AD: If athletes are considered employees, Notre Dame will seek new model

[UConnTrumbull]

Read a tweet yesterday saying that the Northwestern president would abandon athletics if it came to this. Then I found this article with ND saying similar things. Not sure what to think of it. Probably nothing.

http://www.indystar.com/story/sport...tre-dame-will-seek-new-sports-model/27624809/

 

[Ha Who]

Nothing is correct. College athletics is morally bankrupt.

 

[Sky ball]

OK here is the easy answer? Maybe, as I do not know contract law etc. No sports scholarships are awarded. A full scholarship to XYZ University is worth $45,000. An athlete would sign a contract to play a sport for $45,000 much like a pro-athlete but the pay covering the cost of a scholarship. Lawyers..is that a way this could come out?

 

[whaler11]

I believe the term is 'bu!! posturing'.

 

[Sky ball]

I believe the term is 'bu!! posturing'.

Most likely

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

"If we're forced to pay the people we exploit to rake in billions of dollars, I swear I'll stop this multibillion dollar industry!"

Sure you will.

 

[UConnJim]

Some of the top private academic institutions could go in another direction, but most schools would not. It has happened before, so it could happen again. I doubt ND would go in another direction as their identity is tied to football.

By the way, a conference selected from a group of private schools like Georgetown, Duke, Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Wake Forest, Boston College, Notre Dame, Rice, Miami, Tulane, SMU, and Syracuse would have competitive sports and have a top academic reputation.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I don't think it is entirely posturing. I think there is a fundamental difference between a scholarship, even with the "full cost of attendance" money added, and saying the schools have essentially non-student employees who participate on their sports teams. I believe that there a lot of schools who would opt out of the latter. It's not just about money, which would likely be a wash either way, it's recognition that we wouldn't be fans. I would not watch a Connecticut based minor league of the NBA. Nobody in Alabama wants to watch a AAA football team of the Atlanta Falcons.

The reason we have a general dislike for "one and done" players at Kentucky and elsewhere is the feeling that they aren't students. That they are simply hired guns. If the NLRB ruling holds up, every player will be like that. The NCAA can't survive it. The money would dry up. It's the kiss of death to big time college athletics.

 

[nd73]

I don't think it's a bluff.
ND Football is a small percentage of our overall budget and we won't allow it to become this . Not worth it IMO.

 

[Seaa Blue]

I think if they were serious they would have seen this coming and NOT have gone ahead with the luxury option for the stadium remodel.

I know that a lot of it is academic space, but $400 million is a lot for academic space.

 

[djct1999]

I don't think it's a bluff.
ND Football is a small percentage of our overall budget and we won't allow it to become this . Not worth it IMO.

Well then, smell ya later!

 

[History Geek]

...By the way, a conference selected from a group of private schools like Georgetown, Duke, Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Wake Forest, Boston College, Notre Dame, Rice, Miami, Tulane, SMU, and Syracuse would have competitive sports and have a top academic reputation.

I've been thinking that this may happen. Like-minded institutions that may not want to play by the new rules.

 

[Kolumbo]

Some of the top private academic institutions could go in another direction, but most schools would not. It has happened before, so it could happen again. I doubt ND would go in another direction as their identity is tied to football.

By the way, a conference selected from a group of private schools like Georgetown, Duke, Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Wake Forest, Boston College, Notre Dame, Rice, Miami, Tulane, SMU, and Syracuse would have competitive sports and have a top academic reputation.

How about Stanford and L-ville. I honestly don't think Syracuse fits in.

 

[UConnJim]

How about Stanford and L-ville. I honestly don't think Syracuse fits in.

Louisville is a public school. Syracuse definitely fits the bill as they are a good private school like the rest on the list. Stanford is on the West Coast and doesn't really fit geographically.

 

[Kolumbo]

Louisville is a public school. Syracuse definitely fits the bill as they are a good private school like the rest on the list. Stanford is on the West Coast and doesn't really fit geographically.

L-ville is so far opposite that bunch I thought the joke was self-evident. Syracuse is good but the others on the list are exceptional. Stanford - geography? geography? Those schools stretch from Boston to Miami to Houston to Chicago. Surely geography is not a factor anymore, as we know.

 

[Kolumbo]

This is an interesting take on the "Public Ivies." Yes, go B1G.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Ivy

 

[John Greene]

Some of the top private academic institutions could go in another direction, but most schools would not. It has happened before, so it could happen again. I doubt ND would go in another direction as their identity is tied to football.

By the way, a conference selected from a group of private schools like Georgetown, Duke, Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Wake Forest, Boston College, Notre Dame, Rice, Miami, Tulane, SMU, and Syracuse would have competitive sports and have a top academic reputation.

Excellent point. In addition most of these, with the possible exceptions of Cuse and da U, have substantial endowments, and all have strong regional if not national brands in academics which gives them a lot of flexibility in attracting students without big-time FB. I'm sure a good number of them would conclude that they could continue to be successful in their primary business without high level FB. BU as a recent example has been doing just fine since it got out of the FB business. Even more broadly look back about 90 years and see who the national powers were in collegiate sports. You will see a lot of Ivies among them. In the 1960's they came to the conclusion that they wanted a different model. If I remember correctly ( I was in my mid teens) the split point finally came over the number of games, practice time per week and spring practice for football. If I remember correctly Cornell was the only one who at the time was a little hesitant. They went on their way and have done pretty well by most measures.

 

[Sportsman5]

Excellent point. In addition most of these, with the possible exceptions of Cuse and da U, have substantial endowments, and all have strong regional if not national brands in academics which gives them a lot of flexibility in attracting students without big-time FB. I'm sure a good number of them would conclude that they could continue to be successful in their primary business without high level FB. BU as a recent example has been doing just fine since it got out of the FB business. Even more broadly look back about 90 years and see who the national powers were in collegiate sports. You will see a lot of Ivies among them. In the 1960's they came to the conclusion that they wanted a different model. If I remember correctly ( I was in my mid teens) the split point finally came over the number of games, practice time per week and spring practice for football. If I remember correctly Cornell was the only one who at the time was a little hesitant. They went on their way and have done pretty well by most measures.

there's no question that some will drop out if things continue on this path. Even a stipend of $10,000 may cause some to drop out of the P5 because it would slightly go over the cost of attendance. However, many of these schools will probably not be programs with significant followings. If a school like Notre Dame, USC, Stanford or Miami dropped their program, then I would be surprised. If the stipend got up to 25,000 and it was clearly paying athletes $20,000+ per year above cost of attendance, then I can see a large number of significant athletic departments being dropped to a lower conference.

It will be interesting to see if that conference will be allowed to compete for national titles with the P5.

 

[John Greene]

there's no question that some will drop out if things continue on this path. Even a stipend of $10,000 may cause some to drop out of the P5 because it would slightly go over the cost of attendance. However, many of these schools will probably not be programs with significant followings. If a school like Notre Dame, USC, Stanford or Miami dropped their program, then I would be surprised. If the stipend got up to 25,000 and it was clearly paying athletes $20,000+ per year above cost of attendance, then I can see a large number of significant athletic departments being dropped to a lower conference.

It will be interesting to see if that conference will be allowed to compete for national titles with the P5.

Agree completely regarding ND & USC, it would be a very tough decision, not so sure about Stanford & Miami. Stanford's last big move on athletic facilities was to reduce the capacity of their stadium which they still struggle to fill. Their success in FB has been fairly recent and who knows how long it will last. In the case of Miami, they have struggled to win for several years and seeing the crowd for most home games in a big NFL stadium is embarrassing to some. The consensus of the 9 Miami alums I know has been for some time now that if it does not turn soon they should just move on.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Before the Big Ten or PAC would break apart I could see the two conferences partnering up -- with their own networks in tow -- and dropping to a lesser level of compensation.

Only Ohio State would likely have serious issues with that.

UConn and Colorado State to the Big Ten. BYU and Notre Dame (to spite the Big Ten) to the PAC. Coast-to-Coast network. Let the SEC play semi-pro ball.

 

[Sportsman5]

Agree completely regarding ND & USC, it would be a very tough decision, not so sure about Stanford & Miami. Stanford's last big move on athletic facilities was to reduce the capacity of their stadium which they still struggle to fill. Their success in FB has been fairly recent and who knows how long it will last. In the case of Miami, they have struggled to win for several years and seeing the crowd for most home games in a big NFL stadium is embarrassing to some. The consensus of the 9 Miami alums I know has been for some time now that if it does not turn soon they should just move on.

I think that if the stipend goes over cost of attendance, then Stanford will drop down from the P5. Maybe Miami would too. I don't believe Notre Dame or USC would until the stipend goes 5,000+ over the cost of attendance.

 

[nd73]

Stipends we have no concern about , it's the union/employee issue we won't deal with.

 

[Thirdelement]

I believe nd73 is correct. It is not a matter of expense. If players become employees, with compensation, a union etc, ND will not participate. While I don't have any particular read on USC, they were one of the 8 private schools to formally support Northwestern's appeal of the National Labor Relations Board's decision.

 

[NickyNewark]

Nothing is correct. College athletics is morally bankrupt.

Yeah your right...and not only that but they lost their morals too!! lol...Reminds me of my 3rd grade teacher saying...students...it is now "precipitating" out and a silly kid said.. "Yeah Miss Knox and its raining too!!" lol

 

[freescooter]

Agree completely regarding ND & USC, it would be a very tough decision, not so sure about Stanford & Miami. Stanford's last big move on athletic facilities was to reduce the capacity of their stadium which they still struggle to fill. Their success in FB has been fairly recent and who knows how long it will last. In the case of Miami, they have struggled to win for several years and seeing the crowd for most home games in a big NFL stadium is embarrassing to some. The consensus of the 9 Miami alums I know has been for some time now that if it does not turn soon they should just move on.

Here's the thing with Miami. This is what Donna Shalala wanted when she took them to the ACC. A program with less national relevance and ideally fewer problems. It was about money but also about getting the program under control. Now they have been less successful on the field than I think she expected but overall this was where they wanted to be.