Globe: BE expansion candidates

[ctchamps]

You're talking about football success. That's irrelevant. Miami is an excellent school. Florida is an excellent school. UCF and USF are overgrown versions of Central Connecticut State. They will never come close to Miami or Florida, and probably not FSU. Miami football may never come back, but it doesn't matter.

Germany was a group of barbaric small tribes when Greece and Rome were historically relevant. Now Greece and Italy are struggling and may bring down the Euro while Germany is the one relevant country in the Euro. UConn men's bb was a footnote in the men's bb landscape compared to Indiana, St. John's, Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina, UCLA and Kansas. Now it is at least as relevant and in some cases leapfrogged a couple of these programs.

I'm not implying that UCF or USF will be household names in football. I'm not indicating that the addition of UCF will stabilize the BE. What I'm saying is that the future landscape can't be predicted based on the present situation. Things change. Sometimes they change over a long period of time, as in the examples above. And sometimes things change quickly and drastically such as Syracuse and Pitt going to the ACC and Texas A&M going to the SEC.

 

[upstater]

Germany was a group of barbaric small tribes when Greece and Rome were historically relevant. Now Greece and Italy are struggling and may bring down the Euro while Germany is the one relevant country in the Euro. UConn men's bb was a footnote in the men's bb landscape compared to Indiana, St. John's, Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina, UCLA and Kansas. Now it is at least as relevant and in some cases leapfrogged a couple of these programs.

I'm not implying that UCF or USF will be household names in football. I'm not indicating that the addition of UCF will stabilize the BE. What I'm saying is that the future landscape can't be predicted based on the present situation. Things change. Sometimes they change over a long period of time, as in the examples above. And sometimes things change quickly and drastically such as Syracuse and Pitt going to the ACC and Texas A&M going to the SEC.

You don't need to go back 2000 years. 50 years ago Germany was the biggest debtor nation in history, and had defaulted on all its promises (not to mention the other stuff). Then the ACC came along with the Marshall Plan and made it what it is today.

Ya see, historical analogies can work in a variety of ways.

 

[ctchamps]

You don't need to go back 2000 years. 50 years ago Germany was the biggest debtor nation in history, and had defaulted on all its promises (not to mention the other stuff). Then the ACC came along with the Marshall Plan and made it what it is today.

Ya see, historical analogies can work in a variety of ways.

LOL. The salient point is not to get fixated on fixed points of time.

 

[upstater]

LOL. The salient point is not to get fixated on fixed points of time.

Agreed. But sometimes the Iron Curtain falls and things stay frozen for 60 years. I'm not sure those on the other side will be able to scale the berlin BCS wall in my lifetime if we go to superconferences.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Agreed. But sometimes the Iron Curtain falls and things stay frozen for 60 years. I'm not sure those on the other side will be able to scale the berlin BCS wall in my lifetime if we go to superconferences.

Right. There is a consolidation of power. Pitt and Cuse joined the winning team. UConn is trying to. The powerful might be willing to let a conference with SMU, TCU and especially the academies stay on the positive side. You start talking Houston, Memphis and ECU and that changes.

 

[ctchamps]

Agreed. But sometimes the Iron Curtain falls and things stay frozen for 60 years. I'm not sure those on the other side will be able to scale the berlin BCS wall in my lifetime if we go to superconferences.

Time is certainly the problem if the super conference model becomes reality. And odds are likely that is the configuration of the near future. I was examining HuskyHawks statement as it stood, not as a consideration for future events. A wasted argument relative to configurations, but relevant in many other matters.

 

[ctchamps]

Right. There is a consolidation of power. Pitt and Cuse joined the winning team. UConn is trying to. The powerful might be willing to let a conference with SMU, TCU and especially the academies stay on the positive side. You start talking Houston, Memphis and ECU and that changes.

If your premise is correct then it was a shame Pitt and Cuse didn't stick around for TCU and the academies. That would have been an interesting development. I guess they were less concerned about security and more about relationships, status or money. I feel TCU and the service academies was a decent option before Cuse and Pitt left. Now things are dicey.

 

[freescooter]

I don't know about this whole situation. I'm going to have to be convinced that the military acadamies can compete week in week out. And I don't love football only members, either. I understand it but I don't like it. I tis small time and it pretty much concedes that the league may not be here too long. TCU, SMU are fine.

BTW, if anyone thinks that US News rankings don't matter to the schools, I'm here to tell you that isn't true. An old friend of mine, former colleague, was responsible for PR at a very highly regarded, nationally ranked small college. He was fired after his school fell in the rankings 2 years in a row. And that despite the fact that he had been responsible for getting from the low 30s into the top 25 in their catagory over a few years prior, and even with their fall they remained in the mid-20s. The college president told him the fall was raising questions with the alumni and hurting recruiting students and faculty.

 

[upstater]

I don't know about this whole situation. I'm going to have to be convinced that the military acadamies can compete week in week out. And I don't love football only members, either. I understand it but I don't like it. I tis small time and it pretty much concedes that the league may not be here too long. TCU, SMU are fine.

BTW, if anyone thinks that US News rankings don't matter to the schools, I'm here to tell you that isn't true. An old friend of mine, former colleague, was responsible for PR at a very highly regarded, nationally ranked small college. He was fired after his school fell in the rankings 2 years in a row. And that despite the fact that he had been responsible for getting from the low 30s into the top 25 in their catagory over a few years prior, and even with their fall they remained in the mid-20s. The college president told him the fall was raising questions with the alumni and hurting recruiting students and faculty.

They care if it hurts student recruiting, they don't care otherwise. Since it's a computer tabulation through a questionnaire and not a real study, one wonders how in the world it was blamed on a PR guy. Something mighty fishy in that story.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

You're talking about football success. That's irrelevant. Miami is an excellent school. Florida is an excellent school. UCF and USF are overgrown versions of Central Connecticut State. They will never come close to Miami or Florida, and probably not FSU. Miami football may never come back, but it doesn't matter.

Miami has been playing in front of friends and family for years. The only thing making Miami relevant today are middle aged sports writers who thought they were gangster when they were young because they had a "U" replica jersey.

 

[MattMang23]

Dan LeBatard, Nelson Muntz is calling you out!

 

[ArthurP]

I don't know about this whole situation. I'm going to have to be convinced that the military acadamies can compete week in week out. And I don't love football only members, either. I understand it but I don't like it. I tis small time and it pretty much concedes that the league may not be here too long. TCU, SMU are fine.

BTW, if anyone thinks that US News rankings don't matter to the schools, I'm here to tell you that isn't true. An old friend of mine, former colleague, was responsible for PR at a very highly regarded, nationally ranked small college. He was fired after his school fell in the rankings 2 years in a row. And that despite the fact that he had been responsible for getting from the low 30s into the top 25 in their catagory over a few years prior, and even with their fall they remained in the mid-20s. The college president told him the fall was raising questions with the alumni and hurting recruiting students and faculty.

Yes, I wondered how much pressure the Syracuse leadership has been getting for their constant drop in the rankings in the last decade. The rant below strikes me as a case of "doth protestet too much."

http://www.syr.edu/news/articles/2011/chancellor-rankings-09-11.html

 

[MattMang23]

After reading that article, it seems that SU endeavors to become the next great community college.

 

[upstater]

Yes, I wondered how much pressure the Syracuse leadership has been getting for their constant drop in the rankings in the last decade. The rant below strikes me as a case of "doth protestet too much."

http://www.syr.edu/news/articles/2011/chancellor-rankings-09-11.html

She's right, the criteria are bogus.

Look where they rank Reed College. That tells you everything you need to know about how much effort goes into these rankings. You think colleges don't lie about their numbers on these questionnaires?

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Considering declining birth rates and economic growth in Syracuse's traditional recruiting areas, our worsening national economic morass, and parental responses to hyper-tuition inflation, it's no surprise Syracuse is "... vigorously expanding (its) admissions base to reach the best students in growing population centers such as the southwest, southeast, and west coast...".

Meanwhile, a 10/4 Stamford Advocate article on UConn's growing popularity among Stamford high school students focuses on the school's academic improvement and the rising cost of overpriced private institutions.

"The saturation of state schools in Stamford's top 10 is a new phenomenon, too. In 2007, before the Great Recession hit lower Fairfield County, Syracuse University, Boston College, Fordham and New York University were comfortably placed in that list. This year, Fordham and Syracuse were Stamford students' 11th and 12th pick, respectively, while Boston College and New York University dropped to 18th and 19th, respectively.

All four of those schools cost more than $50,000 a year when tuition, fees and room and board are included. In comparison, UConn's cost hovers slightly above $20,000 for in-state students.

Stamford students and families aren't the only ones hunting for that bargain. 'We've been seeing a trend of increased applications for more than a decade,' said UConn spokesman Michael Kirk. 'In 1995, we received about 10,800 applications. This past year, they were at more than 28,000.' The larger pool has allowed the school to be a bit choosier when picking its freshman class.

In 1998, the average SAT score of an incoming freshman at UConn was 1121; a dozen years later, that figure jumped by exactly 100 points. The mean SAT score for the UConn's incoming class last fall was 1221. 'The reputation and the standards have risen in the past even five years for UConn ..."

As much as some may wish to believe, other things beyond football may be getting tossed or kicked around.

 

[Pudge]

Considering declining birth rates and economic growth in Syracuse's traditional recruiting areas, our worsening national economic morass, and parental responses to hyper-tuition inflation, it's no surprise Syracuse is "... vigorously expanding (its) admissions base to reach the best students in growing population centers such as the southwest, southeast, and west coast...".

Meanwhile, a 10/4 Stamford Advocate article on UConn's growing popularity among Stamford high school students focuses on the school's academic improvement and the rising cost of overpriced private institutions.

"The saturation of state schools in Stamford's top 10 is a new phenomenon, too. In 2007, before the Great Recession hit lower Fairfield County, Syracuse University, Boston College, Fordham and New York University were comfortably placed in that list. This year, Fordham and Syracuse were Stamford students' 11th and 12th pick, respectively, while Boston College and New York University dropped to 18th and 19th, respectively.

All four of those schools cost more than $50,000 a year when tuition, fees and room and board are included. In comparison, UConn's cost hovers slightly above $20,000 for in-state students.

Stamford students and families aren't the only ones hunting for that bargain. 'We've been seeing a trend of increased applications for more than a decade,' said UConn spokesman Michael Kirk. 'In 1995, we received about 10,800 applications. This past year, they were at more than 28,000.' The larger pool has allowed the school to be a bit choosier when picking its freshman class.

In 1998, the average SAT score of an incoming freshman at UConn was 1121; a dozen years later, that figure jumped by exactly 100 points. The mean SAT score for the UConn's incoming class last fall was 1221. 'The reputation and the standards have risen in the past even five years for UConn ..."

As much as some may wish to believe, other things beyond football may be getting tossed or kicked around.

And there we go:

The BC BS reincarnated. We need to go to the ACC because we can attract affluent (Catholic ... but that isn't SU) students from the Southeast. FRANKLY, this whole "We got NYC market" stuff is for the birds. SU? They show up at MSG when they are good. They don't love basketball: watch when they lose. Every damn one of the SU fans are on their way home or the strip joints if SU isn't in the next round of the BE tournament. They are rats.

 

[upstater]

Syracuse is a very appealing city for southerners.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I'm sure that lifelong fans of Clemson, Ga Tech or FSU would love spending a weekend in Siberia, sorry, Syracuse, in mid January.

 

[ctchamps]

I'm sure that lifelong fans of Clemson, Ga Tech or FSU would love spending a weekend in Siberia, sorry, Syracuse, in mid January.

So that's the problem. The warm weather universities are against going to the Yukon!