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Dooley

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People here say Louisville is academically challenged, but they were smarter than UConn in getting into a P5 when it was necessary. They knew what was needed and made sure it got done. I don't understand why people here can't see that in regards to Louisville. It doesn't matter that they hired a football coach that some think is questionable, it doesn't matter that their academics may be weak. They knew the score and how to play the game, and their AD is a masterful leader. They are way ahead of UConn at this point, I am sorry to say.

I don't think anyone can argue this. LCC's academics are embarrassingly poor but their athletic department prowess is lightyears ahead of UConn's. They have pooled about 80% of their resources into the two sports that matter to Power conferences: football and men's basketball. Rick Pitino makes $4M/yr. Bobby Petrino makes $3.5M/yr. Their WBB coach makes $1M/yr. If they win 10 WBB games a year, they don't care as long as their MBB and football programs remain in the national spotlight (they do). You couple that with the two very aggressive football stadium expansions in the past decade and the sweetheart Yum! Center deal for their MBB program and you have an athletic department that is giving the entire country the official guide to a power conference membership. Louisville's AD should be the prime example of what is needed here at UConn.
 
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Let's sue the ACC. don't sign a contract with Notre Dame cause they want to play in New Jersey or Foxborough. Okay, enjoy spitting at the best conference in the country. You will feel better

None of what you're saying makes any sense.
 
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I don't care what the terms are, and neither does anyone else. They care about the actual utility of the site. There's no way you're going to convince me that the Hockey East is going to expel UConn because they're playing too often in Hartford.
You need to re-read what I wrote! They will be playing games in HFTD..most likely 5-6..added with 10 per each hoop team that give 25-26 dates. They will also have a new facility on campus as per the terms of HE membership they signed.
 
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I'm not being a Richard. But here are Hockey East bylaws, in case anyone cares to read: http://www.hockeyeastonline.com/pdf/M & W BY-LAWS/Revised Men's By-Laws September 19.pdf.

Unless I have completely missed it, it doesn't address whether a facility needs to be on-campus or if it can be off-campus. It just outlines the minimum facility feature requirements. An on-campus facility could be one of those "desk drawer" requirements communicated unofficially. Personally speaking, this doesn't change my opinion that UConn needs to build an on-campus facility, even if it's just for practice, conditioning and a few games. Here's what I'm talking about...

Article VI — Program Standards

Section VI.1 Purpose of Standards: The standards, as described below, were developed by Hockey East to provide guidance, support, and assistance to all member institutions in develop- ing and maintaining men’s hockey programs of national caliber and competitiveness. These standards will also facilitate greater understanding of the responsibilities and obligations associ- ated with Hockey East membership. These standards also provide a clear baseline in terms of the resources, human and fiscal, and other support required of each member and will enable
the association to maintain and further develop its position and profile as the strongest hockey conference in the country. Lastly, standards provide prospective new members with an under- standing of the nature of the league and the resources required to be successful as a member of the league.

Section VI.2 Framework for Standards:

Standards reflect an intention to build and retain competitiveness on a national scale
Standards reflect an intention to provide high quality experiences for all student-athletes and fans Standards will be implemented over a 2-3 year phase-in period.Specific consequences/sanctions will be imposed upon institutions not in compliance with stan- dards

Section VI.3 Standards Content Areas:

A. Institutional Support

All Hockey East member institutions must provide the following forms of support for their men’s hockey program• 18 full scholarships available annually
• 1 full-time head coach and 2 full time salaried assistant coaches with 100% of their duties assigned to men’s hockey

• Full-time sports information staff member with significant responsibilities in men’s hockey and who travels to all away games• Full-time marketing/promotions professional staff member(s) with significant responsibili- ties in marketing and promoting men’s hockey

• Full-time staff member with significant portion of their time devoted to men’s hockey equipment matters and who travels to all away games

  • Full-time certified athletic trainer assigned to men’s hockey and who travels to all away games

  • Access to specialized medical professionals and services and including a physician and EMT’s on-site at all home games.

    B. Facilities

    • Minimum seating capacity 4000 with 20% of capacity being chair-back seats. Current HEA members must have a minimum capacity of 2000 with 20% of capacity being chair-back seats.
• Hockey East logo prominently displayed in the facility and on the ice surface. Logo size to be consistent with others in the facility.

• Visiting team locker room must be a minimum of 500 sf (not including showers and toi- lets) and able to accommodate student-athletes, staff, and equipment.• Locker room(s) with private shower and toilet to accommodate game officials
• Game time-clock connected directly to the scoreboard clock in home, visitors, and of- ficials locker rooms

• Locker rooms equipped with dry erase boards and markers MEN’S HOCKEY EAST BY-LAWS — PAGE 6

• Media/TV capability – sufficient electrical power and number of outlets in media locations for the operation and transmission of television, radio broadcasts, and for the operation of trans- mission equipment and computer terminals used by the media• A minimum of 110 vertical foot candles of light evenly balanced over the entire ice surface • Press box to comfortably accommodate print and electronic working media, visiting team coaches, and officials.

• 110 –volt electrical outlets with one outlet for every two seats in the press box
• Power requirements for television production of 200 amps, 3-phase to the trucks; of 150 amps, 3-phase combined to the satellite links and of 150 amps, 3-phase to the announcers’ posi- tion.

  • Defined media area for post-game interviews
  • High-speed data lines and/or wireless internet capability
  • Spectator amenities/services including clean and well presented lobby and display areas
  • Clean and sufficient restroom areas for capacity crowds
  • Multiple concessions areas and area for sale of team/league merchandise

    C. Competitive Aspects

    • Members must schedule a minimum of 34 games against NCAA Division I institutions
    • No games (exhibition or non-conference) shall be permitted with NCAA Division II, III or non-varsity hockey-playing institutions

    D. Team Services

    • Unless restricted by the host institution’s intercollegiate facility schedule, practice time must be provided to the visiting team on game days, when requested by the visiting team no less than 14 days prior to the game.• Visiting team and officials’ locker rooms shall be supplied with towels, soap, and re- freshments. On-ice officials shall also be provided with a post-game meal and parking for their vehicle(s).
  • Water, coolers, cups, ice and towels shall be provided for immediate care/treatment pur- poses

  • Taping table and an exercise bicycle shall be provided in the visiting team locker room or vicinity

  • The athletic training room shall be made available to visiting teams for treatment and rehabilitation purposes• A physician shall be available for visiting teams upon request during all games
    • A video feed will be provided during games to visiting teams

    E. Marketing, Media & Event Management

    • Season tickets sales plan must be developed and implemented each season
    • Playoff ticket option must be made available with all season ticket packages
    • Average attendance for each season must be a minimum of 2000
    • A seasonal marketing and promotions plan must be developed and implemented annually • Each member must have radio broadcasts of all games

    • Each member must video stream all home games, unless restricted by existing contracts. • Each member must develop and maintain a high quality website, linked to the HEA website, which includes up-to-date information, statistics, features, etc. about it’s men’s hockey program

    • Each member must organize various promotions to generate excitement and increase the entertainment value for spectators at all games• Each member shall cooperate with HEA in all branding initiatives
    • Institutions must publish a high quality media guide and/or game program which includes coach/player profiles and program/individuals statistics

    MEN’S HOCKEY EAST BY-LAWS — PAGE 7
• Hockey East logo must appear prominently (front or back cover) in all hockey-related publications• A minimum of 3 PA announcements which includes day-of out of town scores, and other Hockey East announcements (tournament tickets, etc)• Institutions are encouraged to develop entertaining pre-game introductions which con- form to pre-game protocol• Provide at no cost one parking spot for visiting team officials/athletic director, if requested.
This article should explain it:
http://m.hartfordbusiness.com/artic...xl-center-wrangle-over-short-term-lease-talks
Here is the deal with on-campus facility:
But XL may not have as big a piece of UConn hockey for long. Under its membership agreement with Hockey East, UConn is required to put a shovel in the ground for a new on-campus arena in the 2016-2017 academic year, Enright said. Early estimates peg the size at 185,000 square feet, with a minimum cost of $20 million.
 

CL82

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You need to re-read what I wrote! They will be playing games in HFTD..most likely 5-6..added with 10 per each hoop team that give 25-26 dates. They will also have a new facility on campus as per the terms of HE membership they signed.
I know this is what XL wanted. Did UConn agree to this? Too many BB dates, and probably two too many hockey dates as well IMO.
 
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Six teams have appeared in the 2012, 2013 & 2014 final AP college football polls -- Alabama, Clemson, FSU, Louisville, Ohio State & Oregon.

I was surprised at how few teams have been consistently end-ranked over the period....have to hand it to Louisville.

But they aren't better than us. At least if you read the BY.
 
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This article should explain it:
http://m.hartfordbusiness.com/artic...xl-center-wrangle-over-short-term-lease-talks
Here is the deal with on-campus facility:
But XL may not have as big a piece of UConn hockey for long. Under its membership agreement with Hockey East, UConn is required to put a shovel in the ground for a new on-campus arena in the 2016-2017 academic year, Enright said. Early estimates peg the size at 185,000 square feet, with a minimum cost of $20 million.


Good read, thanks. As stated before, I know its impossible; but, I wish Hartford and the XL Center would fix its own problems and not rely on UConn to save them. In an ideal world, UConn builds a 12K basketball/6K hockey combination arena on campus and uses Freitas as a practice facility that can also generate revenue and/or good will by renting it out to local youth and high school programs. During the semester break, all 3 sports play in Hartford along with maybe two additional games for each sport while also allowing each team to have one or two neutral site games at MSG or something similar.

In turn, Hartford decides if it wants to build a new arena with the hope of luring a NHL team or accept its status as an AHL market and further renovate and possibly even downsize the XL to keep the cost low. Something will have to be done because The XL may not even be able to keep its AHL team now that 1/4 of AHL teams are out west and the rumor that the Rangers will move their AHL franchise to Bridgeport should the Islanders move their AHL franchise to Nassau Coliseum after its renovation is complete in 2017.
 

Waquoit

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Kind of the reverse of the UConn deal with the XL Center, where we are looked at to save downtown Hartford from itself.
That may be the perception, but the truth is that the XL is saving the basketball team. Fans are avoiding Gampel in droves, especially on weeknights. The upper deck chairback section is maybe half full more often then not. There are always big swatches of empties in the lower bowl.Now those seats are sold, but ticket holders aren't going. The SMU game was dead. Only the Texas game sold out. Crowds for the cupcake games are sparse to say the least. Meanwhile, the XL is getting 13K+ for Central and Temple. And those fannies were in the seats, not at home. UConn fans that actually buy tickets and go to games have spoken, they prefer Hartford.
 
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I think he's being facetious by recapping past blunders.
For once we agree. I don't have time to go into detail right now. Pissing people off and acting arrogant will not help. BC and Notre Dame are two current members of HE currently in P5 conferences. As fans, we might hate them, but in the political world of power and influence, we need them.
 
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Dooley

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This article should explain it:
http://m.hartfordbusiness.com/artic...xl-center-wrangle-over-short-term-lease-talks
Here is the deal with on-campus facility:
But XL may not have as big a piece of UConn hockey for long. Under its membership agreement with Hockey East, UConn is required to put a shovel in the ground for a new on-campus arena in the 2016-2017 academic year, Enright said. Early estimates peg the size at 185,000 square feet, with a minimum cost of $20 million.

Thanks FDNY. For the record, I wasn't trying to call BS on you or anything. I just couldn't find it in the bylaws, that's all. I happen to agree with the sentiment that we need to build a state-of-an-art facility on-campus for our hockey program.
 
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Thanks FDNY. For the record, I wasn't trying to call BS on you or anything. I just couldn't find it in the bylaws, that's all. I happen to agree with the sentiment that we need to build a state-of-an-art facility on-campus for our hockey program.
oh I know...I just keep that article handy for when the "there will be no new hockey facility on campus" crowd pipes up. I posted it on the hockey board a few times.
 
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oh I know...I just keep that article handy for when the "there will be no new hockey facility on campus" crowd pipes up. I posted it on the hockey board a few times.

disclaimer: I'm not anti storrs or anti on -campus facilities, but we have to look at the cost of this proposed facility. I don't mind an on-campus arena,but an additional 20-25 million of CT taxpayer $ whether be through student fees, donors, or ct tax payer $ ???. Why are we paying 10 million to fix a leak on the roof of gampel? Use the 10mil to upgrade gampel to a 12/6k bball/hockey arena and upgrade freitas as a better practice facility. No need for 20-25 million. If so, tear down gampel and make a wicked sweet hockey/basketball arena. Not hockey only. Cause then, gampel will have to be replaced in 1-2 decades. Do both, not 2 separate arenas. Unless you like wasting $.
Oh wait....

No where in those standards does it say it "has to be on-campus"
Before UCONN got accepted , HE and UCONN accepted and agreed to those standards. The XLC met those standards. Freitas did not.
I don't think CT, UCONN, or HE expected the success UCONN showed in attendance prior to the 1st game. We're talking #1 in HE and top 10 in attendance in all of D1. That's pretty dang good for an inaugural season with not the best product on ice. 1st BC game @ XL Seriously HE was thinking, screw the standards, this success needs to be sustained and continue to grow. We wouldn't be called out on NESN for our attendance success if it was in storrs. UCONN hockey made $$$$$$ in Hartford. Why would they want to stop that? It gives more exposure to the program when in Hartford. It gives recruits: "you 'll be playing in front of thousands and where the whalers used to play. History, exposure, city lights, real AHL/NHL like environment. Drunk screaming fans.

***You can't forget about the beer here. No Booze on on-campus facilities.***

To outdraw and embarrass the AHL wolfpack in attendance shows the state (especially the northern 3 counties in CT really wants a hockey team to call their own. A real CT team. Not baby rangers, isles, bruins , blue jackets/yotes. A real CT hockey team. That's #1 reason I bought ST. I never went to UCONN and don't have the love /affinity/don't mess with storrs attitude.
But , I LOVE CONNECTICUT and especially CT hockey!

Lots of people in those stands last year felt the same. Probably never set foot in the XLC since the whalers left and probably never set foot on the storrs campus.

I don't mind an on-campus arena, but not at 20-25 million especially when us working CT residents have to pay. Make it dual use. Use newly 250
Mil renovated XLC for national exposure for bball and hockey programs and it's tournaments to get p5 invite. Use p5 $ for all the on-campus upgrades. Then, XLC and storrs will both have nice shiny new buildings.

Why is Uconn holding out on a long term deal with XLC? They are paying $ for game to game currently. It must mean:
1 ) waiting for funding for XLC renovations to sign long term lease
2 ) waiting for B1G invite before signing long term lease
 
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So Louisville expands their stadium when they're bad, expanding it again now that they're good, and took our spot in the ACC...and we're on the message board arguing where our hockey team is going to play and wondering why we're left out. Makes sense.
 
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disclaimer: I'm not anti storrs or anti on -campus facilities, but we have to look at the cost of this proposed facility. I don't mind an on-campus arena,but an additional 20-25 million of CT taxpayer $ whether be through student fees, donors, or ct tax payer $ ???. Why are we paying 10 million to fix a leak on the roof of gampel? Use the 10mil to upgrade gampel to a 12/6k bball/hockey arena and upgrade freitas as a better practice facility. No need for 20-25 million. If so, tear down gampel and make a wicked sweet hockey/basketball arena. Not hockey only. Cause then, gampel will have to be replaced in 1-2 decades. Do both, not 2 separate arenas. Unless you like wasting $.
Oh wait....

No where in those standards does it say it "has to be on-campus"
Before UCONN got accepted , HE and UCONN accepted and agreed to those standards. The XLC met those standards. Freitas did not.
I don't think CT, UCONN, or HE expected the success UCONN showed in attendance prior to the 1st game. We're talking #1 in HE and top 10 in attendance in all of D1. That's pretty dang good for an inaugural season with not the best product on ice. 1st BC game @ XL Seriously HE was thinking, screw the standards, this success needs to be sustained and continue to grow. We wouldn't be called out on NESN for our attendance success if it was in storrs. UCONN hockey made $$$$$$ in Hartford. Why would they want to stop that? It gives more exposure to the program when in Hartford. It gives recruits: "you 'll be playing in front of thousands and where the whalers used to play. History, exposure, city lights, real AHL/NHL like environment. Drunk screaming fans.

***You can't forget about the beer here. No Booze on on-campus facilities.***

To outdraw and embarrass the AHL wolfpack in attendance shows the state (especially the northern 3 counties in CT really wants a hockey team to call their own. A real CT team. Not baby rangers, isles, bruins , blue jackets/yotes. A real CT hockey team. That's #1 reason I bought ST. I never went to UCONN and don't have the love /affinity/don't mess with storrs attitude.
But , I LOVE CONNECTICUT and especially CT hockey!

Lots of people in those stands last year felt the same. Probably never set foot in the XLC since the whalers left and probably never set foot on the storrs campus.

I don't mind an on-campus arena, but not at 20-25 million especially when us working CT residents have to pay. Make it dual use. Use newly 250
Mil renovated XLC for national exposure for bball and hockey programs and it's tournaments to get p5 invite. Use p5 $ for all the on-campus upgrades. Then, XLC and storrs will both have nice shiny new buildings.

Why is Uconn holding out on a long term deal with XLC? They are paying $ for game to game currently. It must mean:
1 ) waiting for funding for XLC renovations to sign long term lease
2 ) waiting for B1G invite before signing long term lease

Upgrading Gampel would be a GREAT idea! There is NO WAY hockey recruiting stays the course if something isn't done though whether it means a new stand alone facility, upgraded Gampel, or a Practice facility at Freitas and games at the XL Center. And as for your hockey attendance theory...I hope it doesn't die off the minute it isn't new anymore and Cav isn't winning on a consistent basis. Here are some Mike Cavanaugh comments on a on-campus facility here: (http://www.theuconnblog.com/2014/10/10/6956871/uconn-mens-hockey-interview-with-mike-cavanaugh)..
You touched on the buildings of the different Hockey East teams, you guys will be playing in the XL Center this season. People have been discussing the possibility of something being built on campus. Is that something that's important to you and people within the program?

I think it's a necessity and it was part of the agreement when we decided to upgrade to Hockey East that we would build and on-campus facility. I think it is essential for our players. Whether that be a top-notch training facility like the Men's and Women's Basketball team have and we all play out of a multi-sport facility that's one avenue we're looking at, another avenue is to build a standalone facility that's just hockey only. I know the school is having meetings on this and discussing it and is supposed to be presented this December, either way it is something that I believe is essential to our program.


I've been to a few Hockey East barns, one of the great things about college hockey is that you get that quaint, small atmosphere that holds in the noise, it'd be nice to replicate something like that at UConn wouldn't it?

Oh it'd be fantastic. I mean, Gampel Pavilion is a 10,000 seat arena which is probably small for a Division 1 basketball program and that place is electric on game night. Our soccer team averages 5,000 fans per game, so this is a rabid, rabid fan-base here in the State of Connecticut and we certainly are looking to tap into that and have them support us as well.

The thing that's tough to swallow is how Pedro Segarra keeps putting his hand out to the CRDA and the state to "bail" out Hartford. At some point the city of Hartford needs to make themselves marketable. If I had the kind of money Terry Pegula has....I wold buy the Coyotes and look at building my own arena in East Hartford between Silver Lane and I-84 where the old shopping plaza and Cinema is. The area is already set up for traffic for 40,000 people so 18,000-20,000 is no problem...and you are free and clear of the handouts you have to fork over to Mayor Segarra and his cronies.

He's out the door if they bail on this project and leave him with Freitas as is...and it will be to somewhere else other than BC. Then UCONN hockey is in trouble and will fulfill the predictions of the UNH fans on the USCHO forum..the 2nd coming of UMass-Amherst.
 

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A couple of quick points. IIRC the 10 million was not only roof repairs. It also included the creation of a concourse as well as some other items. I believe the master plan has a the demo of the field house and a new orientation/entrance to Gampel that would be oriented facing toward the existing field house toward a new plaza.

Hockey doesn't need a 12,000 person arena. I cannot see men's and women's BB wanting to play over ice with the condensation issues and need to schedule among more users. If we were a smaller program just looking to build a facility, it might make sense. It doesn't for where we are now.
 
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For once we agree. I don't have time to go into detail right now. Pissing people off and acting arrogant will not help. BC and Notre Dame are two current members of HE currently in P5 conferences. As fans, we might hate them, but in the political world of power and influence, we need them.
For once? I'm not that bad.
 
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A couple of quick points. IIRC the 10 million was not only roof repairs. It also included the creation of a concourse as well as some other items. I believe the master plan has a the demo of the field house and a new orientation/entrance to Gampel that would be oriented facing toward the existing field house toward a new plaza.

Hockey doesn't need a 12,000 person arena. I cannot see men's and women's BB wanting to play over ice with the condensation issues and need to schedule among more users. If we were a smaller program just looking to build a facility, it might make sense. It doesn't for where we are now.

If UConn went the Basketball/hockey combo route, I don't think Gampel would work. There is classroom and offices under the court where the ice equipment would need to go and I believe the footprint would need to be expanded, which, considering how Gampel is built - a circle of cement with a dome roof above, would be an engineering challenge and thus cost a lot of money. Thus, if that route was selected, Gampel would need to be torn down and everyone would be at XL for 2 years while a new facility is build where Gampel is today or the new facility could go into Storrs Center to create true entertainment district, which I think would be awesome. Scheduling should be OK as the basketball has its separate practice facility and Feitas can be used for hockey practice. I am not sure if the floor 'quality' for basketball with ice under it would be an issues as it does not seem to be an issue at the XL today. While this may cost more money up front; it maybe cheaper in the long run that building a separate 4K/5K hockey arena and the eventual renovation and expansion of Gampel. Plus, it would be a clear signal to the folks in Hartford that it is time to fix their own problems.

PS - I am actually waiting for Hartford pols to demand that UConn move entire academic programs (business school?) to the new Hartford campus and build/buy dorms downtown. I am also worried that UConn baseball may get pushed to the new Yard Goat stadium thus ending hope that JO Christian will be upgraded.
 
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If UConn went the Basketball/hockey combo route, I don't think Gampel would work. There is classroom and offices under the court where the ice equipment would need to go and I believe the footprint would need to be expanded, which, considering how Gampel is built - a circle of cement with a dome roof above, would be an engineering challenge and thus cost a lot of money. Thus, if that route was selected, Gampel would need to be torn down and everyone would be at XL for 2 years while a new facility is build where Gampel is today or the new facility could go into Storrs Center to create true entertainment district, which I think would be awesome. Scheduling should be OK as the basketball has its separate practice facility and Feitas can be used for hockey practice. I am not sure if the floor 'quality' for basketball with ice under it would be an issues as it does not seem to be an issue at the XL today. While this may cost more money up front; it maybe cheaper in the long run that building a separate 4K/5K hockey arena and the eventual renovation and expansion of Gampel. Plus, it would be a clear signal to the folks in Hartford that it is time to fix their own problems.

PS - I am actually waiting for Hartford pols to demand that UConn move entire academic programs (business school?) to the new Hartford campus and build/buy dorms downtown. I am also worried that UConn baseball may get pushed to the new Yard Goat stadium thus ending hope that JO Christian will be upgraded.
I think the shot Malloy fired at Segarra in the Courant the other day was a warning shot...http://www.courant.com/politics/hc-malloy-hartford-aid-0829-20150828-story.html......but IMHO Segarra's too stupid to realize that.
 
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Malloy is behind Segarra opponent and is hoping Segarra goes the way of the Tasmania wolf
Following that election in the paper is like watching a train wreck happen in slow motion
 
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People here say Louisville is academically challenged, but they were smarter than UConn in getting into a P5 when it was necessary. They knew what was needed and made sure it got done. I don't understand why people here can't see that in regards to Louisville. It doesn't matter that they hired a football coach that some think is questionable, it doesn't matter that their academics may be weak. They knew the score and how to play the game, and their AD is a masterful leader. They are way ahead of UConn at this point, I am sorry to say.
Louisville knew they had to work their ass off to get into what many believed was a conference that had academic integrity.
We figured we were in because hit was hysterical to think a school as disregarded academically as Louisville would have a realistic shot. Hell, an ACC president just days before the vote said that academics in the end was going to matter.
GUESS NOT.
 
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Maybe Louisville gave them a plan on improving their academics, and beat us athletically where it counted at the time? I'm sorry, but people act like Louisville is a bunch of dummies but they got in and we did not. While they have the Yum! Center and are expanding their football stadium, we're talking about where our hockey team is going to play and how great our women's basketball is. Unfortunately, I'm not sure those two things are all that important to a P5 conference. Why aren't WE expanding in football?
 
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Maybe Louisville gave them a plan on improving their academics, and beat us athletically where it counted at the time? I'm sorry, but people act like Louisville is a bunch of dummies but they got in and we did not. While they have the Yum! Center and are expanding their football stadium, we're talking about where our hockey team is going to play and how great our women's basketball is. Unfortunately, I'm not sure those two things are all that important to a P5 conference. Why aren't WE expanding in football?

Why do you think they just added so much new parking at Rentschler?
 
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