Which Scandal is the More Egregious?

[Huskies Rule]

As sordid as Louisville/Pitino's troubles are, the fact that UNC has, to this point, escaped NCAA sanctions for the wide-ranging academic fraud it perpetuated for almost two decades, leads me to believe little will come of the Cardinal's scandal, even if every allegation is proven true. NCAA standards and justice are a joke.
After all, as repugnant as UL's alleged salacious actions were, what UNC did for wins on the athletic fields went against everything the college experience is supposed to be about. What UNC did warrants the NCAA "death sentence." It'll never happen.

This Outside The Lines interview by the reputable John Barr is quite damning; Unless Pitino is a Sammy "the bull' Gravano clone, wrapped in Teflon, it looks really bad for him.

BTW- that whistle-blower Powell, who had no problem using her daughters, is pond scum.


http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...its-acknowledge-stripper-parties-minardi-hall

 

[John Glass]

the NCAA is a big business and a self serving organization. Money talks, BS walks

 

[HoopsFan21]

Of course nothing will happen to either school, but don't you dare make a phone call to ESPN and have a 7th grader who might someday wish to play college ball talk to you.

 

[UcMiami]

No question in my mind that a school selling its academic reputation down the river for 10-20 years is a far more egregious scandal than some strippers and sex. Recruiting inducement violations are a far cry from what went on at UNC, however sordid - and unpaid party girls are probably not uncommon at a number of D1 schools.

 

[topogigio]

Hookers, strippers, cash payouts, employment to parents/siblings are ingrained in big time college sports. The NCAA looks the other way.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Of course nothing will happen to either school, but don't you dare make a phone call to ESPN and have a 7th grader who might someday wish to play college ball talk to you.

And never, ever eat Wendy's. Because eating Wendy's is apparently more egregious than having a hooker named Wendy entertain a recruit.

 

[Charles T]

“The NCAA is so mad at Kentucky, it’s going to give Cleveland State two more years of probation.” Jerry Tarkanian, intrepid critic of the NCAA and coach of the 1990 NCAA champion UNLV.

 

[j66kicker]

This Outside The Lines interview by the reputable John Barr is quite damning; Unless Pitino is a Sammy "the bull' Gravano clone, wrapped in Teflon, it looks really bad for him.

BTW- that whistle-blower Powell, who had no problem using her daughters, is pond scum.
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...its-acknowledge-stripper-parties-minardi-hall

I read her book, if you want to call it that. It was o-written by a journalist named Dick Cady, who organized Powell's somewhat random quotes into sections and framed the sections with his own text that that helped them make some sort of sense. Total 104 pages. She is clearly not capable of writing a "book".

 

[ed4ourgirls]

I'm not sure I'd want to place Jerry Tarkanian in the role of champion of truth and justice.

Tarkanian was right to criticize the NCAA and the NCAA was right to criticize and punish Tarkanian.

 

[Bayareahusky]

Ya I agree with the posters here who say that as salacious as the Louisville story is, to tarnish a good academic reputation that was UNC, to shortchange young folks from a decent education, which is what they were promised ..... over a number of years, without anyone whispering anything (until the whistleblower) is shameful...... and to compound it by chasing the whistleblower out of town, rather than embracing her and not solving the situation until forced to,,,,,..............is SHAMEFUL!!!!!

 

[Bonpland]

Just who have been the worst dictators? Shall we compare them? Does qualifying one offense as more dispicable than another allow us a rationalzation to more easily accept the least egregious crime?

I heard a commentator say today, "Com'on, this goes on everywhere, why pick on Pitino?"

We let a standard slide and a little at a time we become immune to being affected by the story.

The NCAA has never performed as they should. Tark's comment is funny because it rings so true.

If the NCAA does not meter out appropriate punishment to NC and Louisville, then it should be safe to assume that their are no rules. The justifying comment that "it happens everywhere" is exactly the reason that an example has to be made of the schools who get caught.

A State Trooper handing out tickets on 395 doesn't think that he is going to catch every speeder, but everyone he does catch provides a vivid example to the rest of us as to what might be in store if we let ourselves ignore the posted limits.

Others are going to cheat, but wounding two giants stills sends a message. The members of the governing body of the NCAA work for the people that they have been hired to police and I'm afraid, as others have said in this post that whatever punishment that they do deliver will do little to dicourage others.

 

[CL82]

UNC is a bigger deal. Louisville is more salacious, however.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Carolina's WCBB program has taken a punch, but what of the football and men's BB teams?? Maybe the NCAA is letting them swing in the wind for a while as part of their punishment. Just kidding. But if anyone has observations as to whether they have been hurt at all in recruiting I'd like to know.

 

[HGN]

The NCAA hasn't punished one because then you have to punish the other. And the NCAA knows that punishment comparisons will be made. Both programs generate big bucks which is what the NCAA is all about as they have shown.

So the question they are trying to figure out is how do I punish either without hurting myself financially?

 

[UcMiami]

Bonpland - by saying one is worse than another I am certainly not saying both schools should not get whacked. I just think we are talking about 'schools' and one offense directly impacted the supposed raison d'etre of the school - the other was just sordid and slimy.
UNC truly deserves the death penalty
Louisville deserves a few lost scholarships, a years probation, and maybe a vacated championship if all the allegations prove to be true (and they seem to be corroborated at this point.)

 

[Geno-ista]

North Carolina "is too big to fail"! Too many years of abusing the rules and they are just too big! Unfortunately little will happen. Pitino will be hit harder as it will be easier to deal with. The NCAA wiped out the existence of Penn State Football when they had no business involved in that situation at all. The NCAA is as pathetic as most of society is becoming anyway. All these problems wI'll be solved soon when all our college athletes are "unionized" !
As for me- I'm going out on top with Geno! More fly fishing and NASCAR with Joey Logano! Another nice Italian young fellow from Ct!!!!

 

[billnaples]

Louisville and sex, over 4-5 years, involving 15-20 basketball players vs North Carolina and fraud over I believe about 18 years and involved over 3000 students a little less than half of whom were engaged in UNC athletics. One offense worse than the other? I guess if you look at how the NCAA reacts you'd have to say Louisville is the bigger scandal. After all when sex was at issue with Sandusky and PSU they fined them $60 mil, 4 years, how many scholarships, no bowls. And come to think of it I don't know there has been anything like the academic fraud found at UNC. Maybe without a road map the NCAA can't figure out where their heads are (we know) and they have been dragging their feet for how long now. A useless organization that itself should be legislated out of business.

 

[Buzzyboy]

As sordid as Louisville/Pitino's troubles are, the fact that UNC has, to this point, escaped NCAA sanctions for the wide-ranging academic fraud it perpetuated for almost two decades, leads me to believe little will come of the Cardinal's scandal, even if every allegation is proven true. NCAA standards and justice are a joke.
After all, as repugnant as UL's alleged salacious actions were, what UNC did for wins on the athletic fields went against everything the college experience is supposed to be about. What UNC did warrants the NCAA "death sentence." It'll never happen.

This Outside The Lines interview by the reputable John Barr is quite damning; Unless Pitino is a Sammy "the bull' Gravano clone, wrapped in Teflon, it looks really bad for him.

BTW- that whistle-blower Powell, who had no problem using her daughters, is pond scum.


http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...its-acknowledge-stripper-parties-minardi-hall

I don't think there's any question that the North Carolina situation is infinitely worse than the possible Louisville issue. The purpose of college is to educate and when you allow the student athlete to in effect be just a hired gun with no responsibility to educate himself, then you've failed as an institution. UNC has been doing that in many different athletic areas, from what I understand and they should get clobbered with unprecedented impacts on their athletic programs. Maybe those penalties should be pushed a few years out so that present athletes who have done nothing wrong will not have suffered for the institutional failures that have come along but potential incoming players should know before they enroll that they will bear the brunt of previous crimes and thus, many will look for "cleaner" programs where these players won't be penalized for the wrong doing of others. If they willingly would go to North Carolina knowing ahead of time that they will be ineligible for post season play or be on teams that are shorthanded of scholarship players, so be it but the institution itself deserves to be affected adversely by having much weaker programs that could potentially cost the university a massive amount of money and prestige! This is not to say Louisville shouldn't be spanked very hard if reports are true but there's no question the UNC is the much more serious violation.

 

[stamfordhusky]

As sordid as Louisville/Pitino's troubles are, the fact that UNC has, to this point, escaped NCAA sanctions for the wide-ranging academic fraud it perpetuated for almost two decades, leads me to believe little will come of the Cardinal's scandal, even if every allegation is proven true.

I think you will be proven wrong. The UNC investigation is still very much alive. Time will tell.

 

[Outside Shot]

The UNC still strikes me as worse- it was institutional and ongoing for 18 years. Louisville scandal is heinous and, having been there, nothing that goes on in that place will surprise me. Can't see how Pitino survives this, however, he recovered from getting caught with his pants down with a staffer's wife in a restaurant after hours. Maybe somehow Slick Rick will make it all go away...

 

[UcMiami]

I don't think there's any question that the North Carolina situation is infinitely worse than the possible Louisville issue. The purpose of college is to educate and when you allow the student athlete to in effect be just a hired gun with no responsibility to educate himself, then you've failed as an institution. UNC has been doing that in many different athletic areas, from what I understand and they should get clobbered with unprecedented impacts on their athletic programs. Maybe those penalties should be pushed a few years out so that present athletes who have done nothing wrong will not have suffered for the institutional failures that have come along but potential incoming players should know before they enroll that they will bear the brunt of previous crimes and thus, many will look for "cleaner" programs where these players won't be penalized for the wrong doing of others. If they willingly would go to North Carolina knowing ahead of time that they will be ineligible for post season play or be on teams that are shorthanded of scholarship players, so be it but the institution itself deserves to be affected adversely by having much weaker programs that could potentially cost the university a massive amount of money and prestige! This is not to say Louisville shouldn't be spanked very hard if reports are true but there's no question the UNC is the much more serious violation.

I think the 'warning' has already been out there for a few years now for UNC, whether any action is taken or not. And typically the 'harshest' aspect of the harsher penalties has been the waver of any restrictions on athletes transferring to other schools by the NCAA which has led in most cases to a number of stars bolting immediately and playing immediately at rival schools.

 

[willtalk]

--------------- This is not to say Louisville shouldn't be spanked very hard if reports are true.-----------------

I that would all depend on who was doing the spanking and in what type of venue it was being carried out. It might other wise constitute throwing Bare. Rabbit into the Briar Patch.

 

[stamfordhusky]

. Can't see how Pitino survives this, however, he recovered from getting caught with his pants down with a staffer's wife in a restaurant after hours. Maybe somehow Slick Rick will make it all go away...

Not that it changes things much - but she was far from a "staffer's wife". In fact, Pitino had never met her before the night in question in the bar/restaurant where they had sex after it closed for the night. The woman was later sentenced to seven years in prison for extortion, perjury, threatening witnesses, and possibly a few other things related to the incident.

 

[j66kicker]

Not that it changes things much - but she was far from a "staffer's wife". In fact, Pitino had never met her before the night in question in the bar/restaurant where they had sex after it closed for the night. The woman was later sentenced to seven years in prison for extortion, perjury, threatening witnesses, and possibly a few other things related to the incident.

Actually there were other rumors about Pitino and a staffer's wife, preceded by rumors about a homos*xual affair between Pitino and that same staffer (@#$%^&*????).

Hey I heard on ESPN radio today Dan LeBatard discussing the latest Louisville debacle with Jalen Rose. They went back to the Pitino/staffer's wife thing and the Pitino/waitress thing. LeBatard was wondering how he keeps getting away with it. Rose reminded him that Bill Clinton got away with it (while the President of France was laughing and making fun of the USA about why this would be such a big deal).

 

[stamfordhusky]

Actually there were other rumors about Pitino and a staffer's wife, preceded by rumors about a homos*xual affair between Pitino and that same staffer (@#$%^&*????).

Hey I heard on ESPN radio today Dan LeBatard discussing the latest Louisville debacle with Jalen Rose. They went back to the Pitino/staffer's wife thing and the Pitino/waitress thing. LeBatard was wondering how he keeps getting away with it. Rose reminded him that Bill Clinton got away with it (while the President of France was laughing and making fun of the USA about why this would be such a big deal).

Yes, but those rumors were not substantiated in any way. The original post, however, was clearly talking about the one I mentioned, i.e. with a "staffer's wife in a restaurant after hours."