The real Power 6

[Dream Jobbed 2.0]

Even when we stunk we always seemed to make at least the semis in the AACT

 

[Mike9904111]

Right. Villanova is the only other serious program. They deserve credit. Yet they are less well known than Gonzaga.

I respectfully disagree about your take on the Big East and Villanova. Nova has THREE titles. Zags have competed for one. Villanova is very well known.

Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, and Syracuse 100% cannot be replaced. I'm not even putting Boston College into the conversation for this.

So me being a realist AND optimist I say this.

UConn = UConn
St. Johns = St. Johns
Seton Hall = Seton Hall
Providence = Providence
Depaul = Depaul
Marquette = Marquette
Georgetown = Georgetown
Villanova = Villanova

Those eight programs are now all back together in the Big East with us rejoining.

Now to the teams we've upgraded from.

Xavier > Cincy. (Especially this last decade + We'll see how they end up after Mack but I expect them to be fine).
Creighton > Rutgers. (Not even a discussion).
Butler > South Florida (Again, not even a discussion).

So while we don't have 5-6 title contending programs every season, we will have 2-3. We will also have an additional 2-3 that are capable of making good runs in the NCAA Tournament.

The Big East's worst team last season was Depaul who was .500 overall. (Georgetown was 15-17 but they would have been better without the issues).

Depaul was 16-16 but 15 of those losses came in the Big East.
Georgetown even with the issues was 15-17 with 13 losses come in the Big East.
St. Johns was 17-15 with 13 losses coming in the Big East.
Xavier was 19-13 with 10 losses coming in the Big East.
Marquette was 18-12 with 10 losses coming in the Big East.

So the bottom half of the conference took care of business OOC. Suffering no more than 1-4 losses OOC and doing what they needed to do to prop up the top half.

I know things change season to season, but the programs in the "NBE" as people like to call it, are all stepping up and getting better. There is also the potential of adding a 12th program. Which I am sure will also be quality or have the potential to be quality.

So while I personally wish none of this realignment crap had ever happened, it's not all doom and gloom. I am perfectly happy exactly where we are now. I would love to play Syracuse, Pitt, Notre Dame, and Louisville OOC when we can (Syracuse and Pitt every season if possible), but outside of that, this is a very good conference that will compete at the highest level every single season.

We will get 4-6 teams in the NCAA Tournament every year and that number could very easily be 7 some seasons.

 

[coloradohusky]

What do testicles have to do with anything I said?

 

[Hoophound]

Why do we have to play dumb? We didn’t suck in the AAC for any reason other than bad coaching. It was quite obvious the second Dan Hurley walked through the door that we were competitive again.

 

[SubbaBub]

I respectfully disagree about your take on the Big East and Villanova. Nova has THREE titles. Zags have competed for one. Villanova is very well known.

Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, and Syracuse 100% cannot be replaced. I'm not even putting Boston College into the conversation for this.

So me being a realist AND optimist I say this.

UConn = UConn
St. Johns = St. Johns
Seton Hall = Seton Hall
Providence = Providence
Depaul = Depaul
Marquette = Marquette
Georgetown = Georgetown
Villanova = Villanova

Those eight programs are now all back together in the Big East with us rejoining.

Now to the teams we've upgraded from.

Xavier > Cincy. (Especially this last decade + We'll see how they end up after Mack but I expect them to be fine).
Creighton > Rutgers. (Not even a discussion).
Butler > South Florida (Again, not even a discussion).

So while we don't have 5-6 title contending programs every season, we will have 2-3. We will also have an additional 2-3 that are capable of making good runs in the NCAA Tournament.

The Big East's worst team last season was Depaul who was .500 overall. (Georgetown was 15-17 but they would have been better without the issues).

Depaul was 16-16 but 15 of those losses came in the Big East.
Georgetown even with the issues was 15-17 with 13 losses come in the Big East.
St. Johns was 17-15 with 13 losses coming in the Big East.
Xavier was 19-13 with 10 losses coming in the Big East.
Marquette was 18-12 with 10 losses coming in the Big East.

So the bottom half of the conference took care of business OOC. Suffering no more than 1-4 losses OOC and doing what they needed to do to prop up the top half.

I know things change season to season, but the programs in the "NBE" as people like to call it, are all stepping up and getting better. There is also the potential of adding a 12th program. Which I am sure will also be quality or have the potential to be quality.

So while I personally wish none of this realignment crap had ever happened, it's not all doom and gloom. I am perfectly happy exactly where we are now. I would love to play Syracuse, Pitt, Notre Dame, and Louisville OOC when we can (Syracuse and Pitt every season if possible), but outside of that, this is a very good conference that will compete at the highest level every single season.

We will get 4-6 teams in the NCAA Tournament every year and that number could very easily be 7 some seasons.

Only three of those programs have mattered for any stretch in the last 30 years, the others have a new lease on life as the NBE is still 3 shades lighter than the OBE or the expanded BE of the 2000's. When WV and CIncy or Miami (FFS) leaving gives your program a chance to crack the top half of the conference, you don't get to claim some sort of legacy. All these schools passed ahead of the STJ/SH/PC's of the world in the EBE. Marquette (without D Wade) and Depaul (ever) get a shot at the NCAA. That alone says volumes.

As for XCB, they earned their chances to play in a better league. We'll see how they do long term.

 

[Mike9904111]

Only three of those programs have mattered for any stretch in the last 30 years, the others have a new lease on life as the NBE is still 3 shades lighter than the OBE or the expanded BE of the 2000's. When WV and CIncy or Miami (FFS) leaving gives your program a chance to crack the top half of the conference, you don't get to claim some sort of legacy. All these schools passed ahead of the STJ/SH/PC's of the world in the EBE. Marquette (without D Wade) and Depaul (ever) get a shot at the NCAA. That alone says volumes.

As for XCB, they earned their chances to play in a better league. We'll see how they do long term.

Again, they'll have their seasons. Conference position will shift and the strength of this conference will be its depth from top to bottom. DePaul has had good teams, even great teams in their history, and while they aren't super consistent, they are currently on the right track. They currently have 4 top 105 recruits committed for 2021.

Your statement about relevance is incorrect.

Creighton got a TON of media attention when Doug McDermott was there. They have been competitive since. If you include the fact they would have been in the NCAA's last season it would have been their 12th appearance in 20 years.

Seton Hall had made the NCAA Tournament 4 years in a row. Include the fact they were a lock last season and it would have been 5. They are very relevant.

Providence is another team that would have made it last season. Counting that, since Cooley has been there they would have been in the NCAA's 6 times in 9 seasons.

Xavier for the last 20 years has been to 16 NCAA tournaments which includes, 3 elite 8s, and 7 Sweet 16s (4 seasons ended with a Sweet 16 + 3 Elite 8s.)

St. Johns is obviously struggling overall, but they have been for quite a while in the grand scheme but they still have their moments. Since the formation of the NBE they have made the NCAA's twice. If they are one of your bottom programs, you're in business.

Georgetown has been going through the coaching change, issues within the program and so on; however, they are a very relevant program and they are looking to much better overall in a couple of seasons, also fwiw in the last 30 years obviously they have been relevant multiple times. They have been to the NCAA tournament 8 times in 20 years and that includes when they were in the OBE including a Final Four run in 2006-2007.

Marquette is a solid overall program. 12 NCAA appearances in the last 20 years to include the Final Four year with D-Wade as you mentioned, but during that stretch they also have an elite 8 and 3 sweet 16s.

Butler is another very solid overall program. They have made the NCAA Tournament 13 times in the last 20 years and it would have been 14 last season. That stretch includes 5 sweet 16s, 2 elite 8s, 2 final fours, and 2 national runner ups.

Even if we exclude a couple.

Marquette, UConn, Xavier, Villanova, Butler, Creighton, and Georgetown have all been very relevant in that 30 year stretch. Providence has been very successful under Cooley, Seton Hall has been doing well, DePaul is improving quickly, and we'll see what becomes of St. Johns. If they are going to be a program that just handles its business good enough OOC to not hurt us, while making the NCAA's every 3-4 years that's fine.

Also, obviously this is based on your definition of relevance, but I believe I am spot on here in regards to what many would consider relevant. Every program deals with issues. Look at us.

No one is saying this is as good as the OBE, the majority of us are just saying this is a better situation for us compared to the AAC. We're also saying the NBE has potential to be very good. I don't think there will ever be a conference as good as the OBE was in basketball.

That doesn't mean what I said isn't true...

Any given season the NBE will have 2-3 title contenders, and 2-3 more NCAA teams. 4-6 pending the year. Also occasionally, we'll get a 7th in when things click.

That is a very good basketball league.

 

[Zissou]

Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, and Syracuse 100% cannot be replaced. I'm not even putting Boston College into the conversation for this.

Notre Dame is a brand but were never a basketball power. Without football they are more like a mid major.

Pitt was very competitive but never made a final four. They have struggled under their last 2 head coaches.

Ville has a very prominent history of winning but also a horrible compliance reputation and low academic standards. They are the poster child for the nACC.

I do miss Cuse as a conference villain. I did mingle with the Cuse fans at the 2016 final four. They miss the Big East.

Look at the teams that left the Big East. How have they fared? Football money justifies all of the moves but basketball programs have generally seen a decline after leaving the Big East.

The nACC lost its identity. The conference is too big and sprawling. The schedule is convoluted, with a mix of 2 games and 1 game vs conference foes. Fans don’t know opposing players or coaches. Their conference tournament is 2nd rate. They used to promote the conference for academic excellence and now the have FSU, Louisville, and UNC’s fake classes. Purely for basketball I’d rather my team be in the Big East.

 

[Kolumbo]

Screw espn. The term "power" shouldn't be used at all in college basketball. College basketball fans love their teams and will tune in to watch no matter the competition. Everyone loves to see good upsets and there is plenty of great college hoops being played in more than just a handful of conferences.

 

[CL82]

Perhpas but the AAC beat UConn like a drum. We owe them some respect.

Lol, we owe them? Who is the only school to win natties for them... in three sports.

 

[Mike9904111]

Notre Dame is a brand but were never a basketball power. Without football they are more like a mid major.

Pitt was very competitive but never made a final four. They have struggled under their last 2 head coaches.

Ville has a very prominent history of winning but also a horrible compliance reputation and low academic standards. They are the poster child for the nACC.

I do miss Cuse as a conference villain. I did mingle with the Cuse fans at the 2016 final four. They miss the Big East.

Look at the teams that left the Big East. How have they fared? Football money justifies all of the moves but basketball programs have generally seen a decline after leaving the Big East.

The nACC lost its identity. The conference is too big and sprawling. The schedule is convoluted, with a mix of 2 games and 1 game vs conference foes. Fans don’t know opposing players or coaches. Their conference tournament is 2nd rate. They used to promote the conference for academic excellence and now the have FSU, Louisville, and UNC’s fake classes. Purely for basketball I’d rather my team be in the Big East.

Don't get me wrong, I agree. I am talking brand power while they were in the Big East to go along with the rivalries. Also, the legacy comment that was made I responded too.