An alternate take on the $$$ issue.

[Jaydumo20]

The Ohio State - Sean Miller thread got me thinking:
I know this topic has been bubbling under the surface but I feel the need to address something that hasn't gotten much consideration.

It's not news that this country has a preoccupation with $$$ above all else. This sentiment is not shared around the globe, as hard as it may seem to believe.

Given this predisposition, I feel that we automatically consider a big 4- big football school bball job- a better job for a coach than a job at a non p4. Simply because of the $$$ in salary, or facilities etc.

But the big football schools have not turned this over in terms of titles or success in the ncaa. Have football schools had success? Yes. But if the argument is that being a big football school translates to college bball success, then the results are dubious. It is specious reasoning.

This is the era of NIL. We are not a football school, nor is Marquette, nor is Creighton but it's working out for for us.

The big $$$ p4 job has yet to prove itself as a cbb program builder or a better situation for a coach, over the non P4.

There is more to coaching success and happiness than a big check. More to life as well. Have a good weekend. Go UConn

 

[SubbaBub]

We are less than 18 months into the modern NIL era. The big names will profit most. They have the most money and the most hype. It's the rest that have an opportunity to better their station if they act wisely.

 

[ec33]

This sentiment is not shared around the globe, as hard as it may seem to believe.

The major soccer clubs have trouble amassing all the talent?

As strange as it may seem - preferring more money to less money is pretty standard around the globe.

 

[Jaydumo20]

The major soccer clubs have trouble amassing all the talent?

As strange as it may seem - preferring more money to less money is pretty standard around the globe.

True, but not if it forsakes
other more important factors. There are people who believe that money is the only way to happiness, so they won't grasp this:

There are numerous doctors, lawyers, etc. that choose lower paying jobs in order to help humanity.

US trained doctors who choose to practice in 3rd world countries. Lawyers who choose civil rights law.

Same can be said with CBB. Let's take OSU. I know a few OSU grads, all obsessed with football, barely touch buckeye basketball. If you are the coach of uconn, or gonzaga, you are a hero in the state. If you coach OSU... you aren't. The basketball culture at the two former schools is leagues above that in columbus.

 

[huskyharry]

The Ohio State - Sean Miller thread got me thinking:
I know this topic has been bubbling under the surface but I feel the need to address something that hasn't gotten much consideration.

It's not news that this country has a preoccupation with $$$ above all else. This sentiment is not shared around the globe, as hard as it may seem to believe.

Given this predisposition, I feel that we automatically consider a big 4- big football school bball job- a better job for a coach than a job at a non p4. Simply because of the $$$ in salary, or facilities etc.

But the big football schools have not turned this over in terms of titles or success in the ncaa. Have football schools had success? Yes. But if the argument is that being a big football school translates to college bball success, then the results are dubious. It is specious reasoning.

This is the era of NIL. We are not a football school, nor is Marquette, nor is Creighton but it's working out for for us.

The big $$$ p4 job has yet to prove itself as a cbb program builder or a better situation for a coach, over the non P4.

There is more to coaching success and happiness than a big check. More to life as well. Have a good weekend. Go UConn

Especially true when the person is already a multi-millionaire...better to stay where you are happy IMO

 

[manbyrd]

It's a good point and something that I'm sure factors into coaches' decisions when there is an opening. You kind of have a feel if a school is a football or basketball school - and sports compete for resources, attention and influence within an athletic department. But everyone has a price and with NIL now you have to factor in how much $$$ there is to get players so your program can succeed. The sweet spot would be the P4 football revenue at a basketball school like Kansas/Kentucky.

 

[yungdowork]

Same can be said with CBB. Let's take OSU. I know a few OSU grads, all obsessed with football, barely touch buckeye basketball. If you are the coach of uconn, or gonzaga, you are a hero in the state. If you coach OSU... you aren't. The basketball culture at the two former schools is leagues above that in columbus.

I think that has more to do with the athletic department than anything else. With the revenue OSU's football program brings in, that's where 80+% of the focus is for the athletic department. They're not splurging on promotions for basketball or other sports because they don't have to in the same way that a lot of Big East schools do. The marketability is there but the marketing is not.

I actually think UConn's soccer program is kind of in a similar boat to OSU's basketball program. Both have a history of being at least decent, but they've just become sort of an afterthought as other sports have taken the limelight.

 

[freescooter]

Well, you are sort of correct, except you have to go back to 1984 and 85 to find back to back years without FBS football schools winning the NCAA championship. And since 1986, only Villanova, UConn in 1999, and maybe UNLV, I just don’t know, have won the NCAA championship without being a D1 football program too. And UConn began playing D1 in 1999 so is a bit of an asterisk. They also dominate the Final Fours. In some ways it is why Gonzaga and Villanova are such unicorns. Here is my guess on what this shows. It follows that these Schools have larger, better overall athletic programs, which show themselves in many ways which lead to success in basketball even if it isn’t their prime sport. Even for those where it is, Duke comes to mind, having a larger, more sophisticated athletic department is helpful over all. It follows Bob Knight’s advice to Jim Calhoun. Go to the University of Someplace. That’s where the resources are.

 

[Fishy]

Ohio State pulled in $280,000,000 in revenue last year. They play with Monopoly money and despite ridiculous claims to the contrary, they’re not neglecting their basketball programs.

They’re several orbits better than every single Big East job save one. If they want Miller, they will hire Miller. Or McDermott, Neptune, English, McDermott, whoever isn’t named Hurley.

 

[yungdowork]

Ohio State pulled in $280,000,000 in revenue last year. They play with Monopoly money and despite ridiculous claims to the contrary, they’re not neglecting their basketball programs.

They’re several orbits better than every single Big East job save one. If they want Miller, they will hire Miller. Or McDermott, Neptune, English, McDermott, whoever isn’t named Hurley.

I don't think anyone thinks they're neglecting basketball, just that they spend well over 5x as much on the football program. Their football program practically prints money (over 64 million just in ticket sales in 2022) while our football program barely made 6 million in revenue last year.

But for reference, in 2022, which is the most recent year I could find data for, OSU spent just over 12 million dollars on their basketball program while we spent 13.9 million dollars on men's basketball last year.

Whether that's sustainable is a whole different discussion though I guess.

 

[superjohn]

Fishy is clearly a huge Jerry Lucas fan.

 

[nycscooby]

Ohio State pulled in $280,000,000 in revenue last year. They play with Monopoly money and despite ridiculous claims to the contrary, they’re not neglecting their basketball programs.

They’re several orbits better than every single Big East job save one. If they want Miller, they will hire Miller. Or McDermott, Neptune, English, McDermott, whoever isn’t named Hurley.

He's damn right. I think wherever this ends up, paying for players is here to stay and as long as that is the case I'd rather be a head coach of any sport at an institution with money to buy me the talent I want than to worry about the resources.

 

[nycscooby]

I don't think anyone thinks they're neglecting basketball, just that they spend well over 5x as much on the football program. Their football program practically prints money (over 64 million just in ticket sales in 2022) while our football program barely made 6 million in revenue last year.

But for reference, in 2022, which is the most recent year I could find data for, OSU spent just over 12 million dollars on their basketball program while we spent 13.9 million dollars on men's basketball last year.

Whether that's sustainable is a whole different discussion though I guess.

I am trying to stay positive about where we will end up but the point here is that OSU can have far more than $12 million available to its basketball program, can Xavier?

 

[Jaydumo20]

Ohio State pulled in $280,000,000 in revenue last year. They play with Monopoly money and despite ridiculous claims to the contrary, they’re not neglecting their basketball programs.

They’re several orbits better than every single Big East job save one. If they want Miller, they will hire Miller. Or McDermott, Neptune, English, McDermott, whoever isn’t named Hurley.

It'd be almost better if they did neglect their program because even though it's not awful:
$$$$$$ + huge footprint + huge football school = 3 final Fours in 60 years and no titles.

Also, why couldn't they have Hurley if they gave him unlimited Monopoly money? What's keeping a top 5 coach in non- football storrs?

And why is this Ohio state job better than the Creighton job or Marquette job this year? If it's orbits better it'd be orbits better today as well. If your argument is more money as an end in and of itself then that is exactly the point I've been making.

 

[yungdowork]

I am trying to stay positive about where we will end up but the point here is that OSU can have far more than $12 million available to its basketball program, can Xavier?

Ohio State earned more revenue than any other school in college sports last year, so definitely they COULD spend whatever they want to, but they haven't really shown any commitment to doing that. In 2018-19, Georgetown, Marquette, Providence, and Villanova all spent more on men's basketball than they did.

They've been theoretically capable of outspending the entire Big East for many years, but they aren't doing that. Maybe NIL suddenly changes that, but you'd have to bet on them bucking the trend.