone thinks it is easy to get to PSU for a football hasn't been there. Going to PSU is a weekend event, it is not a Saturday after mowing the lawn event. It's just a different culture. you plan a weekend around it and are there Friday night. Storrs to the Rent is a cake walk compared to Route 80 to State College.

It's I-99 now and from Pittsburgh it's no more difficult than Greenwich to the Rent.

 

[SubbaBub]

If anyone thinks it is easy to get to PSU for a football hasn't been there. Going to PSU is a weekend event, it is not a Saturday after mowing the lawn event. It's just a different culture. you plan a weekend around it and are there Friday night. Storrs to the Rent is a cake walk compared to Route 80 to State College.

As in anything else, if you know what you are doing and plan ahead, it's no big deal.

I've never had an issue getting into State College. Now getting into a restaurant after the game, that is a different story, but I've worked that out as well.

 

[Ldandy]

I understand you're trying to give an analogy but that replay showed the ND wide receiver holding the FSU defender, preventing him from trying to defend the other receiver. Is the ACC perfect? Hell naw. Was Sandusky protected by the PSU old guard until he was caught? I think so. Does it change the fact that Penn State was jobbed Saturday night? No, it doesn't. Then what is the point of commenting on a subject you know so little about? Sh it ty officiating is the calling card of The B1G. Has PSU suffered from an inordinante amount of it over the last 20 years? IMO yes, but this happened long before anyone outside of PA knew Sandusky even existed. It is a ridiculous notion to tie botched calls to some kind of scandal related bias.

Too much of this happens it doesn't matter about the academic associations and TV monies, etc.. Integrity still matters, even when UNC and FSU continually let people down. I don't defend either of those schools' actions. Academic associations, and television revenue are about the only reasons for schools to sponsor sports. No sane administrator is walking away from either.

Look, you think I'm rooting for this to happen. No, what I'm saying is schools have known to change conferences for reasons other than money. PSU's perception of the Big Ten's treatment of them since they joined could be a catalyst for change. That's all I'm saying. I won't argue that there have been plenty of eye rolling and stomach churning moments that have occurred over 2 decades in the conference. Saturday's travesty was more of the same. That said you can't look beyond the benefits gained through the CIC, the incredible money flowing through TV, and the overall excellent athletic match the conference presents for our entire athletic program.

There was always a segment of the Texas A&M fanbase that wanted to join the SEC but weren't strong enough to force a change. Then, in one year, all that changed. Don't assume that the Big Ten is some kind of fortress that can't be breached. Things change. Organizations that don't manage feedback are looked at as stubborn and resistance to change can corrode even the most historic companies. The ACC didn't heed certain warning signs and we paid the price with losing Maryland. Texas A&M is a bad example because it moved from a dysfunctional cluster of a conference teetering on the edge of collapse, to an incredibly stable and profitable organization. You are asking PSU to walk away from the benefits of The CIC, a potential yearly take of 45 mil+, and an ideal home for all of our Olympic Sports because of some questionable calls in a football game. Pride comes before the fall, and as an alum and lifelong fan, I would lose my schit if we relegated ourselves to playing Wake Forest in front of 35000 fans on a Thursday Night, instead of playing tO$U in front of 107000 on a Saturday Night.

Just some friendly advice.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

I don't see much wrong in this proposal.

That's because you left out the most relevant pieces: value and trend.

B1G >> ACC

and

B1G +
ACC -