The Official 2023 New England Patriots Thread

[Deepster]

I love the reactionary “I’ve been a fan since _______” knee jerks. The most insecure fan base in the NFL.

 

[Husky25]

Seriously? I go back to Joe Kapp and I don't think they'll be good again in my lifetime. The only hope is if the Krafts sell and that's not happening.

Pretty much all franchises go through ups and downs. The Steelers (since 1970), and Ravens (including the pre-expansion Browns) are probably the most consistent.

The 49ers made the playoffs 5 times from 1946 to 1980, before winning the Super Bowl after the 1981 Season. A then-unprecedented 18 years of success (16 Playoff appearances and 4 Super Bowls victories) ensued until Steve Young retired. The 49ers are currently on the up, but they have ebbed as well, just like every other franchise, and have qualified for the playoffs only nine times in the last 24 seasons.

The Patriots will be back, Neither Bob, nor Jonathan Kraft are Victor Kiam, Sam Orthwein, or The Sullivan Family. They built an empire, with the football franchise at the center and showed 31 others how to as well.

 

[Husky25]

Hmm. Interesting turn of events...

 

[HuskyHawk]

Hmm. Interesting turn of events...

I don't want him. Of all the options he's the guy I don't want. More smash mouth football. He's the poor man's version of Bill. I liked him as a player, but if you are moving on then you need to move on.

The team has a huge amount of cap space, a fantastic defensive foundation and a few pieces on offense if they re-sign Onwenu & Bourne and Andrews doesn't retire.

 

[Husky25]

I don't want him. Of all the options he's the guy I don't want. More smash mouth football. He's the poor man's version of Bill. I liked him as a player, but if you are moving on then you need to move on.

The team has a huge amount of cap space, a fantastic defensive foundation and a few pieces on offense if they re-sign Onwenu & Bourne and Andrews doesn't retire.

That's valid.

 

[Husky25]

I don't want him. Of all the options he's the guy I don't want. More smash mouth football. He's the poor man's version of Bill. I liked him as a player, but if you are moving on then you need to move on.

The team has a huge amount of cap space, a fantastic defensive foundation and a few pieces on offense if they re-sign Onwenu & Bourne and Andrews doesn't retire.

I'd take Vrabel coaching the Commanders.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I'd take Vrabel coaching the Commanders.

I'm coming around on Vrabel under one circumstance. One point I think most pundits and fans are missing is that owners don't hire coaches, owners hire GMs who hire coaches. So if Bill is gone, step one is the GM. The hottest GM name has Patriots ties, Adam Peters with the 49ers. He was in NE when Vrabel was and it's believed they could be a package deal wherever Petes goes. That package could work for me. Need a really good OC too, nothing like what the Titans run.

 

[Husky25]

I'm coming around on Vrabel under one circumstance. One point I think most pundits and fans are missing is that owners don't hire coaches, owners hire GMs who hire coaches. So if Bill is gone, step one is the GM. The hottest GM name has Patriots ties, Adam Peters with the 49ers. He was in NE when Vrabel was and it's believed they could be a package deal wherever Petes goes. That package could work for me. Need a really good OC too, nothing like what the Titans run.

Adam Peters is also Josh Harris's first choice for GM.

Also, I believe Kraft did hire Belichick as GM and Head Coach in 2000. The distinction with a slight difference is that he often had a player personnel guy (Grier, Piolli, Casserio) against whom to bounce ideas. He also stumbled into the greatest quarterback to ever put on pads who also happened to be down to Earth (so to speak), team-first, and financially secure outside of football. Not saying that Belichick didn't see potential, but he is not clairvoyant. From splitting time with Drew Henson, no one could have predicted that Brady would end up doing what he did or being what he was on the field.

What I like about Vrabel is that he's been coached by Belichick, but is not from the Belichick coaching tree, all who seem to act like him but do not have the other characteristics to succeed like him. Wiese didn't. Mangini didn't. Not McDaniels or Patricia, and certainly Judge. Only Romeo Crennel and Bill O'Brien had any level of mild success out from under the Belichick umbrella.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Adam Peters is also Josh Harris's first choice for GM.

Also, I believe Kraft did hire Belichick as GM and Head Coach in 2000. The distinction with a slight difference is that he often had a player personnel guy (Grier, Piolli, Casserio) against whom to bounce ideas. He also stumbled into the greatest quarterback to ever put on pads who also happened to be down to Earth (so to speak), team-first, and financially secure outside of football. Not saying that Belichick didn't see potential, but he is not clairvoyant. From splitting time with Drew Henson, no one could have predicted that Brady would end up doing what he did or being what he was on the field.

What I like about Vrabel is that he's been coached by Belichick, but is not from the Belichick coaching tree, all who seem to act like him but do not have the other characteristics to succeed like him. Wiese didn't. Mangini didn't. Not McDaniels or Patricia, and certainly Judge. Only Romeo Crennel and Bill O'Brien had any level of mild success out from under the Belichick umbrella.

That is true, but nobody is making Mike Vrabel Coach-GM like Bill. So the GM decision has to come either before or contemporaneous with the coach decision. I agree that Bill's troubles may stem from the lack of a Pioli/Casserio level guy working with him. There has been huge brain drain in the front office. He also won't embrace analytics, which is a problem.

The latest rumors are that he's clearing out his office. No idea if true. Also, Rappaport is reporting that a big reason why the Titans fired Vrabel is the way he was so glowing about the Patriots at his Patriots HOF induction.

 

[Husky25]

That is true, but nobody is making Mike Vrabel Coach-GM like Bill. So the GM decision has to come either before or contemporaneous with the coach decision. I agree that Bill's troubles may stem from the lack of a Pioli/Casserio level guy working with him. There has been huge brain drain in the front office. He also won't embrace analytics, which is a problem.

The latest rumors are that he's clearing out his office. No idea if true. Also, Rappaport is reporting that a big reason why the Titans fired Vrabel is the way he was so glowing about the Patriots at his Patriots HOF induction.

That's Boston-College-firing-Jagodzinski level petty. On the other hand if the owner thinks his heart is not all in, then I guess it makes sense.

 

[Waquoit]

The Pats hiring Vrabel over Jerrod Mayo is a non-starter, imo.

 

[Husky25]

This tracks with Josh Harris's public comments of not chasing after "retreads."

 

[Husky25]

 

[HuskyHawk]

Currann is such an idiot. Always throwing out clickbait. GM will have a say in HC hire. Rooney rule requires interviews, HC is not decided.

 

[HuskyHawk]

My impression on why Bill is gone. Kraft is old, he has to set the team up for the future. Adam Peters is the #1 GM name out there, and he worked for Bill in the front office for six years. Young, smart GM with ties to the Patriots. Hard to pass that up. Would he come if Bill was HC/Co-GM? No. Commanders also want him. So to get Peters, and set the Pats up for years to come, you have to part with Bill. The fact that you now have Vrabel and/or Mayo as HC options and that Peters would likely support Vrabel (he was in NE when Mike was) is a plus. People focus on Bill the coach, but what was critical is replacing Bill the GM.

GM: Adam Peters
HC: Mike Vrabel
DC: Jerod Mayo
OC: Bill O'Brien or new guy

 

[Waquoit]

Currann is such an idiot.

Didn't he have BB fired weeks ago? And didn't you call him a POS?

 

[HuskyHawk]

Didn't he have BB fired weeks ago? And didn't you call him a POS?

He was wrong then. He posted click-bait then and it turned out that the decision was to move on, but it was not made after the game in Germany as he said. Kraft today talked about how they tried to see if a new GM with Bill coaching would work.

Obviously, the coaching decision isn't made yet. Is Mayo a strong candidate? Of course. Curran might ultimately guess right, but the decision isn't made. Not only that, reporting that is made can lead to fines and penalties to the team because they have to comply with the Rooney rule. The crew at NBA Sports Boston is the worst.

 

[navery12]

He was wrong then. He posted click-bait then and it turned out that the decision was to move on, but it was not made after the game in Germany as he said. Kraft today talked about how they tried to see if a new GM with Bill coaching would work.

Obviously, the coaching decision isn't made yet. Is Mayo a strong candidate? Of course. Curran might ultimately guess right, but the decision isn't made. Not only that, reporting that is made can lead to fines and penalties to the team because they have to comply with the Rooney rule. The crew at NBA Sports Boston is the worst.

Or it was made and he reported it

 

[HuskyHawk]

Or it was made and he reported it

Hello, Rooney rule? Did Kraft just piss away the #3 pick in the draft?

 

[navery12]

Hello, Rooney rule? Did Kraft just piss away the #3 pick in the draft?

No

 

[Husky25]

Not only that, reporting that is made can lead to fines and penalties to the team because they have to comply with the Rooney rule. The crew at NBA Sports Boston is the worst.

Mayo is black and an internal candidate. I'm pretty sure Kraft didn't circumvent the Rooney Rule.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Mayo is black and an internal candidate. I'm pretty sure Kraft didn't circumvent the Rooney Rule.

Even if he's black and internal, the Rooney Rule requires interview of external candidates. Seems they avoided it with this contract move. Because otherwise it would still apply. Do not like this move at all. He may be fine, but doing it before the GM hire is stupid.

The Rooney Rule | NFL Football Operations

operations.nfl.com

 

[Waquoit]

Keep trying Hawk, one of these days you'll be right about something.

 

[superjohn]

Assistant who was given a promise, he's only been a linebackers coach, no coaching search, hiring him without a GM, not moving on from what hasn't been working. This has very little chance of working out IMO.

 

[Deepster]

Assistant who was given a promise, he's only been a linebackers coach, no coaching search, hiring him without a GM, not moving on from what hasn't been working. This has very little chance of working out IMO.

I have found it entertaining how matter of fact Pats nation thinks it’ll be getting back to a Super Bowl. They have forgotten what it’s like to stink.