OT: walking dead

[meyers7]

Just heard this AM, that most media outlets report that showrunner Glenn Mazara was dismissed because this season 3.5 is a mess - I thought I saw signs of that in this recent episode.

That was announced quite awhile ago. Like back in Dec. It's been reported because AMC and Mazzara have a difference in opinion on what direction the show should go, particularly in Season 4, not so much with Season 3. At least the stuff I read. Here's an interview with Mazzara on that.
http://www.vulture.com/2013/02/glen-mazzara-on-leaving-the-walking-dead.html

With respect to Michone argument maybe they get to it, but I was super-curious after her awesome debut at the end of season 2 so I did my only comic digging. SPOILER ALERT - so come to find out that her walkers were a former boyfriend and I think her brother. Great and interesting angle! But not so interesting as portrayed on the show as they lopped their heads off before providing any of that backstory. And during her alleged 'opening up' to Andrea she never disclosed who the heck they were. A big missed character development moment foregone simply and literally for her continued sole function to swing a cool katama. Her non-speaking is inexplicable and done only to further action plot*. I'm fine with that, but it is what it is.

I agree, I would much rather Michonne speak more. Seems like it would clear up a lot of stuff. But that does not seem the way they want to portray her. Doesn't make the writers "too dim to write any dialogue for Michone". They are just going a different route with her than you may like. They don't seem to want to get into her back story.

Kirkman himself has said he likes for the TV show to diverge from the comics. One, to keep the comic readers surprised. Two, because he said sometimes the writers/director/producers actually have better/more interesting ideas than what he thought of when writing the comics.

 

[meyers7]

As an aside, has any one played the Walking Dead game? I bought it last week and am only through the first episode, but its pretty interesting. A cool companion piece to the show and deals with some of the same characters even, although not in the same timeline.

Sorry, I haven't played in video games in many, many years. I know there is the new one coming out about the Dixon brothers, that's supposed to be pretty good.

I don't even own any systems to play the games on. I'm old.

 

[Mano]

Sorry, I haven't played in video games in many, many years. I know there is the new one coming out about the Dixon brothers, that's supposed to be pretty good.

I don't even own any systems to play the games on. I'm old.

It's available for iOS devices too, so if you have an iPhone or iPad...

 

[meyers7]

It's available for iOS devices too, so if you have an iPhone or iPad...

I'd never able to see it on my iPhone.

 

[Vuce]

It's been reported because AMC and Mazzara have a difference in opinion on what direction the show should go, particularly in Season 4, not so much with Season 3. At least the stuff I read.

I read that Mazzarra had a difference of opinion with others at AMC - some of it revolving around the baby. Mazzarra wanted the baby storyline as he thought without it the future in this world was hopeless. I would rather the baby not be in it as it restricts a lot of what the characters can do. If that is one of the main sticking points then I am fine with him moving on.

 

[meyers7]

I read that Mazzarra had a difference of opinion with others at AMC - some of it revolving around the baby. Mazzarra wanted the baby storyline as he thought without it the future in this world was hopeless. I would rather the baby not be in it as it restricts a lot of what the characters can do. If that is one of the main sticking points then I am fine with him moving on.

I hadn't read what the difference of opinion was. I suppose that could be one. I've read that, in the comic books, the baby didn't last that long. We'll see if they follow or go a different route.

Although we just saw another baby out on the open road in this last episode. Wasn't working too well, but maybe it shows it's possible???

 

[Dogdeacon]

I liked this 2nd episode a lot more. Various character or plot silences are inexplicable (particularly Michonne again, why not tell the group she saw Rick wandering around outside the prison in a stupor - useful for protection, building her case if Rick is against her etc..) but the good far out-weighed the bad. Scenes with Darryl and bro were perfect.

Do you think the Governor was playing with the prison group like a cat with a mouse? Scene was good but 'character shields' a little too high. The Gov had a decent chance to annihilate with the assualt. It would have been helpful to see the shooter climbing the tower and I haven't a clue what happened to the person that drove the van full of walkers and if they effectively donated that thing to the prison group?

To nitpick further, no real explanation why the Gov. lied to Andrea. Just so she wouldn't stop him? Didn't show her accomplishing any necessary tasks in his absence. I guess if he thought he might die this lie was purposeful, but otherwise its going to be pretty tough to maintain plausible deniability on his return. He's got to either try to bring her inside and recruit her as a 2nd or push her away. Given that why not just kill her or if he's such a sadist maybe further terrorize the prison group by sacrificing her to the walkers during the attack. This is the general problem with the show, things that provide plot are chosen versus logical best moves.

Despite all that I enjoyed the episode because of fantastic Darryl zombie kills and even though you knew it was coming they still caught you by surprise when the Governor attacked.

 

[meyers7]

I liked this 2nd episode a lot more. Various character or plot silences are inexplicable (particularly Michonne again, why not tell the group she saw Rick wandering around outside the prison in a stupor - useful for protection, building her case if Rick is against her etc..) but the good far out-weighed the bad. Scenes with Darryl and bro were perfect.

Not sure she didn't. They didn't show it, but Hershel knew where to find him. Just a guess. In one of the Inside the Episode video's the actress mentioned Michonne wasn't sure what Rick was doing out there at first. Thought there might be some kind of threat he saw, but finally figured out he's seeing things.

It was a good episode. Those last 10 minutes were really good.

Do you think the Governor was playing with the prison group like a cat with a mouse? Scene was good but 'character shields' a little too high. The Gov had a decent chance to annihilate with the assualt. It would have been helpful to see the shooter climbing the tower and I haven't a clue what happened to the person that drove the van full of walkers and if they effectively donated that thing to the prison group?

Again in one of the Inside the Episode video's Morrisey talked about the Governor really didn't know the size of the force at the prison and he was kind of feeling it out. Kind of a hit and run and see what they got. How their defenses are, how many men he might need to take the prison. Plus he doesn't like Rick or Michonne much at all so anything to make their life miserable....make them expend energy/ammunition clearing the yard and fixing the fences. Really besides figuring out what he was against (remember he was very impressed this group had done something everyone (Merle) had told him couldn't be done...i.e. clear the prison), he's pretty messed up in the head, and enjoys F*&#ing with his enemies. At this point I don't think he really cares whether he lives or dies or what happens to Woodbury, but just wants revenge.

I assume the driver got away, got picked up. Rick tried to shoot him (there's talk it was a her - there is a character "Lilly" from the comics who was pretty big in Woodbury that hasn't been used in the TV show????) but he had run out of ammo. Yea and it looks like they have a bread truck now....probably without keys though.

To nitpick further, no real explanation why the Gov. lied to Andrea. Just so she wouldn't stop him? Didn't show her accomplishing any necessary tasks in his absence. I guess if he thought he might die this lie was purposeful, but otherwise its going to be pretty tough to maintain plausible deniability on his return. He's got to either try to bring her inside and recruit her as a 2nd or push her away. Given that why not just kill her or if he's such a sadist maybe further terrorize the prison group by sacrificing her to the walkers during the attack. This is the general problem with the show, things that provide plot are chosen versus logical best moves.

I don't think he trusts her. So it was to kind of throw her off while he went off on his little scouting raid. I think he likes her and wants her to choose Woodbury, but he's not sure if he can trust her against her old friends. She hasn't done anything to him (like Rick and Michonne have). He also knows she is pretty tough (or can be, was). She's from this group that took the prison, she survived months out on the road. Also one has to remember as in life now, people don't always make the best (most logical) choices.

 

[Fishy]

Given that why not just kill her or if he's such a sadist maybe further terrorize the prison group by sacrificing her to the walkers during the attack. This is the general problem with the show, things that provide plot are chosen versus logical best moves.

Write this down somewhere.

If you're in a zombie apocalypse, never, ever, never discard a perfectly good blond chick.

 

[meyers7]

Write this down somewhere.

If you're in a zombie apocalypse, never, ever, never discard a perfectly good blond chick.

Who can shoot.

 

[Dogdeacon]

Who can shoot.

Fine and dandy, then simply tell her what you are up to a lot earlier. Saving heads motivated you to keep strong & remember its zombie nightmare-land outside despite the Mayberry pretense, tell her rogue Merle captured the prison folk and then more recently say you are going to the prison to raise a little hell and see what you are up against.

My point was not telling her was awfully similar to throwing away a perfectly good wife-resembling blond chick. She is in or she's out, none of this halfway bs.

I don't like that a lot of the answers for things are that the characters aren't that smart, are stressed and sometimes make poor choices - I think it is at least equally true that the directors/showrunners are this way.

 

[meyers7]

Fine and dandy, then simply tell her what you are up to a lot earlier. Saving heads motivated you to keep strong & remember its zombie nightmare-land outside despite the Mayberry pretense, tell her rogue Merle captured the prison folk and then more recently say you are going to the prison to raise a little hell and see what you are up against.

My point was not telling her was awfully similar to throwing away a perfectly good wife-resembling blond chick. She is in or she's out, none of this halfway bs.

Well of course those comments (mine and Fishy) where in jest. However, having her halfway is exactly where she is. He would love her to stay and choose his side. However, he knows she may choose their side. He doesn't exactly need another enemy. And he knows she is fairly formidable. Better to keep her halfway now until she completely abandons him (if she does). Best not to let her get close to her friends either and let her here their side of the story. He knows she's not going to like him harassing and killing her friends. And if she has problems with him, maybe he can convince her she is saving the people of Woodbury against her old friends.

The way I think this may play out is eventually she goes against him. She finally completely figures him out. I think at that point he will want to get rid of her instead of having her join Team Prison against him. Now how does she escape at this point? I think Tyreese and his group have to turn up somewhere....Woodbury. Tyreese probably gets sucked in to Woodbury like others do until they see the dark side. I figure Andrea and Tyreese will figure it out about the same time and Tyreese and Sacha help Andrea escape. Allen and Ben end up fighting (and dying) with the Governor.

I don't like that a lot of the answers for things are that the characters aren't that smart, are stressed and sometimes make poor choices - I think it is at least equally true that the directors/showrunners are this way.

Well why not? People in real life make bad choices when they are stressed. Why not here? It's logical. Granted writers/directors/showrunners may make poor choices, but I don't see the characters making poor choices under stress as proof of that. It's much more logical that they would. It would be illogical to think they always did the right thing.

 

[Dogdeacon]

Well of course those comments (mine and Fishy) where in jest. However, having her halfway is exactly where she is. He would love her to stay and choose his side. However, he knows she may choose their side. He doesn't exactly need another enemy. And he knows she is fairly formidable. Better to keep her halfway now until she completely abandons him (if she does). Best not to let her get close to her friends either and let her here their side of the story. He knows she's not going to like him harassing and killing her friends. And if she has problems with him, maybe he can convince her she is saving the people of Woodbury against her old friends.

The way I think this may play out is eventually she goes against him. She finally completely figures him out. I think at that point he will want to get rid of her instead of having her join Team Prison against him. Now how does she escape at this point? I think Tyreese and his group have to turn up somewhere....Woodbury. Tyreese probably gets sucked in to Woodbury like others do until they see the dark side. I figure Andrea and Tyreese will figure it out about the same time and Tyreese and Sacha help Andrea escape. Allen and Ben end up fighting (and dying) with the Governor.


Well why not? People in real life make bad choices when they are stressed. Why not here? It's logical. Granted writers/directors/showrunners may make poor choices, but I don't see the characters making poor choices under stress as proof of that. It's much more logical that they would. It would be illogical to think they always did the right thing.

Sorry if my tone was too serious, was intended more sarcastic (towards show not you). I think you are right that Andrea eventually goes against him and maybe he knows this too since he displayed some recognition of the fact that he was nuts (keeping my daughter) even while he was choosing to still act nuts (striking a blow to prison for revenge purposes). I guess if he knows he's an unlovable sadist that can only lead the weak by intimidation (killng nat'l guard folks) then he also knows he can never let anyone too close (hence pre-Andrea 'anyone ever calls me Francis, I'll kill ya' err I mean anything but Governor). I just wish he'd be a little smarter about it all. Even in these zombie apocalypse stressful times you have to be extra careful and think everything through looking at all the angles.

= Play on Andrea's leadership ambitions and tell her that you are going to Prison to try and negotiate a truce. Sure she'd have tried to stop him, but ultimately what is she going to do. Later when people die you can blame them (she won't hear their side unless she defects) and possibly manipulate her to your side. He might not have gotten any good Andrea intel from Merle, but he could have gotten quite a bit from the Korean and the babe. With that info he could easily be cementing her loyalties to him . Heck just lie to her and tell her that the Korean dude confessed that they purposefully left her behind because they thought she was a hothead liability. Easy

 

[meyers7]

I just wish he'd be a little smarter about it all. Even in these zombie apocalypse stressful times you have to be extra careful and think everything through looking at all the angles.

True, but the guy is crazy. So you can only expect so much. Crazy psychopathic people don't always think things through.

= Play on Andrea's leadership ambitions and tell her that you are going to Prison to try and negotiate a truce. Sure she'd have tried to stop him, but ultimately what is she going to do. Later when people die you can blame them (she won't hear their side unless she defects) and possibly manipulate her to your side. He might not have gotten any good Andrea intel from Merle, but he could have gotten quite a bit from the Korean and the babe. With that info he could easily be cementing her loyalties to him . Heck just lie to her and tell her that the Korean dude confessed that they purposefully left her behind because they thought she was a hothead liability. Easy

Hmmmm, now what's she going to do??? Knew she wouldn't kill him.....then season 3 would be over. I'm thinking she might try but fail and he locks her up to deal with her later. Maybe plans to bring the heads of her friends back to show her. Tyreese and Sacha figure out Woodbury and help her escape. Maybe show up to turn the tide in the final battle of Woodbury vs Prison????

 

[meyers7]

Interesting poll in The Day on Sunday.

It's Oscar Sunday. What are you most interested in watching?

I want to see if Ben Affleck hand it to the Oscar voters by winning Best Picture with Argo? - 25%
I want to see the Chastain vs Lawrence faceoff in the Best Actress category - 3%
I won't be tuning in. Meryl Streep isn't up for anything and I'm peeved our local Hope Springs wasn't recognized. - 7%
I'm still fuming about Kushner's Lincoln inaccuracies - 10%
I'll be watching the Walking Dead instead. - 55%

 

[Dogdeacon]

True, but the guy is crazy. So you can only expect so much. Crazy psychopathic people don't always think things through.



Hmmmm, now what's she going to do??? Knew she wouldn't kill him.....then season 3 would be over. I'm thinking she might try but fail and he locks her up to deal with her later. Maybe plans to bring the heads of her friends back to show her. Tyreese and Sacha figure out Woodbury and help her escape. Maybe show up to turn the tide in the final battle of Woodbury vs Prison????

Great episode. Gave me some Michonne dialogue motivation which I'd been DYING for. Did they imply romantic feelings towards Andrea on Michonne's part?

Scene with Rick and his son was great.

Then I was begging for Rick & Co. to ask her to assinate the Governor and lo and behold formerly beaten shaved head woman steps up to the plate. Nice! I will have to learn her name.

And they perfectly captured what Milton would have done, only quizzical thing is what the Governor's play was in having him help Andrea. I guess they are saying let it go and if it comes back its yours, but he still should have been a little more suspicious of her particularly given the brutality stories Michonne and Merle could have relayed.

Agree unfortunately they couldn't have her kill him that quick, weird cuz I don't think she would have slept with him if that wasn't her intention (after hearing he hunted down Michonne its pretty clear Andrea knows he can be a ruthless liar and killer - does she think he's redeemable or did she just come back because the prison was so bleak) but maybe its more interesting if she works either sabotage or as an ultimate assassin from the inside. Better choice/drama storyline to NOT have her kill him but at least start to and I was happy that didn't have the cliched suddenly Governor magically wakes up and grabs the knife. I think Andrea's play has to be to try and unite the clans with her as the new leader of Woodbury. And if she assinates the governor in the middle of the night it'd be pretty tough to sell that to the populace (maybe if she beat herself up afterwards and claimed self defense) and his henchman would absolutely kill her regardless. So her best play was to not kill him until battle lends an opportunity (the Barnes kills Elias strategy - does that make Milton Chris/Charlie Sheen?!).

 

[meyers7]

Great episode. Gave me some Michonne dialogue motivation which I'd been DYING for. Did they imply romantic feelings towards Andrea on Michonne's part?

Don't know if they were romantic?? Probably just very close friends. They spent the whole winter together. Really only person who Michonne has connected with since Wildfire started (besides her two"pets"). Andrea seems pretty heterosexual (Shane, Governor), but you never know?

Scene with Rick and his son was great.

In the "Inside Episode 11" video (they make one for every episode), Andrew Lincoln (Rick) says that is the turning point for Rick. When your own kid tells you you are messed up, it hits home.

Then I was begging for Rick & Co. to ask her to assinate the Governor and lo and behold formerly beaten shaved head woman steps up to the plate. Nice! I will have to learn her name.

Carol (Melissa McBride, she's been in a couple other Darabont films) . She's been there since Season 1 episode 2. She's really picking up fans too. Helps that she is linked with the most popular character, Daryl. It was a nice touch to have her come up with the "screw him and stick him". Quite a change from Season 1 and 2 for her.

And they perfectly captured what Milton would have done, only quizzical thing is what the Governor's play was in having him help Andrea. I guess they are saying let it go and if it comes back its yours, but he still should have been a little more suspicious of her particularly given the brutality stories Michonne and Merle could have relayed.

Might be testing her. Trying to find out where her loyalties do lie. If she comes back she's on his side. And he might 1) not care whether he lives or dies now that he has nothing to live for or 2) think himself invincible. He's the Governor.

Agree unfortunately they couldn't have her kill him that quick, weird cuz I don't think she would have slept with him if that wasn't her intention (after hearing he hunted down Michonne its pretty clear Andrea knows he can be a ruthless liar and killer - does she think he's redeemable or did she just come back because the prison was so bleak) but maybe its more interesting if she works either sabotage or as an ultimate assassin from the inside. Better choice/drama storyline to NOT have her kill him but at least start to and I was happy that didn't have the cliched suddenly Governor magically wakes up and grabs the knife. I think Andrea's play has to be to try and unite the clans with her as the new leader of Woodbury. And if she assinates the governor in the middle of the night it'd be pretty tough to sell that to the populace (maybe if she beat herself up afterwards and claimed self defense) and his henchman would absolutely kill her regardless. So her best play was to not kill him until battle lends an opportunity (the Barnes kills Elias strategy - does that make Milton Chris/Charlie Sheen?!).

Good points. If she assassinates him, how does she explain it to Martinez and Martin? And Woodbury?? And how does she get escape after she does it? She had to have a pet walker to get to the prison the first time. Maybe that's what's stopping her?? On the "Inside Episode 11", Laurie Holden (Andrea) said when Michonne and Andrea talked, Andrea realized what a fool she had been. And it was Andrea's intention going back to Woodbury to kill the Governor. Rick gave her a knife to slit his throat (hope she remembers to stab him in the head too ) .

So I think she is on Team Prison's side now, but just how or when to carry it out....might not be as easy. Now will she stay on Team Prison's side or try to figure out some what to get rid of the Governor.

Here is a link to Kirkman's take on Andrea's dilemma.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/walking-dead-spoilers-andrea-kill-governor-423816

 

[Dogdeacon]

Interesting stuff. I have a general aversion or objection to interviews and articles fully explaining characters and show motivation. Generally the art should speak for itself particularly during a season. But I understand this is part of the TV universe these days.

It can be interesting and affirming when a showrunner or character confirms a possible interpretation or motivation viewers are thinking, but I think this is best left to post-season analysis. Rick should have said, 'when your son says that to you it is a big moment' (turning point a little too much give-away of his reaction and subsequent actions). But I'm nitpicking.

Vince Gilligan (Breaking Bad) is very purposefully cryptic about his characters motivations and reasoning in a weekly podcast for that show that essentially is an inside the making of.

Matthew Weiner (Mad Men) tends to occasionally reveal general themes (last season "every man for himself") by requoting his characters. And post-season he'll sometimes engage further, but he maintain the artifice of keeping his characters as real people about whom he is speculating on their motivations. For example regarding the great Suitcase episode "Matthew Weiner compared Peggy's standing at Sterling Cooper Draper Pryce to his own standing while working under David Chase on The Sopranos. Jon Hamm commended the writers for adding in the conversation that references the child Peggy gave away, calling it "heartbreaking" for Peggy. Matthew Weiner said, "they can acknowledge that that happened. Even though they had sworn to never talk about it together, this is the place that they can talk about it."

 

[huskysupporter]

Season 3 is an absolute train wreck. I will keep watching in the hope the story actually picks up.

 

[meyers7]

Season 3 is an absolute train wreck. I will keep watching in the hope the story actually picks up.

Have to completely disagree. By far the best season yet.

 

[meyers7]

Interesting stuff. I have a general aversion or objection to interviews and articles fully explaining characters and show motivation. Generally the art should speak for itself particularly during a season. But I understand this is part of the TV universe these days.

It can be interesting and affirming when a showrunner or character confirms a possible interpretation or motivation viewers are thinking, but I think this is best left to post-season analysis. Rick should have said, 'when your son says that to you it is a big moment' (turning point a little too much give-away of his reaction and subsequent actions). But I'm nitpicking.

I like to see what they are trying to get across. Whether they do or not. Or compare my interpretation with theirs. Sometimes if you know what they were trying to do, you can look back at scenes/dialogue and go "oh I see what they were doing there, yea that was good".

Of course it might be better if the didn't have to, but then there would be no subtlety to it either at that point. Unlike comic books, you don't have thought bubbles.

Oh yea and another thing on Andrea's killing/not killing the Governor. She has never killed a human before. Sure plenty of walkers, but not an unarmed human. Sleeping one at that. Have to remember how much trouble they had with killing Randell. And Andrea at that time fell on the side of Dale in not wanting to kill Randall. (just remembered that)

 

[Dogdeacon]

I like to see what they are trying to get across. Whether they do or not. Or compare my interpretation with theirs. Sometimes if you know what they were trying to do, you can look back at scenes/dialogue and go "oh I see what they were doing there, yea that was good".

Of course it might be better if the didn't have to, but then there would be no subtlety to it either at that point. Unlike comic books, you don't have thought bubbles.

Oh yea and another thing on Andrea's killing/not killing the Governor. She has never killed a human before. Sure plenty of walkers, but not an unarmed human. Sleeping one at that. Have to remember how much trouble they had with killing Randell. And Andrea at that time fell on the side of Dale in not wanting to kill Randall. (just remembered that)

Yep on Andrea, like I said - I think it was the BEST choice for her character not to kill him at that point and that's my theme here that I'm kind of a TV game theorist in that I like to be able to see that characters made the best possible choice from their perspective. When strategy and emotion (killing a human) align all the more power. I think in order to play up that human angle they might have showed if she was acting or into their fornication - i.e. if she's checking her watch then pausing to kill him has more emotional weight b/c you've kind of seen her commit to the strategy.

A criticism I've heard since (and a frequent prob of this show) is why everyone at the prison relay stories of Governor's treachery to get Andrea to flip or be their assassin, Merle could have told of the army murders and especically Glenn's girlfriend had to tell Andrea about the Governor's near rape and humiliation of her by making her strip! The latter would have helped my scenario above as Andrea's skin would have been crawlin' to bed down with his Governing-skeeviness.

 

[meyers7]

Yep on Andrea, like I said - I think it was the BEST choice for her character not to kill him at that point and that's my theme here that I'm kind of a TV game theorist in that I like to be able to see that characters made the best possible choice from their perspective. When strategy and emotion (killing a human) align all the more power. I think in order to play up that human angle they might have showed if she was acting or into their fornication - i.e. if she's checking her watch then pausing to kill him has more emotional weight b/c you've kind of seen her commit to the strategy.

True, but they have pretty much shied away from the sex stuff. Usually it's a couple kisses then fade to later. As most TV/movies, the violence is fine, but don't show any sex.

We knew she wasn't going to kill him, not dramatic enough at this point. Gotta be at end of season or maybe even into next season. Although they did kill off Shane before the last episode of Season 2??? Be interesting to see who does kill him? Andrea turns against him? Rick, leader vs leader, crazy vs crazy? Maggie or Glenn for revenge? Merle for redemption (like Vader and Palpatine?)? Maybe Carl to save his dad? So many possibilities.

A criticism I've heard since (and a frequent prob of this show) is why everyone at the prison relay stories of Governor's treachery to get Andrea to flip or be their assassin, Merle could have told of the army murders and especically Glenn's girlfriend had to tell Andrea about the Governor's near rape and humiliation of her by making her strip! The latter would have helped my scenario above as Andrea's skin would have been crawlin' to bed down with his Governing-skeeviness.

I think Merle assumes she knows. Or should have a clue. He was close to the Governor and knew what the Governor did. I think he assumes the same for her. Although the Governor has hidden quite a bit from her. And unlike Michonne, she really hasn't gone looking for faults. At one point in the prison conversations with Andrea, when she was talking about working something out, Merle kind of looked at her and said, you know better than that. (that ain't gonna happen)

As for Maggie, I don't think she wants to talk to Glenn, Beth or her dad about what happened at Woodbury, let alone with Andrea (open up to someone who might try to defend him, has been sleeping with him??? don't think she wants to go through that.) I think Maggie just wants to forget it ever happened. Agreed this should definitely change the way Andrea thinks about the Governor from a sex standpoint. Even if her plan was to screw and kill.

I think that might have been her plan, but either she's not quite got the stomach for killing an unarmed human (as opposed to self defense or a walker), or hasn't figured out how to make it all work out (her escape and such), I don't know? Or maybe she still thinks she can work everything out. bring peace without killing??? Which isn't going to happen.

In Andrea's defense it's hard to admit you've made a serious mistake in judgement. Especially with someone you are sleeping with. To realize you've fallen for and been intimate with a psycho. She thinks she's smart, and she has to come to the acceptance that she makes really bad character judgements. (Shane, Governor).

 

[Dogdeacon]

Another interesting theory is maybe Milton is the executioner. They gave him a little bit of juice for this when he commented to Andrea that the Gov's hit on the prison is not the strategy he'd choose. I tend to think not as the tattletale on Andrea was completely consistent with what we've seen from his character so far in being a mouse and wanting only to gain favor with the governor. But at some point he has to be smart enough to understand that the guy is psycho in his dealings and Milton wasted his damn time trying to bring dead zombie's back to life (physically impossible notwithstanding the physical impossibilities of zombies in general) versus trying to figure out exactly what the zombie virus is and if there is any cure/prevention. I don't think the actor is that strong though and they haven't given the character enough depth to carry-on, so maybe 5% chance that he offs the governor but if he does he likely dies in the act or soon thereafter.

Governor Killer Odds
Rick - 49% - still leader, most satisfying for viewers
Andrea - 25% - maybe low given that she's standing over him with a knife as I type, but I fear he's about to wake-up and grab said knife
Merle - 15% - Allows him to stay on show via building trust with Rick's group
Milton - 5% - see above
Darryl - 5% - because he's the baddest mofo out there
0.5% Glenn - How dare you look at my girlfriend's boobies!
0.25% Maggie - How dare you look at my boobies
0.125% Herschell - How dare you look at my daughter's boobies
0.125 - Field/Rick Jr - Just to write boobies one more time

 

[meyers7]

Another interesting theory is maybe Milton is the executioner. They gave him a little bit of juice for this when he commented to Andrea that the Gov's hit on the prison is not the strategy he'd choose. I tend to think not as the tattletale on Andrea was completely consistent with what we've seen from his character so far in being a mouse and wanting only to gain favor with the governor. But at some point he has to be smart enough to understand that the guy is psycho in his dealings and Milton wasted his damn time trying to bring dead zombie's back to life (physically impossible notwithstanding the physical impossibilities of zombies in general) versus trying to figure out exactly what the zombie virus is and if there is any cure/prevention. I don't think the actor is that strong though and they haven't given the character enough depth to carry-on, so maybe 5% chance that he offs the governor but if he does he likely dies in the act or soon thereafter.

hmmm interesting theory. I don't see Milton doing it though. Although it would be unexpected. Don't think there would be a big enough viewer payoff for the writers. I'm sure he is plenty smart enough to understand the Governor is psycho. And he probably doesn't approve of the Governor or his methods. However, 1) as a science geek, and a weak fighter he's not well equipped for the apocalypse. Without the Governor or Woodbury, he'd be dead. He knows that. 2) In Woodbury he has pretty high status. Kind of 2nd in command or at least nobody is going to bother him knowing his position with the Governor. By helping keep the Governor in his position (and alive), he maintains Woodbury and his position. So don't think he would kill the Gov except to save his own life. He'd want Woodbury and the Gov maintained as long as possible. However I think if it came to a point of Woodbury and the Gov was a lost cause, he'd switch allegiances to stay alive. Or stay protected. He'd have a real tough time out on the road.

Governor Killer Odds
Rick - 49% - still leader, most satisfying for viewers
Andrea - 25% - maybe low given that she's standing over him with a knife as I type, but I fear he's about to wake-up and grab said knife
Merle - 15% - Allows him to stay on show via building trust with Rick's group
Milton - 5% - see above
Darryl - 5% - because he's the baddest mofo out there
0.5% Glenn - How dare you look at my girlfriend's boobies!
0.25% Maggie - How dare you look at my boobies
0.125% Herschell - How dare you look at my daughter's boobies
0.125 - Field/Rick Jr - Just to write boobies one more time

hmmm, nice work. You must have loved Seth McFarlane's Oscar booby song.

Although I think the viewers would love a Maggie revenge killing. I see Merle as more of a last dying effort to save someone in the group. Real redeeming if it was for Glenn. That may happen anyway independent of the Gov. (like sometime in the attack)

Daryl would only be if the Gov kills Merle, again presumably Merle sacrifices himself to save someone, the Gov kills him, and Daryl kills the Gov. Don't see that one happening though.

I think maybe Andrea and Michonne had their chances?? Though I think the writers would give Andrea another chance. She gets to redeem herself. She'll need to if she is to continue in the show.

The good thing, for the writers, is they can kill off the characters (and they will a few before the end of the season), either by humans or walkers. Like Rick was almost killed by walkers last week (Dixon brothers to the rescue). They can get someone stuck without ammo, isolated from the group, surrounded by walkers. Heck, they could even do it to the Gov. Seeing him eaten by walkers would be satisfying for the viewer also. Ripped apart, suffering? Yea that could work.

They could also get a double killing. Someone kills the Gov, and someone else get to kill Walker Gov. (like Shane)