Wiggins Trashes WNBA Culture

[CocoHusky]

To put this in other terms, is it hard to believe individual reports of African Americans experiencing something so far outside of the norm during a routine traffic stop?

No. If African Americans (note this is plural) as a group are experiencing something that can no longer be consider "outside the the norm". If pretty women were experiencing bullying in the WNBA of the kind Candice is reporting that would also not be outside the norm. In fact, if one other WNBA player reported this bullying, I would come closer to accepting it as the norm. Candice experience is well outside the norm because the WNBA has been in existence for 20 years now.

 

[FanHam]

Who cares? People whose enthusiasm for the WNBA is influenced by players' proclivities off court are w-a-a-a-y-y out of line. All anyone should care about is the quality of the league's basketball product. I think the quality of basketball improves every year in the WNBA, at least it does to my eye.

 

[oldude]

People are struggling to know what to make of Wiggins' charges of bullying and abuse. It appears that the WNBA specifically, and WBB in general were completely blindsided by the charges.

While there is a general measure of sensitivity to Wiggins charges, not a single current or former player has come forward with a similar tale of bullying and abuse. What's more, Wiggins has not produced a single email, text or VM supporting her claim (as Jonathan Martin did), or any evidence of a contemporaneous formal or informal complaint.

Finally, some of her claims that 98% of WNBA players are gay, and she was signaled out because she was feminine, are themselves impossible to validate and appear designed to fuel controversy rather than comprehension.

Bullying and abuse are serious charges that require a thorough investigation by the WNBA, but absent supporting evidence of some kind, I am not at all comfortable with Candace Wiggins comments on this matter.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Well the anointed one was gifted a slam dunk title at the McDonald's AA game and a WNBA MVP her rookie year (wasn't even the best player on her team, that was still clearly Lisa Leslie at that point) that she didn't deserve, so it's hard to feel too bad for her.

With all due respect, nwhoopfan, I have to disagree...

Lisa Leslie (2008): 15.1 ppg, 8.9 rpg, 2.4 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1.5 spg, 46.3 percent from the floor, 23.5 percent from three, 66.1 percent from the line

Candace Parker (2008): 18.5 ppg, 9.5 rpg, 3.4 apg, 2.2 bpg, 1.2 spg, 52.3 percent from the floor, 42.3 percent from three, 72.3 percent from the line

In 2008, Parker led the entire league in double-doubles with 17, as well as leading led the WNBA in rebounding. She was fourth in the WNBA in scoring, second in blocks (behind Leslie), and 15th in the WNBA in assists.
for the 2008 season.

 

[HuskyNan]

So basically we have this:

Mistie Bass, Imani Boyette, Monique Currie, Rebecca Lobo, DeLisha Milton-Jones, Ticha Penicheiro, and every other heterosexual current or former player who has spoken on the topic: "I have never experienced or witnessed anything like what she's describing."

Candice Wiggins, in response: "Of course you haven't! That's because I'm prettier and more feminine and more popular than all of you!"

"Don't hate me because I'm beautiful"

I wonder if Swin or Sue got beat up in the W.

 

[Lobo50Fan]

First thing I thought of...

 

[Plebe]

Amid backlash, Wiggins stands by controversial WNBA comments

After refusing to speak with ESPNW, Candice doubles down on her allegations in further remarks to the Union-Tribune. She also says the abuse was not just from from fellow players but also from coaches and "leaders" of the league:

There is no data on the number of gay women in the WNBA, and some commentaries about the story questioned Wiggins’ “98 percent” number. She said Tuesday that she used that figure more to be illustrative than factual.

“It was my way to illustrate the isolation that I felt personally,” Wiggins said. “I felt like the 2 percent versus the 98 percent. It felt that way to me. And it’s not just the players. It was the coaches. It was the leaders.”​

I also recommend that people watch the video of Candice commenting. It's, uh, interesting.

 

[Lobo50Fan]

Tara VanDerveer Defends WNBA from Candice

"Referring to Wiggins’ contention that 98 percent of WNBA players are gay, she said, “I don’t know that math was ever Candice’s strength. That to me sounds homophobic and negative.”"

Wow...yeah. I know she did clarify that saying it was more to illustrate her point rather than an actual stat, but wow.

 

[DaddyChoc]

PS. I am still bitter that she won the Wade Trophy over Parker. laughable

this should have been a disclaimer instead of a PS for your previous post

 

[DaddyChoc]

So basically we have this:

Mistie Bass, Imani Boyette, Monique Currie, Rebecca Lobo, DeLisha Milton-Jones, Ticha Penicheiro, and every other heterosexual current or former player who has spoken on the topic: "I have never experienced or witnessed anything like what she's describing."

Candice Wiggins, in response: "Of course you haven't! That's because I'm prettier and more feminine and more popular than all of you!"

hahaha she kinda got a point but... beauty is in the eye of the beholder

 

[DaddyChoc]

I don't think it's far-fetched for Candice to be the target of jealousy, but I don't think it was strictly directed at her femininity or heterosexuality, but rather a byproduct of it. I believe her femininity and physical beauty, in combination with her incredible talent, contributed to her mainstream appeal and collegiate clout. It’s likely the jealousy or feelings about her were more the result of her personality and the clout surrounding her, which her femininity/ appearance and heterosexuality contributed to. To me, it’s completely plausible to believe there’s jealousy based on popularity and appearance, especially when those two things are present in combination with super talent.

In the end, it’s great to hear other perspectives, but people are not created equal, so their experiences are disparate. Hearing DeLisa’s, Imani’s, and Lyashia’s experience do not tell me that Candice’s was not real, because they are not Candice. They were never surrounded in the same fame, do not look like her, play like her, or have the same personality as her. This doesn’t mean their three experiences aren’t real. I believe their stories refuting her, but I also believe Candice had a different experience.

Also note that Imani Boyette confirms Candice's sentiment about female athletes feeling like they have to be like their male counterparts. Imani says she doesn't want the press to ask her about her plans to have kids or her family because the press doesn't ask male athletes about that. In other words, Imani wants to be treated like the male NBA players. To me, Candice is saying she doesn't have to act like or be treated like "a man" to be a pro basketball player. I think her words were just badly misconstrued. She's an impressive player, and I don't think sharing her experience should discount her legacy.

well said

 

[nwhoopfan]

With all due respect, nwhoopfan, I have to disagree...

Lisa Leslie (2008): 15.1 ppg, 8.9 rpg, 2.4 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1.5 spg, 46.3 percent from the floor, 23.5 percent from three, 66.1 percent from the line

Candace Parker (2008): 18.5 ppg, 9.5 rpg, 3.4 apg, 2.2 bpg, 1.2 spg, 52.3 percent from the floor, 42.3 percent from three, 72.3 percent from the line

In 2008, Parker led the entire league in double-doubles with 17, as well as leading led the WNBA in rebounding. She was fourth in the WNBA in scoring, second in blocks (behind Leslie), and 15th in the WNBA in assists.
for the 2008 season.

That's weird, apparently I've had their stats transposed in my mind for almost a decade. I thought it was strange the MVP went to a player averaging 15/8, and now I see that wasn't the case. My mistake. It was still really surprising that a rookie won it, but she was more deserving than I realized. Thank you for correcting my misperception.

 

[psconn]

Amid backlash, Wiggins stands by controversial WNBA comments

After refusing to speak with ESPNW, Candice doubles down on her allegations in further remarks to the Union-Tribune. She also says the abuse was not just from from fellow players but also from coaches and "leaders" of the league:

There is no data on the number of gay women in the WNBA, and some commentaries about the story questioned Wiggins’ “98 percent” number. She said Tuesday that she used that figure more to be illustrative than factual.

“It was my way to illustrate the isolation that I felt personally,” Wiggins said. “I felt like the 2 percent versus the 98 percent. It felt that way to me. And it’s not just the players. It was the coaches. It was the leaders.”​

I also recommend that people watch the video of Candice commenting. It's, uh, interesting.

Holy Crap! That's what a Stanford education sounds like?!? Kinda cringe-worthy, right?
Never liked Wiggins. Always seemed kind of self-absorbed in a Skyler Diggins kind of way... FWIW, Skyler would be a good one to ask about this... she also is convinced that she is very pretty and puts it out there very overtly in ads and appearances. If Skyler is hetero, she might be a good test case for Wiggins' assertions.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Holy Crap! That's what a Stanford education sounds like?!? Kinda cringe-worthy, right?
Never liked Wiggins. Always seemed kind of self-absorbed in a Skyler Diggins kind of way... FWIW, Skyler would be a good one to ask about this... she also is convinced that she is very pretty and puts it out there very overtly in ads and appearances. If Skyler is hetero, she might be a good test case for Wiggins' assertions.

Diggins is in her prime of getting money, you think she's gonna take sides on a issue like this... aint happen'

 

[eebmg]

Pretty clear (to me at last) that she falls under the category of people who believe that any tough times they have must be the result of a conspiracy which is what bullying is.

This is pretty common. I know of multiple people in my workplace who I would characterize like this. The sad part is that they are totally convinced of it.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Pretty clear (to me at last) that she falls under the category of people who believe that any tough times they have must be the result of a conspiracy which is what bullying is.

This is pretty common. I know of multiple people in my workplace who I would characterize like this. The sad part is that they are totally convinced of it.

and this is why they stay bullied sometimes because if they do speak out there's backlash... "she's just trying to sell a book". Some other former WNBA players are saying "I wish a b**** would try to bully me" or "fight their as**s if they're bullying you".

So if you're not a fighting... and you speak up in a safe place you still get bullied. All because the audience have their own brash response to bullying. And if you're one of the people she's talking about of course it seems that it doesn't happen.

 

[JudgeSCR]

Ms. Wiggin's claims of bullying are serious and should be taken very seriously. However, I think it is fair for people to express some concern and skepticism about aspects of what Ms. Wiggins has said.

She made sweeping allegations without any specifics. Some of the statements she made are false ('98% of women in the WNBA are gay') and others are almost assuredly exaggerations ('people tried to hurt me every day'). I don't doubt that she felt out of place and uncomfortable on her teams. I also don't necessarily doubt that she experienced harsh treatment by some players who didn't like her. But it is concerning when a person alleges that large groups of unnamed people assaulted and bullied her on a regular basis and yet gives no supporting details or examples of the bullying that she faced. She could give multiple examples of specific behaviors without naming names. She could talk specifically about how coaches acknowledged, ignored and/or supported this behavior without naming them. She could tell about specific things that were said to her or ways in which she was treated differently.

I don't doubt that Ms. Wiggins perceives that this happened to her because she believes that she is pretty and popular and others are jealous of her. As people are want to say "that is Ms. Wiggins' reality." However when she talks to reporters (which is her right) she is asking for it to become part of our reality. Many of us would be happy to champion someone who stands up to bullying if they speak of their experience with sober non-exaggerated statements. She, of course, doesn't have to do that. But when you make dramatic and exaggerated allegations without putting any "meat on the bones" then some (many, most) people will hesitate to sign on to those statements and ask questions.

 

[meyers7]

"Don't hate me because I'm beautiful"

I wonder if Swin or Sue got beat up in the W.

Well that's not really a good example. They are from UCONN. Who's gonna try to beat up or bully someone from UCONN??

UCONN is the one who knocks.

 

[wbbfan]

Tara didn't hold back in her comments...

 

[Orangutan]

The WNBA (finally) responds - WNBA president: Stunned by Wiggins remarks

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Ms. Wiggin's claims of bullying are serious and should be taken very seriously. However, I think it is fair for people to express some concern and skepticism about aspects of what Ms. Wiggins has said.

She made sweeping allegations without any specifics. Some of the statements she made are false ('98% of women in the WNBA are gay') and others are almost assuredly exaggerations ('people tried to hurt me every day'). I don't doubt that she felt out of place and uncomfortable on her teams. I also don't necessarily doubt that she experienced harsh treatment by some players who didn't like her. But it is concerning when a person alleges that large groups of unnamed people assaulted and bullied her on a regular basis and yet gives no supporting details or examples of the bullying that she faced. She could give multiple examples of specific behaviors without naming names. She could talk specifically about how coaches acknowledged, ignored and/or supported this behavior without naming them. She could tell about specific things that were said to her or ways in which she was treated differently.

I don't doubt that Ms. Wiggins perceives that this happened to her because she believes that she is pretty and popular and others are jealous of her. As people are want to say "that is Ms. Wiggins' reality." However when she talks to reporters (which is her right) she is asking for it to become part of our reality. Many of us would be happy to champion someone who stands up to bullying if they speak of their experience with sober non-exaggerated statements. She, of course, doesn't have to do that. But when you make dramatic and exaggerated allegations without putting any "meat on the bones" then some (many, most) people will hesitate to sign on to those statements and ask questions.

Very good post Judge. Plainly she hopes you will buy her book expecting to find it all in there. This is just cynical, self-aggrandizing BS from Ms. Wiggins.

 

[xHunt3r]

Ms. Wiggin's claims of bullying are serious and should be taken very seriously. However, I think it is fair for people to express some concern and skepticism about aspects of what Ms. Wiggins has said.

She made sweeping allegations without any specifics. Some of the statements she made are false ('98% of women in the WNBA are gay') and others are almost assuredly exaggerations ('people tried to hurt me every day'). I don't doubt that she felt out of place and uncomfortable on her teams. I also don't necessarily doubt that she experienced harsh treatment by some players who didn't like her. But it is concerning when a person alleges that large groups of unnamed people assaulted and bullied her on a regular basis and yet gives no supporting details or examples of the bullying that she faced. She could give multiple examples of specific behaviors without naming names. She could talk specifically about how coaches acknowledged, ignored and/or supported this behavior without naming them. She could tell about specific things that were said to her or ways in which she was treated differently.

I don't doubt that Ms. Wiggins perceives that this happened to her because she believes that she is pretty and popular and others are jealous of her. As people are want to say "that is Ms. Wiggins' reality." However when she talks to reporters (which is her right) she is asking for it to become part of our reality. Many of us would be happy to champion someone who stands up to bullying if they speak of their experience with sober non-exaggerated statements. She, of course, doesn't have to do that. But when you make dramatic and exaggerated allegations without putting any "meat on the bones" then some (many, most) people will hesitate to sign on to those statements and ask questions.

She has supposedly kept journals, so she has the details, but... she is in the process of writing a book... so she is not going to give any details away now. You'll have to buy the book.

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

Please help me.
Is it three straight WNBA players?
Or is it Wiggins and 2 straight WNBA players?

It would be three this season and two besides her last season.

 

[j66kicker]

Stewie speaks out

www.espn.com/video/clip?id=18752317

 

[noirwestern]

Add another voice of dissent to the list: http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2017...about-the-wnba-says-about-her-and-the-league/