B1G

[CTMike]

I just want to nudge this baby closer to 2K posts...

 

[specialisthusky]

I just want to nudge this baby closer to 2K posts...

HFD for 2k....take it away Dan.

 

[NickyNewark]

So, you don't even realize the Big East started in the early 1980s? That's when UConn had winning records. Look up it's first years in the BE. The first 4. The F8 and Sweet 16s were in the previous couple decades. Yeah, UConn wasn't a national team then. Neither was Rutgers. The point is, UConn had a fanbase back then, and that's what we're talking about. Nice attempt trying to twist things. You guys still don't have a fanbase--as the B1G is about to find out.

In fact, the biggest thing that will harm UConn with the B1G is how bad Rutgers is about to suck in that conference.

Heck,started up the BE?That's relatively recent, I remember the ECAC and when most BB school's were independent IIRC!!RU will only suck if the reffing is how I hear it is...RU IMO is as good as most of the school's already outside the upper tier!

 

[GopherHawk]

BU doesn't have football, and won't be bringing it back. They do have soccer!

If there was a feeling the Boston market could be tapped. The question would be, "What would take more time and money. Making a school AAU worthy or creating Football and BB programs that can compete?"

My answer would be you could make football and BB programs competitive in 5-7 years for $500M in stadiums/coaching. It might take longer and more $$$'s to make a school AAU worthy.

Delany has said the B1G is trying to be in position for the next 50+ years. That statement is good for UCONN. That means more additions can be made on potential.

 

[GopherHawk]

My comment about Boston U is just that they would be just as feasible as BC.

 

[upstater]

If there was a feeling the Boston market could be tapped. The question would be, "What would take more time and money. Making a school AAU worthy or creating Football and BB programs that can compete?"

My answer would be you could make football and BB programs competitive in 5-7 years for $500M in stadiums/coaching. It might take longer and more $'s to make a school AAU worthy.

Delany has said the B1G is trying to be in position for the next 50+ years. That statement is good for UCONN. That means more additions can be made on potential.

The money spent on the education side dwarfs entertainment. The multipliers on the education side are huge, esp. in terms of private companies, but also having sustainable jobs for highly trained professionals.

With a football stadium in some of these college towns, the local areas only see people roll in 7 weekends during the entire year. The gain is negligible compared to having employees living in town.

 

[Dann]

i have said it many times. bc is trying to get into the b10 offering the following
bc all sports +bu(aau and puck)

-grabs boston
-cic wit bu aau
-kills HE and B1G puck ecomes the show
- with nd some more towads a long term 20 team league.

 

[upstater]

My comment about Boston U is just that they would be just as feasible as BC.

Could is operative though. They are not bringing back football ever. I'd venture to say that as a much bigger school, BU would make MORE sense than BC, BECAUSE it is an AAU school. But schools like NYU, U Chicago, Boston U, Washington U, made their decisions a long time ago, and they didn't suffer for getting out of the high stakes game.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

BU does make more sense than BC in comparison to the type of schools in the B1G a very large (30K+) urban non-religious school with lots of money, large graduate programs, enormous research dollars, outstanding academic reputation. But the enormous problem is there is no football team, and there 100% absolutely, positively, no doubt about it, will not be one at any point in the next 20 years at least. First of all, and most importantly, there's simply no room for a stadium anywhere on or near campus. The administration does not support bringing it back - I do have "insider" knowledge of those thought processes.

The only way BU sniffs the B1G is as an affiliate hockey program paired with BC. If BC does get a B1G invite, don't be surprised to see it happen, the Michigans, Minnesota, and Wisconsin would want two to keep an even number of schools, and BC wouldn't want to be on an island. Both were invited to the new NCHC conference formed this year, but quickly rejected. As much as it would suck as a fan of both programs, they'd accept the B1G bid if BC got the all sports invite and this was proposed.

 

[B1GALUM]

i have said it many times. bc is trying to get into the b10 offering the following
bc all sports +bu(aau and puck)

-grabs boston
-cic wit bu aau
-kills HE and B1G puck ecomes the show
- with nd some more towads a long term 20 team league.

The idea of a long term 20 team B1G is an interesting one and Gee mentioned it as a possibility. The question is how you set up the conference: two divisions or four pods. The problem with a division set up is that one member of the pre-PSU B1G would have to go east. The most common scenario I have seen mentioned is having PSU go to a B1G east, which I suspect they would welcome, along with OSU. The question then becomes does OSU want to give up all these historical rivalries aside from Michigan. OSU would play Michigan in a cross over and PSU in division but no other historical B1G teams since the rest of a B1G east division would be composed of former Big East and ACC teams.

 

[SectionKK]

My comment about Boston U is just that they would be just as feasible as BC.

How is it that BU would be just as feasible as BC when BU has no football team? Are you talking about academic profile? Sure, BC isn't an AAU school, but that isn't really the kind of school it's trying to be. ND (very similar school to BC) isn't AAU and B1G would accept them in a heartbeat. I'm pretty sure academics wouldn't prevent BC (#31 USNWR) or ND (#17 USNWR) from being admitted to any conference. (By the way, BU is #51.)

 

[The Funster]

I would love to see a Rutgers/UConn rivalry grow in the B1G. S strong rivalry coupled with a rotation of B1G teams would capture the tristate area and make strong inroads through out New England.

I get why BC would be broached as a UConn partner but what have they done in the ACC? They have done nothing but regress athletically. I'm sure by now the ACC knows what we knew: that BC draws flies and is often ignored in the Boston market. One thing you can say about BC is that getting rid of DeFilippo can only be a step in the right direction. It may take a while though. First you have to bring a halt to the negative momentum, get the ship turned around and then start it going in the right direction. No small feat.

 

[Dann]

The idea of a long term 20 team B1G is an interesting one and Gee mentioned it as a possibility. The question is how you set up the conference: two divisions or four pods. The problem with a division set up is that one member of the pre-PSU B1G would have to go east. The most common scenario I have seen mentioned is having PSU go to a B1G east, which I suspect they would welcome, along with OSU. The question then becomes does OSU want to give up all these historical rivalries aside from Michigan. OSU would play Michigan in a cross over and PSU in division but no other historical B1G teams since the rest of a B1G east division would be composed of former Big East and ACC teams.

The 20 team b1g is very interesting. It's the same as the 20 team PAC but we don't hear about it much. What makes it possible is the network. The best football games will always be sold at a higher tier. But the network needs bottom games in football and then inventory in all other sports. The revolution in sports right now is soccer is here to stay and slowly growing. Eventually college soccer is going to become the minors and a small draw both on campuses and on tv. That's a lot of good fall inventory for week days. Baseball right now has expanded to much. The minors are to populated. It will be drawn back a bit but not much. The minors besides local followings in city's don't have pride factor or any emotional attachment to fans. College baseball is building a hard core base who like clean pure baseball and its school pride factor will help it build. Softball is like the next girls bball. It's a major women's draw in a sport watchable to women and older ppl. Sports like puck and lax also feed fan draws. Those are all inventory monsters and revenue streams long term for a conference network.

The b1g is at the front of all of this. JD knows it all and he's making moves. Having sac members is not a bad thing when you have long term goals. Hopkins in lax is a great example. They are in a good spot for life now. They have no say but it doesn't matter. Ppl here are to caught up with what the big east was. That was a mess. Different ball game then bball schools.

The biggest piece is all of this was Syracuse making the worst decision ever. They should have gone the Pitt public route and became New York flagship at Cuse. That would have either helped them keep there AAU tag or re-earned it quickly thru state help. They screwed the pooch.

The b1g has several ways it can go and it's not to late for Cuse either really. The big can go west and get Mizzu, Kansas, ok and Texas and then finish off east with 2 more. That's a hard route because while Mizzu and Kansas are possible, Texas and ok are tuff gets. The big could go east. They could get bc, uconn, Cuse and UVA. The look at UNC before grabbing 2 west schools. Cuse not going public really screws this. Imagine a public New York at Cuse with AAU status to go with UVA and bc/bu. bu for AAU/cic and puck. Now uconn is the Nebraska of the east. Uconn will eventually be AAU...Nebraska will work hard to regain it I imagine.

PSU is clearly a east school and tosu has been pretty out front with going east also. Depending on who you land and how to balance you move the Michigan schools one way or another.

Based on how the b1g did the division with 14, I tend to lean and think the west lacks a lot and its obvious. So I think they are tipping hand. I think they have eyes on a couple east schools to finish off the 20 but they are really being aggressive with the 4 west schools. How even is this?

Texas, ok, Kan, Mizzu, Neb, wisc, minn, I'll, NW, Iowa
Mich, MSU, ind, pur, tosu, PSU, md, Ruty, UVA, uconn

That's a lot more balanced now huh?

Cuse screwed themselves. They also screwed bc with that move. They decided that playing wake, duke and nd was more important long term. They basically just threw in the fball towel and said bball is first. Private school 4 life type mind set.

In the b1g above, soccer is a top conference. Baseball is a top conference. Bball is arguably number 1. Kansas, uconn, ind and MSU are 4 top 10 schools all time. Baseball is a top conference. Softball is top. Lax is up there. And so on. A ton of inventory. Huge east coast markets are surrounded, not touched. Texas recruiting for the west and mid atlantic recruiting for the east. Fertile.

It forces the sec to act and counter and the only way for them to is to pick up 2nd best in the b12 land or a couple acc schools. It's a big win for the b1g. No doubt about it. I picture the sec adding UNC, NCST, Clem, gtech, FSU, wvu and VTech. That's a great league and the big vs the sec is better for it. It covers territory real well for the sec but it isn't the best market wise. They don't gain a lot. What they do gain is cable boxes at a high pay because of product penetration so the money will be there.

It's a north vs south war. It leaves the PAC having to either join and go big, or risk a 40team perception break away where they are above everyone else. I imagine USC and Oregon won't like that and I imagine its time for the PAC at this point to put down the high horse academic stuff. They have wash st and az st types. Grow a pair and go for it.
Original 10 + Utah, colo, BYU, BSU, IST, KST, OKST, TTech, UNLV, UNR or your pick.

Now a 4th needs to be built around the acc. 10 privates and 10 publics basically each division.
Bc, nd, wake, duke, Miami, bay, TCU, SMU, Tulsa, tul
Pitt, temple, USF, UCF, ecu, Cincy, Mem, Lville, uh, smiss

The Mwc will do the same and then what's left is a expanded Mac and a sunbelt/Cusa merger. There is your 120 team mess.

The big has to lead the pack because it can work for them. Others will follow and the game will be changed for ever.

 

[B1GALUM]

Based on how the b1g did the division with 14, I tend to lean and think the west lacks a lot and its obvious. So I think they are tipping hand. I think they have eyes on a couple east schools to finish off the 20 but they are really being aggressive with the 4 west schools. How even is this?

Texas, ok, Kan, Mizzu, Neb, wisc, minn, I'll, NW, Iowa
Mich, MSU, ind, pur, tosu, PSU, md, Ruty, UVA, uconn

That's a lot more balanced now huh?

Absolutely it is. It provides a more even distribution of maintaining historical B1G rivalries while permitting new regional rivalries to develop and access to prime recruiting grounds for members of each division.

 

[upstater]

The only way BU sniffs the B1G is as an affiliate hockey program paired with BC. If BC does get a B1G invite, don't be surprised to see it happen, the Michigans, Minnesota, and Wisconsin would want two to keep an even number of schools, and BC wouldn't want to be on an island. Both were invited to the new NCHC conference formed this year, but quickly rejected. As much as it would suck as a fan of both programs, they'd accept the B1G bid if BC got the all sports invite and this was proposed.

Why would BU accept?

 

[upstater]

How is it that BU would be just as feasible as BC when BU has no football team? Are you talking about academic profile? Sure, BC isn't an AAU school, but that isn't really the kind of school it's trying to be. ND (very similar school to BC) isn't AAU and B1G would accept them in a heartbeat. I'm pretty sure academics wouldn't prevent BC (#31 USNWR) or ND (#17 USNWR) from being admitted to any conference. (By the way, BU is #51.)

Did you just compare BC to ND?

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

Why would BU accept?

Because BC would obviously take the B1G all sports admission, meaning their hockey team would go too, this would deplete HE. ND would likely go NCHC if BC left (assuming they stay ACC) as well, leaving a very, very depleted HE. Thus, if BU were offered a spot as an affiliate hockey member, it would keep them playing against the highest level of competition, specifically, in the best conference in the country by a country mile. It'd be a sad day for the sport and eastern hockey in general, but if it was offered, they'd take it.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

How is it that BU would be just as feasible as BC when BU has no football team? Are you talking about academic profile? Sure, BC isn't an AAU school, but that isn't really the kind of school it's trying to be. ND (very similar school to BC) isn't AAU and B1G would accept them in a heartbeat. I'm pretty sure academics wouldn't prevent BC (#31 USNWR) or ND (#17 USNWR) from being admitted to any conference. (By the way, BU is #51.)

BU isn't feasible. The argument is the profile of BU, sans the glaring hole of no football program, is more consistent with B1G schools than the profile of BC. That's not saying one school is better than the other, they're just very different in their attributes.

 

[Dann]

bc going with bu was very much in play. csue killed it or them. cuse had to be a pieceof that move east. they are acc schools for life now and must hope the acc survives.

the big has its eyes on tex/ok/kan/mizzu/uva/unc/gt/uconn/ny/tor

 

[pj]

BC is totally not a fit for the B1G. How bringing along BU for hockey makes BC more attractive is mysterious. The B1G would still be stuck with a non-research, non-AAU, non-public, non-popular school with a 40k stadium that has no parking, no tailgating, and can't be expanded, and is despised by its neighbors. And the sports teams suck, except hockey.

 

[specialisthusky]

Now a 4th needs to be built around the acc. 10 privates and 10 publics basically each division.
Bc, nd, wake, duke, Miami, bay, TCU, SMU, Tulsa, tul
Pitt, temple, USF, UCF, ecu, Cincy, Mem, Lville, uh, smiss

The Mwc will do the same and then what's left is a expanded Mac and a sunbelt/Cusa merger. There is your 120 team mess.

The big has to lead the pack because it can work for them. Others will follow and the game will be changed for ever.

I want to slash with you.. I think if the Big goes to twenty...

East
1) psu/umd/uva/ru/uconn
2) mich/msu/ind/purd/osu
West
1)Ill/nw/Wisc/Minny/Iowa
2) Tex/Neb/Ok/Kansas/Miz

the sec will counter to 20...

East
1) UF/UGA/USC/UNC/(duke or NC ST)
2) Ky/Tenn/Vandy/WVU/VaTech
West
1) Aub/Bama/Ole Miss/ Miss St/ LSU
2) aTm/Ark/OkSt/Kst/Baylor

At this point I still don't see a way the PAC expands geographically and instead looks for a 24 team leage/partnership with the remaining ACC

Pacific
1) Wash/WSU/Ore/OSU/Cal/Stan
2)UCLA/USC/ASU/AZ/Col/Utah
Atalantic
1)FSU/UM/Clem/Georgia Tech/Wake/(NC State/Duke)
2) BC/Cuse/Pitt/Louisville/Cinci/Iowa St

It gets a bit messy at the end of the 2nd division in the Atlantic with ISU. That could easily be changed to someone like a Temple.

If the whole super conference thing is going to play out I don't see the PAC remaining a West Coast Conference. They will have to jeopardize their academic integrity greatly to achieve that. Basically this is my alternative to your Private v. Public Conference. Mine would be an East v. West.

To round it up you'd have a 4th continental conf
West
1) Boise/BYU/Unlv/SDSU/Col St
2) Tex Tech/ TCU/ Houston/ SMU/Tulsa
East
1) Temple/UB/Navy/ECU/Umass
2) USF/UCF/Memphis/Tulane/Southern Miss or someone else.

This set up has everyone from the Power 5, AAC and the good teams in the MWC plus a few geographically advantageous teams like Umass and UB.

believe it or not I have not been drinking yet...

 

[B1GALUM]

BC is totally not a fit for the B1G. How bringing along BU for hockey makes BC more attractive is mysterious. The B1G would still be stuck with a non-research, non-AAU, non-public, non-popular school with a 40k stadium that has no parking, no tailgating, and can't be expanded, and is despised by its neighbors. And the sports teams suck, except hockey.

Agree. For full B1G membership, a private school would have to be research oriented with AAU membership in the mold of Northwestern. The only exception the B1G would make is for Notre Dame.

 

[Dann]

BC is totally not a fit for the B1G. How bringing along BU for hockey makes BC more attractive is mysterious. The B1G would still be stuck with a non-research, non-AAU, non-public, non-popular school with a 40k stadium that has no parking, no tailgating, and can't be expanded, and is despised by its neighbors. And the sports teams suck, except hockey.

bu s public, big an aau. t fills in the bad parts of b and together they make a nice fi for the b10. hey bring 2 puck team which kills theb10 biggestcompetition(he)

those 2 puck teams, dot laugh turn on the boson market alon cable bo wise.bingo for the b10N. moot cause now because cuse made the dcision for them ad bc that theacc was alwaysgoing to live in some sort of privte school way...

I want to slash with you.. I think if the Big goes to twenty...
its fun to slash right? its entertainment...ppl here have been missing out
East
1) psu/umd/uva/ru/uconn
2) mich/msu/ind/purd/osu
West
1)Ill/nw/Wisc/Minny/Iowa
2) Tex/Neb/Ok/Kansas/Miz
i lke divisions no pods but its overall is a home run. the reason i like divisions is #1 "B1G East" and #2 because each division could earn a future bcs bid to 8 team playoff. 4 20 team conf with each division getting a bid...

the sec will counter to 20...

East
1) UF/UGA/USC/UNC/(duke or NC ST) easily ncst. politics wise theyare public. duke hangs out with acc privates.
2) Ky/Tenn/Vandy/WVU/VaTech
West
1) Aub/Bama/Ole Miss/ Miss St/ LSU
2) aTm/Ark/OkSt/Kst/Baylor thisis interesting. i see what you did and i thik its very possible. i ould argue against baylor over a west txas(tt) or a iowa st type.

At this point I still don't see a way the PAC expands geographically and instead looks for a 24 team leage/partnership with the remaining ACC

Pacific
1) Wash/WSU/Ore/OSU/Cal/Stan
2)UCLA/USC/ASU/AZ/Col/Utah
Atalantic
1)FSU/UM/Clem/Georgia Tech/Wake/(NC State/Duke)
2) BC/Cuse/Pitt/Louisville/Cinci/Iowa St
wild, i like it. but way to many geography and identity mishmoshes. i try to keep themes and i usually works.
It gets a bit messy at the end of the 2nd division in the Atlantic with ISU. That could easily be changed to someone like a Temple.

If the whole super conference thing is going to play out I don't see the PAC remaining a West Coast Conference. They will have to jeopardize their academic integrity greatly to achieve that. Basically this is my alternative to your Private v. Public Conference. Mine would be an East v. West.
so far i have wached the b10 add nebraska, the acc add lville an the b12 at wvu. the se added good scools. complete 180s. the pac sooner r later will have to swallow and add. byu and bsu types will not be left out of a 4x80
To round it up you'd have a 4th continental conf
West
1) Boise/BYU/Unlv/SDSU/Col St
2) Tex Tech/ TCU/ Houston/ SMU/Tulsa
East
1) Temple/UB/Navy/ECU/Umass
2) USF/UCF/Memphis/Tulane/Southern Miss or someone else.

This set up has everyone from the Power 5, AAC and the good teams in the MWC plus a few geographically advantageous teams like Umass and UB.

believe it or not I have not been drinking yet...

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

bu s public, big an aau. t fills in the bad parts of b and together they make a nice fi for the b10. hey bring 2 puck team which kills theb10 biggestcompetition(he)

those 2 puck teams, dot laugh turn on the boson market alon cable bo wise.bingo for the b10N. moot cause now because cuse made the dcision for them ad bc that theacc was alwaysgoing to live in some sort of privte school way...

BU is most definitely not public.

 

[Dann]

BU is most definitely not public.

yup not sure how i confused that. anyway aau and big "private". big being he key word students wise....

te ship sailed with cuse anyway. the point was bu goign aau opened the door for the 2 to move if a hug power grab o the north east were to happen.its not. focus elsewhere.