Westbrook Waiver Appeal Denied

[Charliebball]

this certainly doesn't make the Tennessee athletic department look good....................if I were a big time recruit I'd have to think twice if I wanted to go to a school that would not support my transfer if that situation were to arise..............as far as I know Geno never stands in the way of a player leaving and supports the transfer process on the player's behalf regardless of the circumstances

 

[futuretitles]

this certainly doesn't make the Tennessee athletic department look good....................if I were a big time recruit I'd have to think twice if I wanted to go to a school that would not support my transfer if that situation were to arise..............as far as I know Geno never stands in the way of a player leaving and supports the transfer process on the player's behalf regardless of the circumstances

Scenarios are different.... Player called for the coaches firing, did not get along with some teammates, stuck around and strung the coaches and team along before being forced to make a decision , and transferred to their rival who has demonized and insulted the UT athletic program since the 2000’s. She mentioned wanting to be coached up and have a new start. Sitting out is not new I’m not sure WHY this is such a shock. What’s TN gonna do support someone who used them as a puppet just to jump ship to a rival and then want them to speak out and say they have a toxic environment? Makes no sense. I wish student athletes the best but karma came back around.

 

[UConnCat]

Mike DiMauro suggested she tell her story. I hope she does.

 

[CL82]

Wow what utter hogwash. Down with the NCAA. They decide to apply their rules differently from year to year.

Can Notre Dame please hand the Jess Shepherd championship? No way they win without Jess Shepherd.

Also Miss State should hand back their record from last year. No way they perform as good as they did last year without AEH. Also Geno fully supported the AEH transfer and immediate eligibility even though rumors were couldn't follow UCONN "rules". If any whiff comes out that Tenn did something to get in the way of Evina's immediate eligibility then Geno should immediately cancel the series with Tenn.

It already did. UConn will not cancel the series. But if I’m Geno or the A.D., I certainly would consider it a factor in deciding whether to extend it.

 

[CL82]

You want her to sue because she is being forced to follow the rules she agreed to follow when she accepted an athletic scholarship?

Well, I suspect he is suggesting that she sue because the decision is appears to be arbitrary and capricious. Similarly situated individuals applying for relief under the same rule should receive similar results. The NCAA is all over the map on these decisions.

Note that I’m not advocating that she litigate, I’m just noting that the posters comment isn’t completely off-base.

 

[j66kicker]

I don't think Geno should be dropping innuendos if he's not ever allowed to tell the story. That's like Pat Summitt's "Geno knows what he did" business that ended the UConn-Tennessee rivalry a decade ago. In these situations when you're at a dead end, it's best to just take the high road because there is zero to gain by doing otherwise.

Well - too late now!

“Think about this: A kid’s in an environment that’s not necessarily healthy, an environment that, if you knew what the environment was, which I can’t say, you would not want your kid in that environment,” he said. “And the athletic director there knows it..."

Will make for an interesting build-up to the Jan 23 game anyway. I wonder if ESPN will grab onto this, or try to downplay the "unhealthy environment thing...?

 

[CL82]

Scenarios are different.... Player called for the coaches firing, did not get along with some teammates, stuck around and strung the coaches and team along before being forced to make a decision , and transferred to their rival who has demonized and insulted the UT athletic program since the 2000’s. She mentioned wanting to be coached up and have a new start. Sitting out is not new I’m not sure WHY this is such a shock. What’s TN gonna do support someone who used them as a puppet just to jump ship to a rival and then want them to speak out and say they have a toxic environment? Makes no sense. I wish student athletes the best but karma came back around.

So you are advocating punishing Evina because you don’t like UConn? And you for the suggesting that and academic institution should punish a player for her talking about the conditions that exist while she played at the institution?

Interesting take.

 

[CL82]

Well - too late now!

“Think about this: A kid’s in an environment that’s not necessarily healthy, an environment that, if you knew what the environment was, which I can’t say, you would not want your kid in that environment,” he said. “And the athletic director there knows it..."

Will make for an interesting build-up to the Jan 23 game anyway. I wonder if ESPN will grab onto this, or try to downplay the "unhealthy environment thing...?

Geno is pretty thick skinned, but he has a long memory when it comes to institutional nastiness against one of his players. Fulmer made a mistake here, but it is entirely consistent with what we have seen from Tennessee in the past.

 

[Justavisitor]

this certainly doesn't make the Tennessee athletic department look good....................if I were a big time recruit I'd have to think twice if I wanted to go to a school that would not support my transfer if that situation were to arise..............as far as I know Geno never stands in the way of a player leaving and supports the transfer process on the player's behalf regardless of the circumstances

TN didn't stand in the way and left it open for Evina to transfer to any school she chose. This is unlike UNC where Hatchell, after the transfer of Deshields, blocked certain players from transferring to Tennessee. She allowed them to transfer under certain conditions...not TN, who was on the list of exclusions.

What TN did do was say good luck, where ever you go, but we are not spending any more time and energy on you. Instead, their focus is on the athletes that are currently on a TN scholarship. Not sure about the rest of you, but when I leave one place for another, such as an employer, I'm not looking back and expecting their help with me and my future endeavors other than being a reference about me and my abilities. The ties are severed and I've moved on. That employer has their hands full with the employees that remain there.


Last, the NCAA should not be looking for the former universities to step in and help. Do your job with the information submitted by the athlete and their new university. Stop playing favorites and having so much inconsistency when making the decision. Give specific guidelines that allow for playing right away and stick to it.

 

[CL82]

TN didn't stand in the way and left it open for Evina to transfer to any school she chose. This is unlike UNC where Hatchell, after the transfer of Deshields, blocked certain players from transferring to Tennessee. She allowed them to transfer under certain conditions...not TN, who was on the list of exclusions.

What TN did do was say good luck, where ever you go, but we are not spending any more time and energy on you. Instead, their focus is on the athletes that are currently on a TN scholarship. Not sure about the rest of you, but when I leave one place for another, such as an employer, I'm not looking back and expecting their help with me and my future endeavors other than being a reference about me and my abilities. The ties are severed and I've moved on. That employer has their hands full with the employees that remain there.


Last, the NCAA should not be looking for the former universities to step in and help. Do your job with the information submitted by the athlete and their new university. Stop playing favorites and having so much inconsistency when making the decision. Give specific guidelines that allow for playing right away and stick to it.

What Tennessee did was say that it doesn't oppose Evina playing right away. What Tennessee didn't do is say that it supported her playing right away. It's petty and small minded. I certainly hope the HS WBB community takes notice of it.

 

[meyers7]

What TN did do was say good luck, where ever you go, but we are not spending any more time and energy on you.

And that's where UCONN is better than TN. UCONN will help players who transfer out.

 

[Plebe]

Mike DiMauro suggested she tell her story. I hope she does.

Unless Westbrook goes public, NCAA can hide in privacy

Here is what I've learned: Public shaming is the only way to shame the shameless. And in the batting order of shamelessness, the NCAA hits cleanup. Hence, unless specifics surface about the NCAA's all...

www.theday.com

 

[Argonaut]

Unless Westbrook goes public, NCAA can hide in privacy

Here is what I've learned: Public shaming is the only way to shame the shameless. And in the batting order of shamelessness, the NCAA hits cleanup. Hence, unless specifics surface about the NCAA's all...

www.theday.com

This is the route that Oregon took with Prince's waiver, but they didn't wait until a decision came down to spill the beans.

There is fixin' to be a lot of bad blood. Which, all history considered, is saying something.

 

[Justavisitor]

What Tennessee did was say that it doesn't oppose Evina playing right away. What Tennessee didn't do is say that it supported her playing right away. It's petty and small minded. I certainly hope the HS WBB community takes notice of it.

I don't think that was what was asked. In an appeal, you must add more details (facts) that were not previously provided. Another very important detail about the facts is that you are assuming Phil Fulmer has some detailed knowledge. All he has is what the previous staff and Westbrook may have provided. This starts to get into a my word vs. your word situation. This gets even more complicated, because the entire previous staff has departed, along with the player, so it's not like there's someone still around that can clear things up or provide insight on last season. It's quite possible that Phil wants to wash his hands of the entire thing. The staff is gone. The disgruntled players are gone. He's moved on.

Meantime, it probably doesn't make any difference. Mikayla Coombs also wasn't waived. MiMi Collins is sitting out too.

Keep in mind, the AD doesn't know all that is or isn't happening on a day to day basis within the teams.

It's also highly possible that Fulmer is not in agreement with all that was said in the waiver documentation. Perhaps saying nothing was better than saying any thing at all. If he didn't agree, should he have come out and made her situation worse?

My point is that we don't know the specifics.

 

[pvdoggy]

Unless Westbrook goes public, NCAA can hide in privacy

Here is what I've learned: Public shaming is the only way to shame the shameless. And in the batting order of shamelessness, the NCAA hits cleanup. Hence, unless specifics surface about the NCAA's all...

www.theday.com

I don't think Uconn will let Evina do this, too much distraction that won't change anything at this point.

 

[oldude]

Then why did Coombs have her waiver denied at Georgia? I'll wait for the answer...

Mikayla was well liked by the UConn coaches and players, but it was absolutely clear that she was not going to be getting major PT so long as she remained at UConn. So Mikayla was a plain, old-fashion, every day transfer in search of PT, subject to the whims of the NCAA, which seems to have a highly arbitrary track record on such requests. It’s possible that Mikayla might also have some hardship element to her waiver request since she was moving close to home. In either case, I am certain that UConn would have fully supported the waiver request.

 

[Argonaut]

Meantime, it probably doesn't make any difference. Mikayla Coombs also wasn't waived. MiMi Collins is sitting out too.

Then why did Coombs have her waiver denied at Georgia? I'll wait for the answer...

It doesn't appear that Maryland even applied for a waiver for Collins, so that's a moot point.

UConn fully supported Coombs' waiver and we'll see what happens on the appeal. When every party is fully supportive, then all of the ire can be focused on the NCAA.

From everything that's been gathered, Coombs' waiver seemed to come down to playing time and Evina's came down to environment. There has been nothing to suggest that there was something happening at UConn that was detrimental to Coombs' well-being that prompted the transfer. Geno supported it, just like he supported AEH's and Gordon's. AEH got the waiver.

If there were things happening at Tennessee that were detrimental to Evina's well-being, she has the right to go elsewhere without being punished. Whether that's UConn, Notre Dame, or back home to Salem to be the queen of D3 at Willamette.

There aren't black and white rules (at least ones that are being followed), and it isn't fair that the NCAA is playing God with these kids' careers.

 

[Hope]

Geno is right. All student-athlete waivers should either be approved or disapproved. When you have a selective, unaccountable Kommittee—with all their inherent biases and prejudices—deciding who can/cannot play, arriving at a "fair" result is impossible.

 

[CL82]

I don't think that was what was asked. In an appeal, you must add more details (facts) that were not previously provided. Another very important detail about the facts is that you are assuming Phil Fulmer has some detailed knowledge. All he has is what the previous staff and Westbrook may have provided. This starts to get into a my word vs. your word situation. This gets even more complicated, because the entire previous staff has departed, along with the player, so it's not like there's someone still around that can clear things up or provide insight on last season. It's quite possible that Phil wants to wash his hands of the entire thing. The staff is gone. The disgruntled players are gone. He's moved on.

Meantime, it probably doesn't make any difference. Mikayla Coombs also wasn't waived. MiMi Collins is sitting out too.

Keep in mind, the AD doesn't know all that is or isn't happening on a day to day basis within the teams.

It's also highly possible that Fulmer is not in agreement with all that was said in the waiver documentation. Perhaps saying nothing was better than saying any thing at all. If he didn't agree, should he have come out and made her situation worse?

My point is that we don't know the specifics.

No we don't, but we do know the public comments of those who do, including Auriemma's. He's not happy about how Tennessee is handling this. On the other hand, Tennessee's comments are, essentially, "she's dead to us." Put those two things together and you can start drawing inferences as to what happened in Evina's matter.

 

[meyers7]

Then why did Coombs have her waiver denied at Georgia? I'll wait for the answer...

No idea, but it wasn't because UCONN didn't support it.

 

[EricLA]

Then why did Coombs have her waiver denied at Georgia? I'll wait for the answer...

Why does this continue to get brought up? Geno wasn't fired, Holly was. Mikayla's mom didn't get into it with crazed UCONN fans on social media, Evina's mom did. I have no idea if UCONN approached the appeal along the lines of "abuse" of some kind, but there was more to the waiver request then just "the coach was fired".

Regardless, the 2 situations aren't remotely related.

 

[southofnorth]

The rules she agreed to do not mention that if one person gets a waiver everyone gets a waiver. Sorry I feel bad for Westbrook, but there's nothing she can do here.

I think that was the point. The "rules" are applied unfairly so some players get to bypass the rules without a good reason given (wasn't there just an Ohio State player that was granted immediate eligibility without much reason?) and others are forced to follow the transfer rules, again, without much reason. There could be a case based on the whole Jess Shepard and anyone else that got immediate eligibility without a cause that is outlined by the NCAA while others have to sit out. Basically saying that the NCAA discriminates against players or schools.

 

[mtsuraider06]

No idea, but it wasn't because UCONN didn't support it.

And Evina wasn't denied because Tennessee didn't support her transfer. They approved it. Didn't block it. Didn't stand in her way of leaving, and they could have because of the two upcoming games. Your own AD confirmed that Tennessee was very gracious in what they submitted to the NCAA.

They aren't, however, going to bend over backwards to help her get a waiver. It's not their job to do that. Just like UConn isn't bending over trying to get Coombs waiver granted. It's not their job. Once a player leaves, they aren't the former schools problem anymore.

 

[dogged1]

Hi Everyone, been out for awhile, nice to be back. Here's my post on the NCAA/Westbrook from awhile ago;

CocoHusky said:
Q: Do we even know if she would be eligible next season?
A: We do not know.

Q: If not, when will we find out?
A: Here are next steps and rough timeline.
1) Evina has to be accepted by UCONN and put on scholarship. Any day now.
2) Evina will be enrolled in one or both of the Summer sessions at UCONN. (June 3 - August 16, 2019)
3) UCONN submits request for immediate eligibility on day one of Evina's enrollment-June 3rd, 2019
4) Revisions, rewrites, tweaking of the waiver request. (June- September 2019)
5) NCAA will make a final decision ~ October, 2019 based on the Jessica Shepard timeline.

Apologies CocoHusky, I can't resist this:

5) NCAA staff member reviewing transfer waiver for student-athlete E. W. calls M.E. for guidance on waiver decision:
Staffer: I have a request fro waiver for E.W., her coach got fired and she wants another school now.
M.E.: Is she going to ND or UNC?
Staffer: Unnnh, no.
M.E.: Well that makes it tougher, but possible. It depends on the circumstances. What school does she want?
Staffer: Unnnh, you know, that one you used to work for before they pushed you out for incompetence, UConn.
M.E.: WT*! Unprintable, unprintable, NEVER! You call me about a UConn waiver again, you'll be looking for a job.
Staffer: Yes sir. Waiver denied.

If we are lucky enough that Westbrook decides to come here, and a waiver is granted, I will publicly apologize to the NCAA here on the boneyard.

Last edited: Apr 24, 2019
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I guess that apology to the NCAA and M. E. won't be necessary, I only wish it was.

 

[mtsuraider06]

Why does this continue to get brought up? Geno wasn't fired, Holly was. Mikayla's mom didn't get into it with crazed UCONN fans on social media, Evina's mom did. I have no idea if UCONN approached the appeal along the lines of "abuse" of some kind, but there was more to the waiver request then just "the coach was fired".

Regardless, the 2 situations aren't remotely related.

They are similar in that one player transfers to Geno and he wants her to play now, but is denied so he yells and screams to anyone that will listen to try and get her approved, yet while one transferred away from Geno, gets denied, and he is absolutely silent about it.