Conference Attendance in 2022-23

[DefenseBB]

The official NCAA WCBB attendance numbers have not been released but I have collected the P5 +BE data to show a recap of last year plus a 5 year trend for the conferences. The big surprise is the BIG TEN passed the SEC last year with an average attendance of 4,698 to 4,482. The Big Ten jumped up 36% from 2021-22 (3,455) led by both Indiana (8,104) and Iowa (11,143), both of whom had huge jumps from the previous year due to their Tournament success in 2021-22.
The other good news is the Big 12 also drew over 4,395 fans per game in 2022-23, led by Iowa St (10,323) and Texas Tech (4,923). I am impressed by the Red Raider fans to keep sticking with their team!
The chart below shows the conferences in 2022-23 attendance order (descending) and the 6 previous years (2020-21 did not have attendees).

On the whole, the P5 + BE have seen growth in 2023 vs. 2020 as I think 2022 was a bounce back year (good attendance but less than 2020 due to a Covid hangover) after no attendance in 2021. The chart shows the History of the BE both with and without the UConn numbers.

As our fine colleague @visitingcock noted in the Big Ten thread, viewership is up quite a bit which is awesome, the gate receipts have not matched that yet.
The second chart shows the top attendance school in each conference last year the bottom school. For us, PC needed to make a change as their attendance is abysmal at 474 fans per game. Their arch-rival in the sparsely populated southern section-URI is drawing 1,397 fans per game.
Washington State was a surprise for me with a lowly 902 attendees as that team has been good. The sad 1,320 fans that Northwestern entertains each game, tells me they need to have Joe McKeown needs to retire. Pleasantly, West Virginia is last with a strong 2,176 fans and shows why the Big 12 is consistently 2nd or 3rd in Conference attendance year after year.

Rk	Conf	'22-23	'21-22	'20-21	'19-20	'18-19	'17-18	'16-17	'15-16	'14-15
1​	Big Ten	4,698​	3,455​	N/A	4,005​	4,077​	3,839​	3,732​	3,879​	4,064​
2​	SEC	4,482​	4,171​	N/A	4,222​	4,195​	4,427​	4,197​	4,639​	4,231​
3​	Big 12	4,395​	3,688​	N/A	4,164​	4,146​	4,205​	4,365​	4,517​	4,394​
4​	Pac-12	3,164​	2,823​	N/A	3,564​	3,031​	2,480​	2,354​	2,004​	2,110​
5​	ACC	2,944​	2,472​	N/A	2,988​	3,084​	2,864​	2,866​	2,805​	2,854​
6​	Big East	2,020​	1,525​	N/A	1,156​	1,208​	1,146​	1,169​	1,154​	1,023​
	BE w/UConn			1,917​	1,905​	1,954​	1,871​	1,860​	1,676​
	P5+BE Av	3,642​	3,045​	N/A	3,493​	3,432​	3,316​	3,243​	3,303​	3,304​
	P5	3,917​	3,302​	N/A	3,760​	3,691​	3,546​	3,475​	3,547​	3,511​

Here are your Team leaders and bottom dwellers.

Conf	Tm '23	School	Tm '23	School
Big Ten	11,143​	Iowa	1,320​	Northwestern
SEC	12,942​	SC	1,414​	Florida
Big 12	10,323​	Iowa St	2,176​	WV
Pac-12	7,679​	Arizona	902​	WSU
ACC	8,779​	Louisville	916​	Pitt
Big East	10,255​	UConn	474​	PC

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

I couldn't do it quickly, so I passed - busy time - but would be curious about Northwestern and Providence College historically.

I'm not sure that there is room for much improvement at Providence absent a complete program turn-around, of a sort that really just is completely unlikely. Northwestern would do better if they were doing better, but I'm not sure that they have a history of really great attendance, I would love to be proved wrong as we very mildly root for Northwestern to do well in softball and women's basketball. Like to see a "brains" school do at least ok.

 

[visitingcock]

The official NCAA WCBB attendance numbers have not been released but I have collected the P5 +BE data to show a recap of last year plus a 5 year trend for the conferences. The big surprise is the BIG TEN passed the SEC last year with an average attendance of 4,698 to 4,482. The Big Ten jumped up 36% from 2021-22 (3,455) led by both Indiana (8,104) and Iowa (11,143), both of whom had huge jumps from the previous year due to their Tournament success in 2021-22.
The other good news is the Big 12 also drew over 4,395 fans per game in 2022-23, led by Iowa St (10,323) and Texas Tech (4,923). I am impressed by the Red Raider fans to keep sticking with their team!
The chart below shows the conferences in 2022-23 attendance order (descending) and the 6 previous years (2020-21 did not have attendees).

On the whole, the P5 + BE have seen growth in 2023 vs. 2020 as I think 2022 was a bounce back year (good attendance but less than 2020 due to a Covid hangover) after no attendance in 2021. The chart shows the History of the BE both with and without the UConn numbers.

As our fine colleague @visitingcock noted in the Big Ten thread, viewership is up quite a bit which is awesome, the gate receipts have not matched that yet.
The second chart shows the top attendance school in each conference last year the bottom school. For us, PC needed to make a change as their attendance is abysmal at 474 fans per game. Their arch-rival in the sparsely populated southern section-URI is drawing 1,397 fans per game.
Washington State was a surprise for me with a lowly 902 attendees as that team has been good. The sad 1,320 fans that Northwestern entertains each game, tells me they need to have Joe McKeown needs to retire. Pleasantly, West Virginia is last with a strong 2,176 fans and shows why the Big 12 is consistently 2nd or 3rd in Conference attendance year after year.

Rk	Conf	'22-23	'21-22	'20-21	'19-20	'18-19	'17-18	'16-17	'15-16	'14-15
1​	Big Ten	4,698​	3,455​	N/A	4,005​	4,077​	3,839​	3,732​	3,879​	4,064​
2​	SEC	4,482​	4,171​	N/A	4,222​	4,195​	4,427​	4,197​	4,639​	4,231​
3​	Big 12	4,395​	3,688​	N/A	4,164​	4,146​	4,205​	4,365​	4,517​	4,394​
4​	Pac-12	3,164​	2,823​	N/A	3,564​	3,031​	2,480​	2,354​	2,004​	2,110​
5​	ACC	2,944​	2,472​	N/A	2,988​	3,084​	2,864​	2,866​	2,805​	2,854​
6​	Big East	2,020​	1,525​	N/A	1,156​	1,208​	1,146​	1,169​	1,154​	1,023​
	BE w/UConn			1,917​	1,905​	1,954​	1,871​	1,860​	1,676​
	P5+BE Av	3,642​	3,045​	N/A	3,493​	3,432​	3,316​	3,243​	3,303​	3,304​
	P5	3,917​	3,302​	N/A	3,760​	3,691​	3,546​	3,475​	3,547​	3,511​

Here are your Team leaders and bottom dwellers.

Conf	Tm '23	School	Tm '23	School
Big Ten	11,143​	Iowa	1,320​	Northwestern
SEC	12,942​	SC	1,414​	Florida
Big 12	10,323​	Iowa St	2,176​	WV
Pac-12	7,679​	Arizona	902​	WSU
ACC	8,779​	Louisville	916​	Pitt
Big East	10,255​	UConn	474​	PC

Thank you for your work! I Get irked every year by how slow the NCAA is in releasing the annual attendance stats. I think they are important for a number of reasons, not the least of which is recruiting.

If I’m a big time prospect, I want to go to a SCar, UConn or Iowa/ISU where I can play in front of 10,000 fans at home. Indeed, I wouldn’t even look at a school that draws less than 2,00 per home game,

If I’m a TV exec, I wanna show games that have a packed house of rabid fans ; not an empty house where you can hear the ball hitting the floor.

Let me just throw congrats (again) to fans in the state of Iowa for their passion for their teams. In 2021-2022, Iowa St outdrew Stanford, UCLA, SoCal and Cal COMBINED. It wouldn’t surprise me if Iowa and Iowa State had more attendance than all the schools in the monster state of California combined. (Yah. I know the “more to do” argument for Californians but it’s all part of the PAC 12 collapse) fan apathy

 

[DefenseBB]

I couldn't do it quickly, so I passed - busy time - but would be curious about Northwestern and Providence College historically.

I'm not sure that there is room for much improvement at Providence absent a complete program turn-around, of a sort that really just is completely unlikely. Northwestern would do better if they were doing better, but I'm not sure that they have a history of really great attendance, I would love to be proved wrong as we very mildly root for Northwestern to do well in softball and women's basketball. Like to see a "brains" school do at least ok.

Both are consistently pathetic.

 

[DefenseBB]

Thank you for your work! I Get irked every year by how slow the NCAA is in releasing the annual attendance stats. I think they are important for a number of reasons, not the least of which is recruiting.

If I’m a big time prospect, I want to go to a SCar, UConn or Iowa/ISU where I can play in front of 10,000 fans at home. Indeed, I wouldn’t even look at a school that draws less than 2,00 per home game,

If I’m a TV exec, I wanna show games that have a packed house of rabid fans ; not an empty house where you can hear the ball hitting the floor.

Let me just throw congrats (again) to fans in the state of Iowa for their passion for their teams. In 2021-2022, Iowa St outdrew Stanford, UCLA, SoCal and Cal COMBINED. It wouldn’t surprise me if Iowa and Iowa State had more attendance than all the schools in the monster state of California combined. (Yah. I know the “more to do” argument for Californians but it’s all part of the PAC 12 collapse) fan apathy

Wow, you were pretty much spot on. The yearly totals for the 4 Cal schools vs. Iowa State is almost eerily close. Iowa, while always having very good attendance has reached the elite level with CC. And they have already sold out all their home games at Carver Hawkeye Arena (14,382) so I think the strangle hold that SC had on the Attendance yearly total is about to end.

 

[TheFarmFan]

Thank you for your work! I Get irked every year by how slow the NCAA is in releasing the annual attendance stats. I think they are important for a number of reasons, not the least of which is recruiting.

If I’m a big time prospect, I want to go to a SCar, UConn or Iowa/ISU where I can play in front of 10,000 fans at home. Indeed, I wouldn’t even look at a school that draws less than 2,00 per home game,

If I’m a TV exec, I wanna show games that have a packed house of rabid fans ; not an empty house where you can hear the ball hitting the floor.

Let me just throw congrats (again) to fans in the state of Iowa for their passion for their teams. In 2021-2022, Iowa St outdrew Stanford, UCLA, SoCal and Cal COMBINED. It wouldn’t surprise me if Iowa and Iowa State had more attendance than all the schools in the monster state of California combined. (Yah. I know the “more to do” argument for Californians but it’s all part of the PAC 12 collapse) fan apathy

To me, it's not a coincidence that nearly all of the leading teams by average attendance are in very small media markets without a lot of sports competition. It's one of the reasons folks have speculated about why SEC football is so much better attended than other conferences. The problem for Stanford basketball fans is that many of them live in SF or the East Bay, and if you can see Steph and Dre or Cameron and Haley, the vast majority of basketball fans have a clear preference, and it's also much easier to get to a Dubs game than a WBB game. (Many of our recent seasons have featured regular 6 p.m. Friday tip-offs - you can guess how early you'd need to leave Oakland or SF to be in your seat a 6 p.m. on a Friday, not to mention the near total inability to do it via public transport!) And I say this as a Stanford alum and big Stanford WBB fan - I still only get down to games in Palo Alto 2-3 times a season...

 

[DefenseBB]

To me, it's not a coincidence that nearly all of the leading teams by average attendance are in very small media markets without a lot of sports competition. It's one of the reasons folks have speculated about why SEC football is so much better attended than other conferences. The problem for Stanford basketball fans is that many of them live in SF or the East Bay, and if you can see Steph and Dre or Cameron and Haley, the vast majority of basketball fans have a clear preference, and it's also much easier to get to a Dubs game than a WBB game. (Many of our recent seasons have featured regular 6 p.m. Friday tip-offs - you can guess how early you'd need to leave Oakland or SF to be in your seat a 6 p.m. on a Friday, not to mention the near total inability to do it via public transport!) And I say this as a Stanford alum and big Stanford WBB fan - I still only get down to games in Palo Alto 2-3 times a season...

I always appreciate your perspective and while I can "hear" your counter-arguments, I would also add that many of the PAC 12 schools do very little to "market" the teams to the locals. I will say that to Lindsay Gottlieb's credit, last year USC (in deference to my SC for South Carolina) saw a huge increase in their game attendance from 740 in 2021-22 to 4,106 last year. Let me reiterate that again, in Los Angeles, The USC Trojans increased their attendance from 740 to 4,106.

The other observation and the data I have to support my views are, each and every year Stanford gets to host the 1st two rounds of the NCAAT and yet they still don't come close to filling Maple Arena which holds 7,233. And yes, I am aware that those dates usually coincide with Spring Break which is when UConn also has their spring break, yet somehow UConn still sells out and Stanford still only drew 4,245 and 5,071 last year. The school, the team and the coaching staff all need to step up their efforts although with their pedestrian numbers, they will fit right in with the other ACC schools who also do not market their teams well. What's their excuse-most of them are in small media markets without a lot of sports competition? Again, I meant that for the masses, not you per se'.

 

[TheFarmFan]

I always appreciate your perspective and while I can "hear" your counter-arguments, I would also add that many of the PAC 12 schools do very little to "market" the teams to the locals. I will say that to Lindsay Gottlieb's credit, last year USC (in deference to my SC for South Carolina) saw a huge increase in their game attendance from 740 in 2021-22 to 4,106 last year. Let me reiterate that again, in Los Angeles, The USC Trojans increased their attendance from 740 to 4,106.

The other observation and the data I have to support my views are, each and every year Stanford gets to host the 1st two rounds of the NCAAT and yet they still don't come close to filling Maple Arena which holds 7,233. And yes, I am aware that those dates usually coincide with Spring Break which is when UConn also has their spring break, yet somehow UConn still sells out and Stanford still only drew 4,245 and 5,071 last year. The school, the team and the coaching staff all need to step up their efforts although with their pedestrian numbers, they will fit right in with the other ACC schools who also do not market their teams well. What's their excuse-most of them are in small media markets without a lot of sports competition? Again, I meant that for the masses, not you per se'.

Yeah, I'll just speak for Stanford now (although I'm also a Cal alum, I never got bit by the Cal sports bug, and I know even less about U$C and FUCLA): I actually think they market the WBB team pretty well, and a lot of games have a ton of families with young kids, as well as retirees (the two major demographics who come to WBB games). But I'd welcome your thoughts about how exactly the Stanford AD should be marketing given the following local community demographics:

The median sales price of a home in Palo Alto is $3m. No, that's not a typo. (And in nearby Menlo Park and Mountain View, it's a mere $2.3m and $1.8m...) By comparison, it's $243k in Columbia, SC, $280k in Ames, IA, $282k in Iowa City, IA, and $357k in Storrs, CT. The types of people who can afford $3m houses also travel (either for work or pleasure) most weekends, probably have a second home in Tahoe or Hawaii, and have kids who are themselves on weekend travel teams and/or fully spoken for with other activities. (And they also tend to be people whose jobs are well north of 40 hours per week...) There simply isn't time to be a season ticket holder and go to most games.

Nor can you count on Stanford students: we have just under 7,000 undergrads, and 1 in 7 is a varsity athlete. While they're great about coming to each other's games, most varsity athletes have their own games most weekends. And the rest of the student body is also spread thin with so many options in any given weekend: you might want to catch our four-times reigning national champ men's gymnastics team, our twice reigning women's water polo team, or our extremely competitive WVB team. (And a ton of non-varsity students participate in club sports that are themselves highly competitive and involve a lot of away travel.) Also remember that we coined the "Nerd Nation" moniker for a reason: a ton of our students are big nerds who couldn't give two flips about any sport, let alone WBB!

I honestly just think Stanford was optimized for the prior era of college sports that monetized not on the basis of numerical eyeballs but on the basis of the depth of booster support. Given everything I've just said, it's probably not surprising that we have a ton of rich alumni, and over the past 40 years, Stanford tapped those resources to ensure all our teams were extremely well funded and could out compete based on resources and educational opportunities. But now between NIL deals based on followers and fans, and revenue increasingly linked to TV contracts that are themselves linked to fans/viewers, Stanford is not as well positioned for this new era. And it's become so damn academically competitive, the student body that is admitted is even less likely to be tailgating on the weekends. Take a peek over at our Cardboard fan board and you'll see thread after thread of angsting about whether the new landscape is an existential threat to our ability to remain a top sports school.

TL;DR: Sure, marketing could always be better, and would marginally improve things. But I tend to think the deck is somewhat stacked against us over the longer term.

 

[visitingcock]

To me, it's not a coincidence that nearly all of the leading teams by average attendance are in very small media markets without a lot of sports competition. It's one of the reasons folks have speculated about why SEC football is so much better attended than other conferences. The problem for Stanford basketball fans is that many of them live in SF or the East Bay, and if you can see Steph and Dre or Cameron and Haley, the vast majority of basketball fans have a clear preference, and it's also much easier to get to a Dubs game than a WBB game. (Many of our recent seasons have featured regular 6 p.m. Friday tip-offs - you can guess how early you'd need to leave Oakland or SF to be in your seat a 6 p.m. on a Friday, not to mention the near total inability to do it via public transport!) And I say this as a Stanford alum and big Stanford WBB fan - I still only get down to games in Palo Alto 2-3 times a season...

Lot's of valid points. I certainly agree on the issue of (pro) sports competition in everything except Big Ten and SEC football Through Clemon and FSU in the SEC aanalysis. I can quibble on your use of "very small markets". Lets say that the largest 30 cities have pro sports competition which deadens passion for college sports and attendance - except football. Add to that fact that smaller eastern states can draw from the entire state population for attendance at games. For example, 95% of South Carolina's population lives less two hours from Columbia SC. Same can be said for UConn. There's one of the reasons why 160,000 fans will attend a Saturday football game when Clemson and South Carolina have home games. Or pack Storres/Bridgeport/Columbia for a women's basketball game.

But, Back to the media markets issue lets look at the top 100 markets while acknowledging that most of the top 30 or so are pro sports markets (except those with P-2 college teams.)

Rank	Market	TV Homes	Share
1	New York	7,726,580	6.242%
2	Los Angeles	5,838,090	4.716%
3	Chicago	3,624,820	2.928%
4	Philadelphia	3,108,960	2.512%
5	Dallas-Fort Worth	3,041,540	2.457%
6	Atlanta*	2,679,850	2.165%
7	Houston	2,666,330	2.154%
8	Washington-Hagerstown	2,617,350	2.114%
9	Boston-Manchester	2,596,190	2.097%
10	San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose	2,593,210	2.095%
11	Phoenix-Prescott	2,138,870	1.728%
12	Seattle-Tacoma	2,116,440	1.710%
13	Tampa-St Petersburg-Sarasota	2,068,720	1.671%
14	Detroit	1,937,250	1.565%
15	Minneapolis-Saint Paul	1,839,480	1.486%
16	Denver	1,792,540	1.448%
17	Orlando-Daytona Beach-Melbourne	1,775,140	1.434%
18	Miami-Fort Lauderdale	1,720,970	1.390%
19	Cleveland-Akron-Canton	1,552,420	1.254%
20	Sacramento-Stockton-Modesto	1,502,080	1.214%
21	Charlotte*	1,323,400	1.069%
22	Portland, OR	1,293,400	1.045%
23	Raleigh-Durham-Fayetteville*	1,289,510	1.042%
24	Saint Louis	1,255,160	1.014%
25	Indianapolis	1,207,280	0.975%
26	Pittsburgh	1,174,940	0.949%
27	Nashville	1,168,540	0.944%
28	Baltimore	1,149,480	0.929%
29	Salt Lake City	1,148,120	0.928%
30	San Diego	1,107,010	0.894%
31	San Antonio	1,059,540	0.856%
32	Columbus, OH	1,023,600	0.827%
33	Kansas City	1,019,550	0.824%
34	Hartford-New Haven	1,014,160	0.819%
35	Austin	978,520	0.791%
36	Cincinnati	953,940	0.771%
37	Greenville-Spartanburg-Asheville-Anderson	947,350	0.765%
38	Milwaukee	900,200	0.727%
39	West Palm Beach-Fort Pierce	888,210	0.718%
40	Las Vegas	870,240	0.703%
41	Jacksonville	790,580	0.639%
42	Grand Rapids-Kalamazoo-Battle Creek	781,030	0.631%
43	Harrisburg-Lancaster-Lebanon-York	772,320	0.624%
44	Norfolk-Portsmouth-Newport News	772,190	0.624%
45	Birmingham-Anniston-Tuscaloosa	766,220	0.619%
46	Oklahoma City	743,340	0.601%
47	Greensboro-High Point-Winston Salem	739,970	0.598%
48	Louisville	721,070	0.583%
49	Albuquerque-Santa Fe	720,750	0.582%
50	New Orleans	687,110	0.555%
51	Providence-New Bedford	663,900	0.536%
52	Memphis	644,360	0.521%
53	Fresno-Visalia	634,120	0.512%
54	Buffalo	632,110	0.511%
55	Fort Myers-Naples	618,120	0.499%
56	Richmond-Petersburg	608,190	0.491%
57	Wilkes Barre-Scranton	590,390	0.477%
58	Mobile-Pensacola-Fort Walton Beach	588,650	0.476%
59	Albany-Schenectady-Troy	578,760	0.468%
60	Little Rock-Pine Bluff	577,130	0.466%
61	Knoxville	559,650	0.452%
62	Tulsa	543,710	0.439%
63	Lexington	510,900	0.413%
64	Dayton	491,820	0.397%
65	Tucson-Sierra Vista	490,560	0.396%
66	Honolulu	484,300	0.391%
67	Spokane	481,910	0.389%
68	Des Moines-Ames	472,310	0.382%
69	Green Bay-Appleton	471,190	0.381%
70	Wichita-Hutchinson Plus	457,620	0.370%
71	Roanoke-Lynchburg	456,390	0.369%
72	Madison	454,700	0.367%
73	Omaha	451,790	0.365%
74	Flint-Saginaw-Bay City	442,050	0.357%
75	Springfield, MO	436,340	0.353%
76	Columbia, SC	435,570	0.352%
77	Rochester, NY	434,190	0.351%
78	Portland-Auburn	429,130	0.347%
79	Charleston-Huntington	427,650	0.346%
80	Toledo	424,380	0.343%
81	Huntsville-Decatur-Florence	412,370	0.333%
82	Waco-Temple-Bryan	407,620	0.329%
83	Harlingen-Weslaco-Brownsville-McAllen	403,470	0.326%
84	Chattanooga	401,510	0.324%
85	Syracuse	388,650	0.314%
86	Colorado Springs-Pueblo	385,730	0.312%
87	Savannah	378,040	0.305%
88	Charleston, SC	374,290	0.302%
89	Shreveport	373,520	0.302%
90	Champaign-Springfield-Decatur	373,080	0.301%
91	El Paso-Las Cruces	371,730	0.300%
92	Paducah-Cape Girardeau-Harrisburg	369,270	0.298%
93	Cedar Rapids-Waterloo-Iowa City-Dubuque	360,880	0.292%
94	Burlington-Plattsburgh	360,200	0.291%
95	Baton Rouge	353,500	0.286%
96	Jackson, MS	340,720	0.275%
97	Fort Smith-Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers	338,310	0.273%
98	Boise	330,040	0.267%
99	South Bend-Elkhart	329,080	0.266%
100	Myrtle Beach-Florence	322,100	0.260%

 

[bballnut90]

I’d look for the Big Ten to continue to lead the way with Iowa selling out everything, Clark drawing crowds for road games and other programs like Indiana and Ohio State building off of great seasons last year.

LSU also might give SC a run for their attendance record. They’ve sold out season tickets already. Awesome to see the boost in attendance overall a year ago. Guessing the trend continues this season.

 

[visitingcock]

I’d look for the Big Ten to continue to lead the way with Iowa selling out everything, Clark drawing crowds for road games and other programs like Indiana and Ohio State building off of great seasons last year.

LSU also might give SC a run for their attendance record. They’ve sold out season tickets already. Awesome to see the boost in attendance overall a year ago. Guessing the trend continues this season.

Our place holds 18,000. Our goal for season ticket sales is 16,000. We have "only" sold about 11,000 thus far and the clock is ticking.

LSU has sold out for their 15,000 seats. Iowa has sold out on its 15,500 seats. We might not catch them unless BMW or other SC located companies swoop in and buy blocks of seats for employee giveaways.

Of course, season tickets aren't actual butts in seats. I don't know whether the NCAA counts tickets sold or turnstiles. Let's just say our ticket holding fans won't show up for SWState A&M at Podunk. They will show for UConn and Tennessee.

UConn has always sold the highest percentage of capacity. If Iowa and LSU have sold out capacity wise, it might be interesting.

Great for WBB that we are talking about sellouts!

 

[bballnut90]

Our place holds 18,000. Our goal for season ticket sales is 16,000. We have "only" sold about 11,000 thus far and the clock is ticking.

LSU has sold out for their 15,000 seats. Iowa has sold out on its 15,500 seats. We might not catch them unless BMW or other SC located companies swoop in and buy blocks of seats for employee giveaways.

Of course, season tickets aren't actual butts in seats. I don't know whether the NCAA counts tickets sold or turnstiles. Let's just say our ticket holding fans won't show up for SWState A&M at Podunk. They will show for UConn and Tennessee.

UConn has always sold the highest percentage of capacity. If Iowa and LSU have sold out capacity wise, it might be interesting.

Great for WBB that we are talking about sellouts!

I know for Iowa all of their seats are sold so they’ll be at capacity all season. I think LSU only has a certain number allotted for season tickets and a different number for single game tickets. I can’t imagine their non-con games against 300+ RPI will sell out.

 

[DefenseBB]

Our place holds 18,000. Our goal for season ticket sales is 16,000. We have "only" sold about 11,000 thus far and the clock is ticking.

LSU has sold out for their 15,000 13,215 seats. Iowa has sold out on its 15,500 14,382 seats. We might not catch them unless BMW or other SC located companies swoop in and buy blocks of seats for employee giveaways.

Of course, season tickets aren't actual butts in seats. I don't know whether the NCAA counts tickets sold or turnstiles. Let's just say our ticket holding fans won't show up for SWState A&M at Podunk. They will show for UConn and Tennessee.

UConn has always sold the highest percentage of capacity. If Iowa and LSU have sold out capacity wise, it might be interesting.

Great for WBB that we are talking about sellouts!

NCAA takes whatever the schools gives them which is now "tickets sold". In fact I am not aware of any League that reports only "fannies in the seats" any more after the national league moved off of that.

UConn does sell out Gampel quite regularly for both Men and Women at 10,167 but rarely sells out the XL Center in Hartford at 16,294 (both teams split their home schedules, more recently at about 50%). From a percent of seating UConn Women had 6 Gampel Sellouts out of 11 games (including 2 NCAAT games), 0 of 6 XL sellouts. So while they did have an average of 10,255 (above the Gampel limit of 10,167) they have room for improvement which based on my current intel is saying we will exceed last year's averages.

Ok, so with the above edits, let me be absolute on one and "who really knows" on the other. For Iowa, Carver arena holds only 14,382 as has been documented countless of times with numerous "sellouts" of both Men's and Women's games over the years so I am certain on that. The PMAC lists only 13,215 as its seating capacity and very rarely has it sold out for either Men's or Women's games. That said, last year against Tennessee, LSU reported 15,157 in attendance, while with the Men you have to go way back to 2015 and see 4 games of 13,468; 13,610; 13,573 and 13,882 that were above the "stated capacity". One thing I am certain of is the LSU Women's team will outdraw the Men this year.

Which leads me to these two other observations-
1. Kim never tried this hard to sell season tickets in Waco as her 5 year high was 7,929 and her career high was 9,970 way back in 2012-13.
2. Nicki Collen is cratering that Baylor attendance to a 12 year low of 4,393 when Kim last had 7,929 in 2019-20. So at some point with poorer results and less fans the AD will have to do something.

 

[visitingcock]

NCAA takes whatever the schools gives them which is now "tickets sold". In fact I am not aware of any League that reports only "fannies in the seats" any more after the national league moved off of that.

UConn does sell out Gampel quite regularly for both Men and Women at 10,167 but rarely sells out the XL Center in Hartford at 16,294 (both teams split their home schedules, more recently at about 50%). From a percent of seating UConn Women had 6 Gampel Sellouts out of 11 games (including 2 NCAAT games), 0 of 6 XL sellouts. So while they did have an average of 10,255 (above the Gampel limit of 10,167) they have room for improvement which based on my current intel is saying we will exceed last year's averages.

Ok, so with the above edits, let me be absolute on one and "who really knows" on the other. For Iowa, Carver arena holds only 14,382 as has been documented countless of times with numerous "sellouts" of both Men's and Women's games over the years so I am certain on that. The PMAC lists only 13,215 as its seating capacity and very rarely has it sold out for either Men's or Women's games. That said, last year against Tennessee, LSU reported 15,157 in attendance, while with the Men you have to go way back to 2015 and see 4 games of 13,468; 13,610; 13,573 and 13,882 that were above the "stated capacity". One thing I am certain of is the LSU Women's team will outdraw the Men this year.

Which leads me to these two other observations-
1. Kim never tried this hard to sell season tickets in Waco as her 5 year high was 7,929 and her career high was 9,970 way back in 2012-13.
2. Nicki Collen is cratering that Baylor attendance to a 12 year low of 4,393 when Kim last had 7,929 in 2019-20. So at some point with poorer results and less fans the AD will have to do something.

I don't look at attendance alone as a huge factor in the AD's decision-making regarding Nicki. Wins/Losses/tournament results loom larger. Of course those same factors affect attendance.

 

[Big12wbbFan]

NCAA takes whatever the schools gives them which is now "tickets sold". In fact I am not aware of any League that reports only "fannies in the seats" any more after the national league moved off of that.

UConn does sell out Gampel quite regularly for both Men and Women at 10,167 but rarely sells out the XL Center in Hartford at 16,294 (both teams split their home schedules, more recently at about 50%). From a percent of seating UConn Women had 6 Gampel Sellouts out of 11 games (including 2 NCAAT games), 0 of 6 XL sellouts. So while they did have an average of 10,255 (above the Gampel limit of 10,167) they have room for improvement which based on my current intel is saying we will exceed last year's averages.

Ok, so with the above edits, let me be absolute on one and "who really knows" on the other. For Iowa, Carver arena holds only 14,382 as has been documented countless of times with numerous "sellouts" of both Men's and Women's games over the years so I am certain on that. The PMAC lists only 13,215 as its seating capacity and very rarely has it sold out for either Men's or Women's games. That said, last year against Tennessee, LSU reported 15,157 in attendance, while with the Men you have to go way back to 2015 and see 4 games of 13,468; 13,610; 13,573 and 13,882 that were above the "stated capacity". One thing I am certain of is the LSU Women's team will outdraw the Men this year.

Which leads me to these two other observations-
1. Kim never tried this hard to sell season tickets in Waco as her 5 year high was 7,929 and her career high was 9,970 way back in 2012-13.
2. Nicki Collen is cratering that Baylor attendance to a 12 year low of 4,393 when Kim last had 7,929 in 2019-20. So at some point with poorer results and less fans the AD will have to do something.

Nicki Collen is only starting her 3rd season at Baylor. This upcoming season will be the first one she will have any kind of depth and mostly her own recruits. It is WAY too early to say her results as a coach are poor and she is cause of “cratering attendance.”

 

[jake0414]

I always appreciate your perspective and while I can "hear" your counter-arguments, I would also add that many of the PAC 12 schools do very little to "market" the teams to the locals. I will say that to Lindsay Gottlieb's credit, last year USC (in deference to my SC for South Carolina) saw a huge increase in their game attendance from 740 in 2021-22 to 4,106 last year. Let me reiterate that again, in Los Angeles, The USC Trojans increased their attendance from 740 to 4,106.

The other observation and the data I have to support my views are, each and every year Stanford gets to host the 1st two rounds of the NCAAT and yet they still don't come close to filling Maple Arena which holds 7,233. And yes, I am aware that those dates usually coincide with Spring Break which is when UConn also has their spring break, yet somehow UConn still sells out and Stanford still only drew 4,245 and 5,071 last year. The school, the team and the coaching staff all need to step up their efforts although with their pedestrian numbers, they will fit right in with the other ACC schools who also do not market their teams well. What's their excuse-most of them are in small media markets without a lot of sports competition? Again, I meant that for the masses, not you per se'.

Checked your work. You’ve got a row shifted in your CA School PAC-12 attendance workbook for year 2022-23. Stanford averaged 4,106 home game attendance, not USC. UCLA averaged 2,861 and USC averaged 1,037 at home. (The UCLA figure seemed too low). Cal home attendance listed correctly. Not as dramatic an increase at USC as you suggest. A 40% increase nevertheless. Source: School athletic department websites.

With the arrival of super freshman Juju Watkins and a top 25 preseason ranking the Trojans could very well see another sizable attendance improvement, particularly if they start off strong this season by beating Ohio State and FGCU say and UCLA at the beginning of conference play.

 

[Matthew1589]

Iowa's arena holds 15,056 for basketball, may have lowered slightly with the new tunnel leading to the wrestling entrance. The 14,382 figure is for NCAA Tournament games with no court level seats available.

 

[DefenseBB]

Iowa's arena holds 15,056 for basketball, may have lowered slightly with the new tunnel leading to the wrestling entrance. The 14,382 figure is for NCAA Tournament games with no court level seats available.

I did a detailed review going back and YES, YOU ARE CORRECT. Carver Hawkeye does hold 15,056 Yet, for big games with lots of media, they limit it to 14,382 (not just for NCAAT but also for select in-season games as well). What I couldn't ascertain is why the difference of 674 which seems excessive to convert that many seats for media desk/access not only on the floor but up top as well.

Checked your work. You’ve got a row shifted in your CA School PAC-12 attendance workbook for year 2022-23. Stanford averaged 4,106 home game attendance, not USC. UCLA averaged 2,861 and USC averaged 1,037 at home. (The UCLA figure seemed too low). Cal home attendance listed correctly. Not as dramatic an increase at USC as you suggest. A 40% increase nevertheless. Source: School athletic department websites.

With the arrival of super freshman Juju Watkins and a top 25 preseason ranking the Trojans could very well see another sizable attendance improvement, particularly if they start off strong this season by beating Ohio State and FGCU say and UCLA at the beginning of conference play.

Another case of my own team research that actually it is NOT Stanford and in fact I couldn't find how I came up with that number (and given my dislike for Gottlieb as overrated, I am kind of surprised I didn't double check it). Here is the revised PAC-12 listing so thanks for the reply.

School	Conf	Total	Ave Home
Arizona	Pac-12	115,183	7,679​
Arizona St	Pac-12	35,629	2,545​
California	Pac-12	67,811	1,232​
Colorado	Pac-12	23,243	1,660​
Oregon	Pac-12	101,852	5,658​
Oregon St	Pac-12	68,748	4,297​
Southern California	Pac-12	17,622	1,037​
Stanford	Pac-12	78,007	2,861​
UCLA	Pac-12	51,849	1,037​
Utah	Pac-12	58,042	3,638​
Washington	Pac-12	49,314	2,348​
Washington St	Pac-12	12,626	902​

 

[jake0414]

I did a detailed review going back and YES, YOU ARE CORRECT. Carver Hawkeye does hold 15,056 Yet, for big games with lots of media, they limit it to 14,382 (not just for NCAAT but also for select in-season games as well). What I couldn't ascertain is why the difference of 674 which seems excessive to convert that many seats for media desk/access not only on the floor but up top as well.

Another case of my own team research that actually it is NOT Stanford and in fact I couldn't find how I came up with that number (and given my dislike for Gottlieb as overrated, I am kind of surprised I didn't double check it). Here is the revised PAC-12 listing so thanks for the reply.

School	Conf	Total	Ave Home
Arizona	Pac-12	115,183	7,679​
Arizona St	Pac-12	35,629	2,545​
California	Pac-12	67,811	1,232​
Colorado	Pac-12	23,243	1,660​
Oregon	Pac-12	101,852	5,658​
Oregon St	Pac-12	68,748	4,297​
Southern California	Pac-12	17,622	1,037​
Stanford	Pac-12	78,007	2,861​
UCLA	Pac-12	51,849	1,037​
Utah	Pac-12	58,042	3,638​
Washington	Pac-12	49,314	2,348​
Washington St	Pac-12	12,626	902​

Average attendance for Stanford and UCLA still wrong. Stanford played 19 home games with a total attendance of 78,007 and an average of 4106 per game not 2,861 (UCLA’s average). 51,489 attended UCLA’s 18 home games averaging 2,861 per game instead of the 1,037 listed (USC’s average).

Basketball and especially WBB has always been a distant second (and third) to USC football. It seems USC President (“Don’t address me as Carol) Foalt has increased the university’s emphasis and support of USC WBB. The WBB program went through a period of lackluster results towards the end of Cynthia Cooper’s tenure that continued with HC Mark Trakh. Gottlieb has started to get the Trojans relevant again as evidenced by making the NCAA tournament last year and getting commitments from top local talent the likes of Juju Watkins and Rayah Marshall.

I don’t know if I’d characterize Gottlieb as overrated. Remains to be seen if Gottlieb has the coaching chops to make USC a sustained top tier program. Gottlieb coached the Cal Bears to the 2013 Final Four, albeit with her predecessor Joanne Boyle’s recruits. The Cal program made the tournament for most years of Gottlieb’s tenure but got eliminated early. Recruiting didn’t keep up. When she bolted for the NBA she left her successor Charmin Smith with a weak roster. Cal’s lack of recruiting success could very well be an institution problem - Haas Pavilion is quite dated. I don’t know about Cal’s practice facilities but it certainly hasn’t made any major upgrades. Cal Athletics seems, with a couple of exceptions, a mess.

I think it good for USC WBB to find ongoing success as a competitive rivalry with UCLA (my alma mater) will advance interest in WBB in Los Angeles.

 

[DefenseBB]

OMG and WTF, the total attendance for both, 78,007 and 51,849 was listed correctly but the average totals were WAY OFF. I can't even explain what happened other than maybe a delusional operator. Hopefully, 3rd time is the charm....

Institution	Conference	5-yr Ave	'22-23	'21-22	'19-20	'18-19	'17-18
Arizona	Pac-12	5,411	7,679	7,822	5,944	3,675	1,933
Oregon	Pac-12	7,133	5,658	7,751	10,852	7,148	4,255
Oregon St	Pac-12	4,903	4,297	3,900	5,902	5,438	4,979
Southern California	Pac-12	904	1,037	740	1,051	750	940
Utah	Pac-12	2,576	3,628	1,982	2,713	2,851	1,705
Stanford	Pac-12	3,219	4,106	2,545	3,516	3,063	2,865
Arizona St	Pac-12	2,850	2,545	2,686	3,095	3,062	2,863
Washington	Pac-12	1,912	2,348	1,570	1,746	1,946	1,952
Colorado	Pac-12	1,796	1,660	1,528	2,068	1,901	1,821
California	Pac-12	2,539	3,767	1,415	2,185	3,000	2,330
UCLA	Pac-12	2,602	2,881	1,103	2,940	2,839	3,249
Washington St	Pac-12	813	902	836	755	702	872

Gottlieb has always been a "program salesman" to me, she positioned Cal in the media and with tangential game support but her "on-court" coaching has always been lacking in my estimation so your 3rd paragraph is one I whole heartedly agree with. I think both Lindsay and Cori will have a rough go in the Big 10 as that conference is now deeper than any other and actually has offensive minded teams unlike the Pac-12.

USC was notoriously cheap on paying the going rate in the Pac-12 for a head coach (never mind the rest of the P5) and is why or how they reverted back to Mark Trakh. The new AD finally upped the money and enticed Gottlieb to leave the Cavaliers. How this works out is still a huge unknown but I think the huge home attendance advantage that the Big Ten has will shock both the LA Teams.

 

[Matthew1589]

I did a detailed review going back and YES, YOU ARE CORRECT. Carver Hawkeye does hold 15,056 Yet, for big games with lots of media, they limit it to 14,382 (not just for NCAAT but also for select in-season games as well). What I couldn't ascertain is why the difference of 674 which seems excessive to convert that many seats for media desk/access not only on the floor but up top as well.

​

The new capacity with the wrestling entrance for Carver is 14,998. It is that for all home games. Not that it really matters, we don't add extra media seating here for big games, just mandated NCAA games we host. Just happy we got a season sellout months before the season begins and it's great for WBB as a whole.