IF there is Big 12 Expansion

[Hoophound]

There are very few things that annoy me on this,forum. The idea that UCONN is going to be okay no matter what or that there is some secret agreement with a P5 conference is one of them.

UConn is currently assed out. If the big 12 expands from G5 schools, that isn't going to set off musical chairs in the P5. Who knows when if ever another opportunity arises. It has been 3 years since Louisville got added over us.

You know nothing so choosing to know nothing negatively vs positively is equally annoying.

 

[CL82]

FWIW, I am wrapping my mind around the concept that this is it and we might as well make the best of it. I hope to be pleasantly surprised to the contrary, although I'm not expecting it. For me at least that's just mentally easier to deal with, at least until the next key tweet or until some toothless hillbilly chooses to peck some cryptic pearl of wisdom out in his basement.

 

[DudeOfCT]

FWIW, I am wrapping my mind around the concept that this is it and we might as well make the best of it. I hope to be pleasantly surprised to the contrary, although I'm not expecting it. For me at least that's just mentally easier to deal with, at least until the next key tweet or until some toothless hillbilly chooses to peck some cryptic pearl of wisdom out in his basement.

Look, we don't absolutely need the P5. If UConn can put kids in the NFL, then kids will commit. UConn will win games. UConn will win conference championships. UConn will eventually make the playoffs. More fans will come every year. If enough other members of the American do the same thing, in 10-20 years the AAC could be mentioned in the same breath as the SEC or B1G.

At the same time, it would be really convenient to be in the B1G or the ACC right now. On the other hand, what if the ACC ends up in the G5 in 15 years?

 

[CL82]

Look, we don't absolutely need the P5. If UConn can put kids in the NFL, then kids will commit. UConn will win games. UConn will win conference championships. UConn will eventually make the playoffs. More fans will come every year. If enough other members of the American do the same thing, in 10-20 years the AAC could be mentioned in the same breath as the SEC or B1G.

At the same time, it would be really convenient to be in the B1G or the ACC right now. On the other hand, what if the ACC ends up in the G5 in 15 years?

The programs who are in will have at least 8 years of making 20 times our TV revenue and thus will have out paced us in facilities and coaches salaries is my guess. We're kind of like the dog tied to the bumper in the original Vacation running as hard as we can to keep up. You can do for the first mile or two but the end result is inevitable unless something changes.

 

[whaler11]

You know nothing so choosing to know nothing negatively vs positively is equally annoying.

This is just silly. He knows UConn isn't in the Big Ten. Pretending they allowed Louisville to join the ACC because they were spoken for isn't being positive - it's just being ridiculous.

 

[CTMike]

Look, we don't absolutely need the P5. If UConn can put kids in the NFL, then kids will commit. UConn will win games. UConn will win conference championships. UConn will eventually make the playoffs. More fans will come every year. If enough other members of the American do the same thing, in 10-20 years the AAC could be mentioned in the same breath as the SEC or B1G.

At the same time, it would be really convenient to be in the B1G or the ACC right now. On the other hand, what if the ACC ends up in the G5 in 15 years?

Respectfully but strongly disagree. P5 is a must for both football and basketball, and therefore our whole athletic department. Winning will help only so much. Winning against teams we CARE about moves things, and that's not gonna happen in the AAC. Time will not solve that problem. UConn will not make any playoff while in the AAC the deck is too stacked against that. And the AAC will never be mentioned with the SEC.

 

[upstater]

McMurphy's point doesn't hold much water. Louisville had had decent football for an extended period, from the 1980s on.

There is no one like them out there except for BYU and Boise St (maybe). UCF is new at this. East Carolina has never really been all that good. In other words, there really is no Louisville. So despite the fact Louisville had a small market and not much to offer there, they had good football for many years (Memphis isn't going to reproduce this in the next 2-3 years), they had great basketball, and a lot of fans.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

The Cards would not want to be in a conference that Kentucky is a charter member. We would become the other school from Ky. Louisville wanted to be in the BE. That is the conference that we were always trying to get in. When it broke up Louisville would have went to any P5, but the ACC is a dream come true.

A lot of money could be made with Louisville and Kentucky battling twice a year or more in hoops and to a lesser degree one a year in football. I don't see Alabama complaining that Auburn is in the SEC or Michigan St worried about sharing the BIG with Michigan. I doubt it will happen; but, why would Louisville be afraid?

 

[Dooley]

Look, we don't absolutely need the P5.

I'm sorry, but I couldn't read your post past the first sentence. How exactly do we not need to be in the P5?? Have you paid attention to any/all of the autonomy votes, money shifts, rule changes, and exclusive club voting actions? College football has become a Power conference member only sport. Next, it will be college basketball and on down the line of revenue making sports until it's power conference members only playing meaningful games, televised games, and competing for national championships.

We put kids in the NFL because we were a BCS member program. How many kids did we put in the NFL pre-Big East? How many games were televised pre-Big East? How many non-power/BCS conference members have won basketball national championships?

We simply can not compete with our regional r1vals if we're stuck in the AAC while they are making 30-50x TV revenue that we are making.

 

[DudeOfCT]

I'm sorry, but I couldn't read your post past the first sentence. How exactly do we not need to be in the P5?? Have you paid attention to any/all of the autonomy votes, money shifts, rule changes, and exclusive club voting actions? College football has become a Power conference member only sport. Next, it will be college basketball and on down the line of revenue making sports until it's power conference members only playing meaningful games, televised games, and competing for national championships.

We put kids in the NFL because we were a BCS member program. How many kids did we put in the NFL pre-Big East? How many games were televised pre-Big East? How many non-power/BCS conference members have won basketball national championships?

We simply can not compete with our regional r1vals if we're stuck in the AAC while they are making 30-50x TV revenue that we are making.

You put kids in the NFL by training them for the NFL, not by trying to win college games. The kids want to play professional football. That is more important than how the college team does.

 

[noeynox]

You know nothing so choosing to know nothing negatively vs positively is equally annoying.

Your right I know nothing that will happen in CR, but I do know that playing the lottery is a poor retirement strategy and that is what everything is going to be all right is equal to, to me anyways.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Okay guys it's over.
So let's just shut down this board as UConn has Zero
Hope in theCR discussion. So what point does this board serve.
The upside is we get rid of a bunch of trolls especially UConn Dissers or Haters
I have a list of candidates
Of course the downside is we drop football and admit Nelson was the prophetic
One. Sorry guys
Or the Naysayers who actually accomplish nothing but their own wailing and gnashing of teeth ,can just shut up and find their perverse pleasure in another more valuable pursuit. I for one am sick of these fountains of. knowledge telling me we are in a tough spot like they are privy to some oracle.
Sorry about you life choices. Change is always a possibility.
Anyone with an 80 IQ or higher already knows we're in a tough spot, being constantly reminded serves no purpose other than fuel the inflated ego of some
Malcontent

 

[3d2bcards]

A lot of money could be made with Louisville and Kentucky battling twice a year or more in hoops and to a lesser degree one a year in football. I don't see Alabama complaining that Auburn is in the SEC or Michigan St worried about sharing the BIG with Michigan. I doubt it will happen; but, why would Louisville be afraid?

There are several reasons that it wouldn't be wanted by U of L or UK. I don't think this is the right place to write much about the relationship between U of L and UK.

 

[SubbaBub]

The ACC has added Miami, VT, BC, Pitt, Cuse, UofL, and ND's non-revenue sports for five FB games a year, primarily to increase their FB revenue generating power. They could have done this a number of ways but chose to go the route of a CCG and to increase the likelihood of more representation in the BCS games by increasing the SOS for their FB champion. This is why FSU and Clemson wanted a FB selection this go around and just as getting to 12 by any means necessary was the goal the last time around. Timing played a huge role in the selections based on who was available and their reputation at the time within the ACC corridors of power.

Miami was always #1. As they needed two more to get to 12. VT should have been #2 but, the ACC was too dumb even then to properly evaluate program values. The VA legislature bailed them out. This is were the timing becomes crucial. They should have chosen between UL and UConn at that point, but neither had established anything on the FB field. They instead chose wo minor legacy programs in Cuse and BC, eventually lucking into the VT and being stuck with BC. In the second round they needed FB by order of FSU and their plus one. They should have again picked UofL and UConn as the best AD's on the east coast still available. But, they picked minor legacy programs Cuse and Pitt. When the last round came by they were left with UofL and UConn and by some miracle created a situation that even the ACC couldn't screw up so long as they didn't give ND a free pass to squat in their guest room (oops). Was UConn the better pick, yes it was. Can't fault them for taking UofL as they are a solid AD that also gets a lot of money from their fanbase. The internal politics by this point made the Uof L pick a certainty. The lore of Jurich stealing the bid is just nonsense. UConn didn't go from in to out because the votes were never there.

The B1G went another route by increasing revenue through large DMA's with public AAU schools with FB programs. The B1G was never going to pick UConn in this last round. Their pecking order was TV, public, AAU. FB never entered the equation. UVa, MD, RU, UNC, GT could all have been picked but RU was always going to be pick #1 because of sheer population.

Which brings us to the B12. The B12 suffers from the same stupidity and internal politics as the ACC does. They are incapable of making the best decision for the group because everyone in out for themselves on every issue. What they should do is work to fashion 5 geographically coherent conferences that all P5's can agree on, much like the NFL did when it expanded. The divisions were mostly geographic but respected the legacy of certain rivalries. Keeping Dallas in the NFC East is the prime example, This of course in impossible so the B12 should look at the next best option. That option would be to improve the league's stability, revenue, recruiting reach and TV reach. The first two are satisfied by simply expanding, and for the B12, 14 is way better than 12. The question should be is 16 better than 14. The numbers for each addition would answer that.

So, now you have BYU, Cincy, Memphis, UCF, USF, Houston, and UConn as potential candidates as stealing another P5 team is as unlikely as a P5 joining the BE in 2002. This is their pool of candidates. If you think 16 is the way to go, then the answer is easy take BYU, Cincy, the two FL schools, UConn, and either Memphis or Houston. Why UCF/USF over either UM or UH? Easy, one game in FL for every team nearly every year for recruiting purposes. Why UH over Memphis? Because it's Texas, no other really good reason.

If the move is to 14 it becomes more complicated. BYU and UConn bring the most $$ and additional TV exposure. Cincy brings the best FB over the last decade and OH/Western PA recruiting and one of the FL schools is certainty. The questions surround UConn's location and lack of recruiting, USF/UCF viability as 4th and 5th FB programs, BYU's independence, distance and religious restrictions, and the size/redundancy of TV markets Memphis and Houston respectively affecting revenue of each add. Since this is about $$ more than anything, then picks are Cincy, UConn, and 2 of BYU and the FL schools.

As it stands, the dummies will pick UCF and Houston and stop at 12.

 

[itgoeslike]

UConn has a better combination of academics, athletics, research and markets than the majority of P5 programs. Unfortunately, what's driving Big12 expansions isn't what's driving expansion in the B1G, SEC and PAC12. The Big12 needs football brand names to prop up their meager markets and ratings (Texas aside), or at the very least, quality football to maintain credibility and/or recruiting grounds to build on the solid programs they have (which they do). The problem for the Big12 is that four of their brands have already bolted their conference, and it's highly unlikely that any major brand currently in a P5 conference would jump ship into a conference that could sink at any moment (it's simply not going to happen). They are stuck. Since the Big12 is not in a position to leverage content, UConn is not going to be as valuable to the Big12 (these guys are renting and not owning) versus a conference that has a significant stake in their own network (2nd and 3rd tier programming). It's not because UConn didn't win as many national championships as the entire Big12 conference a year or so ago—because they did—it has more do with the Big12's inability to monetize UConn's success. Similarly, the ACC took Louisville over UConn because they desperately needed football credibility and was/is in a chess match for survival against the Big12. If either the ACC or Big12 could overcome their respective set of obstacles and become a shareholder in their own network, things would be very different for UConn.

The B1G's structure values what UConn has to offer. Do they value UVA and/or UNC more? Probably, but UConn does offer quality programming with a committed fan base that the B1G can leverage (and grow). If an opportunity arose for the B1G to grab a single high profile school, it's not implausible that UConn gets paired with them. Should both the ACC and Big12 ever gain their own network along with increased stability, you could very well see either the B1G or ACC move to leverage UConn's markets, brand, and athletics. It's been suggested that the B1G told Rutgers to hang tight should an opportunity arise to pair them with a bigger fish. Does UConn have a similar deal? Who knows? I don't. But, I look at those that believe UConn has a secret deal with the B1G and those that unequivocally know that UConn has no plan or is making no effort to join a P5 conferene as being on the same footing. One position is no more credible than the other.

Second to last comment: UConn should always strive to compete at the highest level and being in a P5 or P4 conference ensures that. I don't see any way around that, long term.

Last comment: Those schools that are lobbying against UConn because they fear a UConn on a level playing field playing against top tier competition would leave them in the dust—well, they couldn't be more right. . .

 

[The Funster]

You put kids in the NFL by training them for the NFL, not by trying to win college games. The kids want to play professional football. That is more important than how the college team does.

So HCBD's philosophy last year was a good one? Play em all like preseason games!

 

[whaler11]

Okay guys it's over.
So let's just shut down this board as UConn has Zero
Hope in theCR discussion. So what point does this board serve.
The upside is we get rid of a bunch of trolls especially UConn Dissers or Haters
I have a list of candidates
Of course the downside is we drop football and admit Nelson was the prophetic
One. Sorry guys
Or the Naysayers who actually accomplish nothing but their own wailing and gnashing of teeth ,can just shut up and find their perverse pleasure in another more valuable pursuit. I for one am sick of these fountains of. knowledge telling me we are in a tough spot like they are privy to some oracle.
Sorry about you life choices. Change is always a possibility.
Anyone with an 80 IQ or higher already knows we're in a tough spot, being constantly reminded serves no purpose other than fuel the inflated ego of some
Malcontent

I enjoy your posts and respect what you say - but you are reacting to what you have perceived posts have said instead of what they say.

 

[djct1999]

Okay guys it's over.
So let's just shut down this board as UConn has Zero
Hope in theCR discussion. So what point does this board serve.
The upside is we get rid of a bunch of trolls especially UConn Dissers or Haters
I have a list of candidates
Of course the downside is we drop football and admit Nelson was the prophetic
One. Sorry guys
Or the Naysayers who actually accomplish nothing but their own wailing and gnashing of teeth ,can just shut up and find their perverse pleasure in another more valuable pursuit. I for one am sick of these fountains of. knowledge telling me we are in a tough spot like they are privy to some oracle.
Sorry about you life choices. Change is always a possibility.
Anyone with an 80 IQ or higher already knows we're in a tough spot, being constantly reminded serves no purpose other than fuel the inflated ego of some
Malcontent

lets give up when the actions(not words, or lack thereof) of the uconn administration suggest they have. again, uconn has done everything possible(the list is long) since the last round of cr to make itself more appealing to the P5. don't let the noise from bloggers or malcontents or media puppets confuse you. uconn is on track and they won't be left out regardless of what so many who know so little want to tell you.

 

[junglehusky]

I enjoy your posts and respect what you say - but you are reacting to what you have perceived posts have said instead of what they say.

Well, that describes like, half the posts on the Boneyard, so Pop fits right in.

 

[CallMeBruce]

According to McMurphy on radio today discussing Memphis's chances for the Big12:

“When the ACC made their last move with expansion, they took Louisville. The reason why they took Louisville is not TV market, it wasn’t size of the city, size of the state. It was who is the best available football program out there? That’s why they got Louisville. If it would’ve happened a couple years earlier, it probably would’ve been Connecticut. They were coming off the Fiesta Bowl, the basketball team had won the national title, Louisville was struggling. … So what may seem like the best two teams right now may look a lot different in three years.”

I have to imagine this is a screaming argument against Memphis.

 

[SonsOfNutmeg]

Texas basically told the B-12 members who are their toads (BU, TCU, TT, KSU & ISU) that they could publicly favor expansion but only if it were for a school that has already turned the conference down (BYU) and one that would never leave the new home they are thrilled to be part of (UL). This is B-12 expansion Longhorn style.

Would someone please tell the Big XII to get off their high horse!

 

[SonsOfNutmeg]

Gotta love the UConn's not even in the conversation here when it comes to expansion... But should be (and would have been). Honestly, if I'm the Big XII right now I'm getting BYU and Boise State in first. Get back to 12, then look at adding in Cincy and UConn based purely off of academics, history, and geographic/media market presence. You get the NYC DMA with UConn. Who else can say that?

 

[DudeOfCT]

Gotta love the UConn's not even in the conversation here when it comes to expansion... But should be (and would have been). Honestly, if I'm the Big XII right now I'm getting BYU and Boise State in first. Get back to 12, then look at adding in Cincy and UConn based purely off of academics, history, and geographic/media market presence. You get the NYC DMA with UConn. Who else can say that?

For some reason I'm having a hard time seeing a problem with your logic.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

Look, we don't absolutely need the P5. If UConn can put kids in the NFL, then kids will commit. UConn will win games. UConn will win conference championships. UConn will eventually make the playoffs. More fans will come every year. If enough other members of the American do the same thing, in 10-20 years the AAC could be mentioned in the same breath as the SEC or B1G.

At the same time, it would be really convenient to be in the B1G or the ACC right now. On the other hand, what if the ACC ends up in the G5 in 15 years?

Congratulations
You have just won the AZHuskiePop award for either
Your great Fishyesque use of sarcasm
Or
The coveted HFD award for the most creative use of undue optimism

 

[CAHUSKY]

Gotta love the UConn's not even in the conversation here when it comes to expansion... But should be (and would have been). Honestly, if I'm the Big XII right now I'm getting BYU and Boise State in first. Get back to 12, then look at adding in Cincy and UConn based purely off of academics, history, and geographic/media market presence. You get the NYC DMA with UConn. Who else can say that?

Boise is literally one of the worst academic schools in the country and was seriously a junior college not too long ago. They have absolutely no television market, a small stadium and are located in a rural location with no corporate support. They have had a good run of football success using players that no PAC-12 team could admit. They are an absolute train wreck and there is no way they end up in a p5