A Dime Back: Firing Kevin Ollie Will Not Fix UConn’s Biggest Problem

[BlueMAB]

1) Geography - Their travel is far more convenient than the average family of four. They're also 18-23 year olds. Does the travel suck? Yes. But it's an excuse, not a reason. It's hard to win on the road in CBB, regardless of the travel. And the teams sucks at home, too. "These are tall individuals" Seriously? Lots of these guys want to play in the NBA, take a look at their 82 game schedule, how much they travel, and get back to us.

2) Recruiting - "[Uconn] is playing an AAC schedule, against mid-tier opponents, with mid-tier talent, far from the northeast." UConn has never finished higher than 5th against "mid-tier opponents, with mid-tier talent", and only won the conference tourney once, thanks to a game saving 75 foot prayer. Considering how deep the talent pool is in the northeast, can't we find "mid-tier" recruits to compete in the AAC? Does WSU not have to deal with Kansas, Oklahoma, and plenty of other P5 programs in their backyard? How about Cinci? Temple? Houston? SMU? Another excuse. We're in the conference that we're in, recruit the guys that can win it. He's convinced heavily recruited 4 star players to come from Georgia and California, to play "mid-tier" talent, but he can't land a kid from New Haven?

3) Perception - We're part of the reason the perception of the conference is so bad. In fact, you could argue that our meteoric fall has done the most damage to the league's perception. It's time the Ollie apologists stop pretending like we are better than the league we haven't come close to winning during the regular season.

His counterarguments are full of straw-men. If UConn were winning and "masking" the AAC's problems, he wouldn't be trying to take everyone's attention away from the fact that Ollie is in fact, not winning. Year over year, he's getting worse. We can't make another conference invite us, but we can find a better coach. Unless and until we land in a better conference, we still have to win games, and year over year, Ollie does not appear to be the guy capable of winning this conference.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

Also, lmao at the notion of UConn football not being able to compete for a national title. That was never on the table in the Big East either, but it didn't detract from having a program.

Incorrect. WVU's 2007 team would like a word with you. His argument is an AAC team went undefeated and did legitimately as best as it possibly could, but finished 12th in the CFP rankings. WVU, had they had the same record in 2007, would've been in the national title game. The argument being made is, UConn could go 12-0 next year in the AAC and there would be about a 0.00000001% chance we'd be in the top 4. In the BCS-era Big East, that number would be significantly higher.

 

[UConnNick]

The author completely ignores the fact that basketball no longers matters if a school has P5 aspirations, like every member of the AAC. To illustrate the point, UCONN's ACC snub was all about football, and Rutgers never would have been invited to join the Big 10 if basketball had anything to do with that decision.

For now, it's obvious the school administration hasn't given up on the effort to eventually get into a P5 league. Since that's the direction being taken, rightly or wrongly, then what happens with the men's BB program, as sacrilegious as it may seem to say it, is largely irrelevant. He could have saved having to write his 10,000 word essay by realizing that fact before hitting his keyboard.

For football purposes, we are exactly where we need to be conference wise. It does hurt on the BB side, but that's largely because the majority of schools in the league are football first schools, being largely southern based. Those schools have recognized that BB is taking them nowhere in the CR sweepstakes, so they're not going to waste much money or resources trying to make a big push to improve. SMU and Houston have made strides, but the two Florida schools, ECU, Tulsa and Tulane will likely remain about what they have been.

The author also fails to discuss getting our Tier 3 rights back, and the abysmal TV ratings FOX gets for Big East basketball. But none of that matters anyway, because the sad truth is basketball no longer matters, a difficult pill for Husky BB fans to swallow. The only way it does going forward is if the school abandons all hope of getting a P5 invite, downgrading or eliminating football. State politics likely won't allow that to happen, because it leaves a 90 million dollar taxpayer funded white elephant empty in East Hartford.

 

[Penfield]

I have always viewed the American as a temporary thing, and I don't think I could ever truly accept it as a home for UConn sports. My initial desire was to quickly get into a P5 conference and forget this ever happened, but that has started to look more and more unlikely. We simply got screwed. I don't know if we will ever see an environment that will lead to expansion in the near future. The money isn't there anymore.

I have become open to other options at this point.

I used to really enjoy the football team (going to games and watching on tv), but in general my interest in the sport has started to wane. I don't even watch the NFL that much anymore. My biggest issue with leaving the AAC for the Big East was always, what happens to the football team? You could sign me up for 20 years of losing every football game if it got us into the ACC or Big 10, but if it's not going to happen what is the point? We didn't start that program to play SMU, Tulane, and UCF ever year. If the AAC won't take our football w/o basketball maybe it's time to move football somewhere else or cut the program.

I don't think going to the Big East will fix the basketball team, but if we ever did get back on track it would be more fun playing teams not named ECU and Tulsa.

 

[Rico444]

The author completely ignores the fact that basketball no longers matters if a school has P5 aspirations, like every member of the AAC. To illustrate the point, UCONN's ACC snub was all about football, and Rutgers never would have been invited to join the Big 10 if basketball had anything to do with that decision.

For now, it's obvious the school administration hasn't given up on the effort to eventually get into a P5 league. Since that's the direction being taken, rightly or wrongly, then what happens with the men's BB program, as sacrilegious as it may seem to say it, is largely irrelevant. He could have saved having to write his 10,000 word essay by realizing that fact before hitting his keyboard.

For football purposes, we are exactly where we need to be conference wise. It does hurt on the BB side, but that's largely because the majority of schools in the league are football first schools, being largely southern based. Those schools have recognized that BB is taking them nowhere in the CR sweepstakes, so they're not going to waste much money or resources trying to make a big push to improve. SMU and Houston have made strides, but the two Florida schools, ECU, Tulsa and Tulane will likely remain about what they have been.

The author also fails to discuss getting our Tier 3 rights back, and the abysmal TV ratings FOX gets for Big East basketball. But none of that matters anyway, because the sad truth is basketball no longer matters, a difficult pill for Husky BB fans to swallow. The only way it does going forward is if the school abandons all hope of getting a P5 invite, downgrading or eliminating football. State politics likely won't allow that to happen, because it leaves a 90 million dollar taxpayer funded white elephant empty in East Hartford.

I'm not ready to join the Big East tomorrow, but in order for the plan of "staying in the AAC and waiting for a potential P5 invite to come" to work, the football team has to win more than 3 games a season. If we hit 2020 and the football team is still bad, then we're almost definitely not getting invited to a P5 conference and we won't have much of a choice at that point but to move basketball to a better situation. We can't keep bleeding money as a school for the next 10 years.

 

[UConnSwag11]

Interesting. This probably contributes to the increase in transfers we see today once kids realize they won't be able to get any minutes.

But is it because the bad teams got better players to bring their programs up to compete or that the talent across all of college basketball is subpar and not what it was? 2009 was the last great year

 

[SubbaBub]

It doesn't matter how many versions of this thread get created the answer is always going to be missing on recruiting, regardless on what the rankings are. Every guy that left was a miss. Every guy who underperforms is a miss.

If you want to talk about KO's, the number of misses and his aversion to recruiting big men, then that is a topic to evaluate when considering his employment status.

 

[UConnJim]

Let's put this travel thing to bed once and for all.

Big East: Average distance = 591 miles, 4/10 over 800 miles away, 5/10 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 3.
ACC: Average distance = 719 miles, 6/15 over 800 miles away, 2/15 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 1.
Big 10: Average distance = 837 miles, 8/14 over 800 miles away, 3/14 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 1.
Big 12: Average distance = 1,514 miles away, 9/10 over 800 miles away, 0/10 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.
SEC: Average distance = 1,170 miles away, 14/14 over 800 miles away, 0/14 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.

AAC (w/o Navy): Average distance = 1,204 miles away, 8/12 over 800 miles away, 1/12 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.

Yes, the average distance may be somewhat longer in the AAC, but in every conference UConn could belong to, virtually every game would be a plane ride. And, the Big East is not the same Big East we all remember with the additions of Xavier (OH), Butler (IN), and Creighton (NE) as well as Marquette (WI) and DePaul (IL).

 

[Penfield]

It doesn't matter how many versions of this thread get created the answer is always going to be missing on recruiting, regardless on what the rankings are. Every guy that left was a miss. Every guy who underperforms is a miss.

If you want to talk about KO's, the number of misses and his aversion to recruiting big men, then that is a topic to evaluate when considering his employment status.

There is a team located less than 60 miles away that would probably beat us by 20 points and doesn't play a conference tournament at MSG.

 

[freescooter]

My response: it isn’t 1986 any more. So much nonsense in this piece. Our problem is not the AAC and not that
AAC is mid-major. Let’s win it you know, like 1 time before we complain about the quality of play. And just for fun, how about we model ourselves after I don’t know, Wichita. Gonzaga, pre-big East Butler...we have zero basis for complaining about the AAC. The AAC Though ought to do what the old Big East did to Temple: give us an ultimatum to improve or go away.

The travel argument is bogus too. It is a decidedly Northeastern, dare I say Connecticut, attitude. People who think they need to get a hotel because they are traveling from Glastonbury to Avon can’t understand how things are in other parts of the world. When I lived in Louisiana we used to argue about whether to drive 4 hours to New Orleans or 5 to Houston FOR DINNER.

 

[UConnMike04]

I have always viewed the American as a temporary thing, and I don't think I could ever truly accept it as a home for UConn sports. My initial desire was to quickly get into a P5 conference and forget this ever happened, but that has started to look more and more unlikely. We simply got screwed. I don't know if we will ever see an environment that will lead to expansion in the near future. The money isn't there anymore.

I have become open to other options at this point.

I used to really enjoy the football team (going to games and watching on tv), but in general my interest in the sport has started to wane. I don't even watch the NFL that much anymore. My biggest issue with leaving the AAC for the Big East was always, what happens to the football team? You could sign me up for 20 years of losing every football game if it got us into the ACC or Big 10, but if it's not going to happen what is the point? We didn't start that program to play SMU, Tulane, and UCF ever year. If the AAC won't take our football w/o basketball maybe it's time to move football somewhere else or cut the program.

I don't think going to the Big East will fix the basketball team, but if we ever did get back on track it would be more fun playing teams not named ECU and Tulsa.

I agree 100% with this. We, as fans, need to be realistic and for the most part we are. We should have been in the ACC twice already, and each time we were left out. The B1G has guidelines we simply do not meet (you can talk Boston/NYC all you want, we are not AAU which matters to the B1G). The B12 looked and said thanks, but no thanks.

We are realistically hoping for an opening in one of these three leagues that more than likely will never come, especially with media contracts and those that own those leagues hurting and trying to save every dollar imaginable. There is more of a chance of contraction of a P5 league (hello Big12) than expansion.

While I know we have dumped big $ into football, I don’t know if it’s the best idea to continue to do so in a year or two from now. If we can even wait that long. Think logically: If the absolute best we can ever be is undefeated in this league and still not sniff the current playoff format (and still won’t when/if it’s expanded to 8) what is the point? Is watching a meaningless bowl game at Yankee Stadium worth destroying what this school was built on? To me it’s not.

I know we are a “large public land grant research school” but reality is athletically we have a helluva lot more in common with the Big East schools. Northeast basketball is where we made a brand, a name for ourselves, and opened the door for football to even become relevant.

We need to get back to that, and quickly bc I don’t want to see basketball completely die because of a football program that’s already peaked with Fiesta Bowl. Also, let’s be honest about that...if it wasn’t for a historically bad BE that year and a tie-breaker we never even would’ve been there. I remember a lot of uproar about a team like UConn in a bowl that big and that’s a big part of what sparked the playoff format and the realignment. We will NEVER be where we were football wise because the path will NEVER be open for us to make a playoff.

Now say we do somehow get into a P5, will we ever win one of those leagues with a Clemson/FSU, Ohio State/Michigan, Oklahoma/Texas in it? No. No chance. This isn’t basketball where Calhoun built a monster because the school is in a prime recruiting area, for football it’s a waste.

To me, we need to fix our brand, fix our fan interest (bc there is none), bite the bullet with football and do what we do best...run the Big East.

 

[jibsey]

What's our excuse for getting blown out at home? The AAC hurts recruiting for sure but a good recruiter would have had more shooting talent on this team and at least be more competitive against better teams. There are just no conference or travel excuses for that.

 

[Rocktheworld]

No he doesn’t fix being in the American, and firing him alone won’t fix the AD, but he is a fixable problem. Not much we can do about the AAC

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

It doesn't matter how many versions of this thread get created the answer is always going to be missing on recruiting, regardless on what the rankings are. Every guy that left was a miss. Every guy who underperforms is a miss.

If you want to talk about KO's, the number of misses and his aversion to recruiting big men, then that is a topic to evaluate when considering his employment status.

But you have to also consider how many of those misses were the result of KO doing a bad job recruiting, how many were the result of being in the AAC, and how many were a combination of both. I would argue the distribution across all three categories is even.

It appears these are the scenarios in front of UConn as it pertains to basketball:
1. Keep Ollie, stay in AAC
2. Fire Ollie, stay in AAC
3, Keep Ollie, move to BE
4. Fire Ollie, move to BE.

Of these four, to me #4 is the most appealing so long as the right hire was made. From reading the article, I believe that's the author's most preferred track as well.

 

[Storrs South]

But you have to also consider how many of those misses were the result of KO doing a bad job recruiting, how many were the result of being in the AAC, and how many were a combination of both. I would argue the distribution across all three categories is even.

It appears these are the scenarios in front of UConn as it pertains to basketball:
1. Keep Ollie, stay in AAC
2. Fire Ollie, stay in AAC
3, Keep Ollie, move to BE
4. Fire Ollie, move to BE.

Of these four, to me #4 is the most appealing so long as the right hire was made. From reading the article, I believe that's the author's most preferred track as well.

I'm in the option #2 camp provided we can hire a good coach. If we can't hire a good coach because of the conference (which I don't think would be the case given history, facilities, recruiting area), then fine Big East it is.

We are struggling to beat Coppin St., USF, Columbia, ECU, and Monmouth, get pounded by 20+ points 6 times in a season after a year of losing to Wagner & Northeastern, haven't beaten a ranked team since February 2016, have never won at Tulsa, it's a minor miracle when the team cracks 70 points, all while getting the best recruits on paper year after year compared to the rest of the conference. That ain't the conference folks -- that's incompetence.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The author completely ignores the fact that basketball no longers matters if a school has P5 aspirations, like every member of the AAC. To illustrate the point, UCONN's ACC snub was all about football, and Rutgers never would have been invited to join the Big 10 if basketball had anything to do with that decision.

For now, it's obvious the school administration hasn't given up on the effort to eventually get into a P5 league. Since that's the direction being taken, rightly or wrongly, then what happens with the men's BB program, as sacrilegious as it may seem to say it, is largely irrelevant. He could have saved having to write his 10,000 word essay by realizing that fact before hitting his keyboard.

For football purposes, we are exactly where we need to be conference wise. It does hurt on the BB side, but that's largely because the majority of schools in the league are football first schools, being largely southern based. Those schools have recognized that BB is taking them nowhere in the CR sweepstakes, so they're not going to waste much money or resources trying to make a big push to improve. SMU and Houston have made strides, but the two Florida schools, ECU, Tulsa and Tulane will likely remain about what they have been.

The author also fails to discuss getting our Tier 3 rights back, and the abysmal TV ratings FOX gets for Big East basketball. But none of that matters anyway, because the sad truth is basketball no longer matters, a difficult pill for Husky BB fans to swallow. The only way it does going forward is if the school abandons all hope of getting a P5 invite, downgrading or eliminating football. State politics likely won't allow that to happen, because it leaves a 90 million dollar taxpayer funded white elephant empty in East Hartford.

Football is under assault because of concussions. Making multi hundred million dollar long term bets on a sport that could collapse completely in a few years is beyond stupid.

Even if football remains a major sport, what is the fantasy path to a P5 bid? The P5 is more likely to become the P4 in 6 years than it is to invite UConn, and what are our realignment odds when the Big 12 loses Oklahoma and Texas and becomes a free for all of the other 8 teams looking for life boats? Which teams are UConn in front of in that pecking order?

The money is going to be cut off soon. Maybe not for a few years, but the school can not continue funding $30 million a year to the athletic department. At that point UConn drops to America East, and we can thank every fan who said "stay in the American" when that happens.

In short, you are wrong on everything.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Let's put this travel thing to bed once and for all.

Big East: Average distance = 591 miles, 4/10 over 800 miles away, 5/10 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 3.
ACC: Average distance = 719 miles, 6/15 over 800 miles away, 2/15 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 1.
Big 10: Average distance = 837 miles, 8/14 over 800 miles away, 3/14 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 1.
Big 12: Average distance = 1,514 miles away, 9/10 over 800 miles away, 0/10 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.
SEC: Average distance = 1,170 miles away, 14/14 over 800 miles away, 0/14 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.

AAC (w/o Navy): Average distance = 1,204 miles away, 8/12 over 800 miles away, 1/12 less than 400 miles away. Bus rides = 0.

Yes, the average distance may be somewhat longer in the AAC, but in every conference UConn could belong to, virtually every game would be a plane ride. And, the Big East is not the same Big East we all remember with the additions of Xavier (OH), Butler (IN), and Creighton (NE) as well as Marquette (WI) and DePaul (IL).

Thanks for doing the work here. I haven't drawn to same conclusion as you have, nor do I disagree. I'm just grateful to have seen the numbers rather than always cluttering my mind with not knowing each time the thought would pop up. Genuine act of service.

 

[Penfield]

I will say that if you put a gun to my head and made me choose whether to move to the Big East or change basketball coaches I'd probably start looking for a new basketball coach. Changing conferences right now seems like it would send us down a path there is no turning back from, but if we change our minds in 3-5 years the Big East will probably still be an option.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

Incorrect. WVU's 2007 team would like a word with you. His argument is an AAC team went undefeated and did legitimately as best as it possibly could, but finished 12th in the CFP rankings. WVU, had they had the same record in 2007, would've been in the national title game. The argument being made is, UConn could go 12-0 next year in the AAC and there would be about a 0.00000001% chance we'd be in the top 4. In the BCS-era Big East, that number would be significantly higher.

In my reply, I stated UConn football, not another football playing member of the Big East.

I don't think UConn winning a national title in football was ever on the table. West Virginia had the teams and national cache that, as you state, could have made the title game had they not lost to Pitt to end one season with 2 losses.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I will say that if you put a gun to my head and made me choose whether to move to the Big East or change basketball coaches I'd probably start looking for a new basketball coach. Changing conferences right now seems like it would send us down a path there is no turning back from, but if we change our minds in 3-5 years the Big East will probably still be an option.

I do not think the Big East will be an option in 5 years. We are also about to find out that it is hard to recruit a high caliber coach in this league.

 

[Fairfield_1st]

I didn't like the article. Way too long for my attention span. And to me it was filled with nonsense. How does Gonzaga succeed in that conference every year? St Mary's? Wichita State prior to joining the AAC. Good coaches building winning programs and, most importantly I think, getting guys into the NBA is what will bring the recruits. They all want to make it to the show. End of discussion.
I'm in the Fire Ollie, stay in the AAC camp. This position-less stuff works in the NBA because they're all very good/great players. Maybe if we were Duke or Kentucky and got their recruits it could work here, but for the most part NCAA schools cannot recruit that many quality multi-dimensional players. I think it's a flawed idea at the college level. He doesn't seem to know another way to coach, so if my take is correct, then he must go.

 

[CallMeBruce]

I didn't like the article. Way too long for my attention span.

This is clear.

 

[UConnJim]

Football is under assault because of concussions. Making multi hundred million dollar long term bets on a sport that could collapse completely in a few years is beyond stupid.

Even if football remains a major sport, what is the fantasy path to a P5 bid? The P5 is more likely to become the P4 in 6 years than it is to invite UConn, and what are our realignment odds when the Big 12 loses Oklahoma and Texas and becomes a free for all of the other 8 teams looking for life boats? Which teams are UConn in front of in that pecking order?

The money is going to be cut off soon. Maybe not for a few years, but the school can not continue funding $30 million a year to the athletic department. At that point UConn drops to America East, and we can thank every fan who said "stay in the American" when that happens.

In short, you are wrong on everything.

The only way up is with football and the AAC. We have to stay the course. As for finances, it is up to Benedict to field competitive football and basketball teams that will draw fans and donors. If we were 20-4 in basketball this year, the fans would be out in force, even for the Tulsa game tomorrow. Same in football. My biggest concern is that UConn is not spending enough on football to show that we are committed and to produce results. We need higher coaching salaries and bigger recruiting budgets. We need the leadership from the top to raise the money to make it happen. That's what business leaders do, define the problem and then solve the problem.

I am sick and tired of people blaming the AAC on our basketball woes. In this weeks Top 25 Coach's Poll, there are 9 teams not in the P5! We should be one of them! We lost almost a complete top 10 recruiting class and our top recruit for this year and not one of them cited the AAC as the reason they left. That is the main reason we are so bad this year.

Let's address your football may collapse concerns. If football as a sport collapsed in the future, so would the current conferences. In that case, UConn would be fine as new conferences would form around basketball, especially in the Northeast. So, why worry about the assumption that football may collapse?

Conference realignment has gone on for as long as there have been conferences. How can you have the five P5 conferences consist of 14, 14, 15, 14, and 10 schools and think nothing will change? Anybody who thinks things will remain static or thinks they know the future is crazy.

 

[Lefty2one]

The article seems like journal therapy. KO is the biggest problem by a wide margin. Recruiting will never be as great as it was in the BE but he brought in a Top 10 recruiting class two years ago.

It seems to be common knowledge at this point that Enoch, Jackson, Durham and MAL didn't transfer/decomitt because we play in the AAC. They bailed for another reason.

 

[UConnJim]

I do not think the Big East will be an option in 5 years. We are also about to find out that it is hard to recruit a high caliber coach in this league.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Kevin Ollie is getting paid $3 million per year! That is in the top 10 of NCAA basketball coaches. So, nobody is going to leave their $1 million a year job for a $3 million per year job at UConn? And, the school has great facilities, tradition, a fertile local recruiting area, and a fan base that is ready to start winning again.